For those who think the US Government killed JFK, - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

MSD · 11-22-2003, 06:22 PM

A recent poll shows that an overwhelming majority of American citizens believe that there is some sort of coverup of who really killed JFK, yet when I ask those same people why the government would kill him, they look at me blankly, or give me some dumb answer like, "They didn't want him to be president ..."

So, for those of you who think that it wasn't just a lone gunman, do you know why the CIA (or wwhatever gov't agency) would have wanted him dead? If everyone gives a few facts, maybe we'll all be able to add to our knowledge base and have a more convincing argument when we say that we don't think the official version of the story is the truth.

lordjeebus · 11-22-2003, 06:31 PM

I've been thinking about this today since I watched a lot of those History Channel documentaries this afternoon about it.

I have trouble coming up with an explanation that would justify the assassination and such a wide cover-up.

Perhaps:

1. Kennedy intended a massive overhaul of the CIA or FBI or whatever to rid it of corruption and prosecute a lot of powerful people for their abuses of power.

2. Kennedy had plans to do something that the CIA genuinely believed could lead to nuclear war and they were unable to talk him out of it.

3. Perhaps it was a plan by Richard Nixon to eventually gain the presidency. I think he had a lot of CIA and other government connections (and he had been vice president). I think in any event he had something to do with it (but didn't everyone) considering that he claimed not to remember where he was when it happened.

EDIT: 4. #3 could probably apply to LBJ also. Or perhaps LBJ and Nixon got together for mutual benefit.

EDIT #2: I think rogue's post in this thread makes a lot of sense: http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...threadid=36705

Mojo_PeiPei · 11-22-2003, 08:53 PM

I heard a theory that the Israeli's might've done it because he wanted to cut the aid that they recieved, definetly plausible

Nefir · 11-22-2003, 09:00 PM

I believe it was the Soviets, who managed to find supporters in the US to organize JFK's killing. They had the means, the motives, and past precedents of political assassinations. JFK stepped on their shoes, and paid the price.

hu-man · 11-24-2003, 02:57 AM

I did it.

JoenOcoee · 11-24-2003, 03:32 AM

I'm not so sure that it would be such a huge cover-up. The Kennedy's were REALLY fucking powerful AND young. They could have an extremely long lasting run in Washington that would take power away from lots of groups. Which leads me to believe that a small group could kill him and everyone else would just look the other way. I don't think JFK had a lot of enemies OR allies.

But no matter what that can be proved or disproved, I will always be a firm believer of at least 2 shooters. No way did Oswald get a shot like that off with magic physics defying bullets.

And on the Russians...I think eventually it would have come out like everything else did after the fall of communism. I mean they admitted they have Hitler's jaw and skull pieces. Someone would have talked.

xim · 11-24-2003, 02:46 PM

This is my first post here at tilted forums so herrr goes.

I think I read Kennedy had a plan going to kickstart the end of the vietnam war which displeased a lot of big cheezes.

It is possible that it is was communist powered but I think the only evidence for that is "Oswald's" "ties" to russia. My problems with this are numerous. For one, for about a week before the assasination Oswald was spotted around dallas spitting very blatantly communist remarks and being generally hateful. It is my beleif that even if he was going to do something like kill JFK (and we all know that if he was a shooter at all, he was only one of them) he would be slightly more low brow. It seems like someone was trying to build him up to have a bad name. In fact the descriptions of the different hateful communist Oswalds range so much one would think that there were multiple people using his name, at which point it becomes questionable what Oswalds politics even were, let alone wheather they fueled the action. It is my position that LHO couldnt possibly been the shooter and therefore no matter how much *somebody* built him up to be a dirty communist scumbag and a scapegoat, his politics are irrelevant

If anyone has ever read the Illuminatus Trilogy, it cleverly shows the assasination as having 5 different shooters all working for different people all with different politics, some of them double or triple agents working for more than one organization. I dont think its supposed to be historicly accurate (as i think John Dillenger turned out to be the fatal shooter) but it is a good illustrative of how there is SO MUCH politics going on that we dont even know about. Probability is high that our facts are so distorted and limited that while were trying to pick out the correct spider web to express the situation, the situation can only be expressed in terms as huge as the web of servers that make up the internet. Multiple governments, hundreds of organizations (heard of and not) and thousands of people.

BTW I live in Dallas :P

paddyjoe · 11-27-2003, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by hu-man
I did it.

you bastard!!!

Journeyman · 11-27-2003, 05:13 PM

When every single US president to date is a WASP *except* for an Irish Catholic, it feels good to know that the only diversity in the top job of the nation was with a guy who shares your heritage.

Because of this, I'm simply upset at the fact that 5 years of presidency (who's he gonna lose to in 64?!) were taken away from the one guy who broke the homogeny, and my feelings increase exponentially by the idea that someone got away with it. I don't care who, but with all the oddities surrounding the situation, it doesn't look like LHO was alone.

As for who I think would have done it and under what motive, the only theory I ever gave credit to is Castro, which I base on the number of times we've tried to hit him. But apparently there's some new evidence coming out that points to a tentative behind-the-scenes relationship between Kennedy and Castro in the spirit of peace and cooperation. I dunno how credible that is, though, but if so... kinda takes away his motive.

rev_skarekroe · 12-05-2003, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by xim
This is my first post here at tilted forums so herrr goes.

I think I read Kennedy had a plan going to kickstart the end of the vietnam war which displeased a lot of big cheezes.

america wasn't involved in vietnam at that point in time, unless i'm very much mistaken.

Quote:

(as i think John Dillenger turned out to be the fatal shooter)

i remember it turning out to be some nobody with the initials H.C. i could be wrong.
sk

vicx · 12-06-2003, 12:50 AM

I've been a staunch beleiver ever since I understood the magic bullet theory, but that Peter jennings expose witht he computer generated models explained that pretty clearly, and it no longer seems like a magic bullet to me.

The speed at which the three shots were fired are something of a mystery though. How the hell is someone able to fire an old mannlicher bolt-action so quickly. It just doesn't seem possible, especiallyif you watch the Zapruder film and time it out. I remember reading that they got a specialist and sharpshooter to try to shoot three shots as quickly as LHO did, with an identical rifle, and it was impossible to do at that speed, much less with any accuracy whatsoever. LHO was good, but he wasn't impervious to the laws of physics, nor was he a superman.

ANyways I beleive there was another shooter to this day thanks to that little bit of info about the timing of the shots. Anyone have any feelings about this in particular?

thingstodo · 12-07-2003, 04:01 PM

I think the JFK group got help from the Mafia to get elected and then blew them off later because they didn't want the public connection the boys were asking for.

Bookman · 12-08-2003, 07:36 AM

I read that he was looking @ the wrong country's/state's Nuclear reactors.

geodaro · 12-08-2003, 08:38 AM

I think he was killed because he liked football and kept playing it in his front yard even though the neighbors told him to quit making so much noise. My neighbor threatened me with the same action of I didn't stop playing my drums. Maybe the government should look into him!

Gortexfogg · 12-09-2003, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rev_skarekroe
america wasn't involved in vietnam at that point in time, unless i'm very much mistaken.

In the early 1950s (53 or 54 I believe), Eisenhower began devoting money and troops to the conflict. It was pretty low key back then and escalated over the years to the full fledged US led war.

thingstodo · 12-10-2003, 04:25 AM

Wasn't that Mel Gibson movie of a year or two ago about the first actual full scale conflict over there that started things? I think the title was We We Soldiers or something like that.

Looks like we've managed to twist this around to something new!

fastom · 12-24-2003, 12:57 PM

It'd be nice to have a clear DVD of the Zapruder tape that hasn't been altered. The one i saw on TV was as the tires on the car didn't turn at a consistant rate. (looking at the valve stems)

Gertie · 12-26-2003, 01:04 AM

Some say it was Sam Giancana because Kennedy was boffing Judith Exner. Who knows? I'm convinced that Oswald did not act alone.

hundred-peons · 12-27-2003, 06:30 AM

Quite a few reasons...

Catholic president in a modern day Clinton-Lewinski scandal.

Marilynn Monroe, JFK and Bobby Kennedy were in a sort of sick incest love triangle.

She turns up mysteriously dead and allegedly pregnant, soon after they do as well.

The people that immediately had motive were LBJ +Jackie O.

LBJ gets the presidency by default. Jackie O now widow, marries a multi-millionaire shipping magnate, Aristotle Onassis.(who it's believed she had affairs with while JFK was still alive)

Do research on Marilynn's suicide, and JFK's murder.

Lee Harvey Oswald was nothing more than a fall guy, what better way to keep a secret than to offer a fall guy, then have the fall guy suddenly die too.

11-22-2003, 06:22 PM	#1 (permalink)
MSD The sky calls to us ... Super Moderator Location: CT	For those who think the US Government killed JFK, A recent poll shows that an overwhelming majority of American citizens believe that there is some sort of coverup of who really killed JFK, yet when I ask those same people why the government would kill him, they look at me blankly, or give me some dumb answer like, "They didn't want him to be president ..." So, for those of you who think that it wasn't just a lone gunman, do you know why the CIA (or wwhatever gov't agency) would have wanted him dead? If everyone gives a few facts, maybe we'll all be able to add to our knowledge base and have a more convincing argument when we say that we don't think the official version of the story is the truth.

11-22-2003, 06:31 PM	#2 (permalink)
lordjeebus ‚±‚Ìˆó˜U‚ª–Ú‚É“ü‚ç‚Ê‚© Location: College	I've been thinking about this today since I watched a lot of those History Channel documentaries this afternoon about it. I have trouble coming up with an explanation that would justify the assassination and such a wide cover-up. Perhaps: 1. Kennedy intended a massive overhaul of the CIA or FBI or whatever to rid it of corruption and prosecute a lot of powerful people for their abuses of power. 2. Kennedy had plans to do something that the CIA genuinely believed could lead to nuclear war and they were unable to talk him out of it. 3. Perhaps it was a plan by Richard Nixon to eventually gain the presidency. I think he had a lot of CIA and other government connections (and he had been vice president). I think in any event he had something to do with it (but didn't everyone) considering that he claimed not to remember where he was when it happened. EDIT: 4. #3 could probably apply to LBJ also. Or perhaps LBJ and Nixon got together for mutual benefit. EDIT #2: I think rogue's post in this thread makes a lot of sense: http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...threadid=36705 Last edited by lordjeebus; 11-22-2003 at 06:51 PM..

11-22-2003, 08:53 PM	#3 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	I heard a theory that the Israeli's might've done it because he wanted to cut the aid that they recieved, definetly plausible __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition.

11-22-2003, 09:00 PM	#4 (permalink)
Nefir Junkie Location: Louisville, KY	I believe it was the Soviets, who managed to find supporters in the US to organize JFK's killing. They had the means, the motives, and past precedents of political assassinations. JFK stepped on their shoes, and paid the price. __________________ You do not use a Macintosh, instead you use a Tandy Kompressor break your glowstick, Kompressor eat your candy Kompressor open jaws, Kompressor release ants Kompressor watch you scream, Because Kompressor does not dance

11-24-2003, 03:32 AM	#6 (permalink)
JoenOcoee Tilted Location: Athens, Georgia classic city my ass....	I'm not so sure that it would be such a huge cover-up. The Kennedy's were REALLY fucking powerful AND young. They could have an extremely long lasting run in Washington that would take power away from lots of groups. Which leads me to believe that a small group could kill him and everyone else would just look the other way. I don't think JFK had a lot of enemies OR allies. But no matter what that can be proved or disproved, I will always be a firm believer of at least 2 shooters. No way did Oswald get a shot like that off with magic physics defying bullets. And on the Russians...I think eventually it would have come out like everything else did after the fall of communism. I mean they admitted they have Hitler's jaw and skull pieces. Someone would have talked. __________________ Remember kiddies, panic attacks can be fatal

11-24-2003, 02:57 AM	#5 (permalink)
hu-man The one that got away Location: Over the hill and far away	I did it.

11-24-2003, 02:46 PM	#7 (permalink)
xim Insane Location: One with the Universe	This is my first post here at tilted forums so herrr goes. I think I read Kennedy had a plan going to kickstart the end of the vietnam war which displeased a lot of big cheezes. It is possible that it is was communist powered but I think the only evidence for that is "Oswald's" "ties" to russia. My problems with this are numerous. For one, for about a week before the assasination Oswald was spotted around dallas spitting very blatantly communist remarks and being generally hateful. It is my beleif that even if he was going to do something like kill JFK (and we all know that if he was a shooter at all, he was only one of them) he would be slightly more low brow. It seems like someone was trying to build him up to have a bad name. In fact the descriptions of the different hateful communist Oswalds range so much one would think that there were multiple people using his name, at which point it becomes questionable what Oswalds politics even were, let alone wheather they fueled the action. It is my position that LHO couldnt possibly been the shooter and therefore no matter how much somebody built him up to be a dirty communist scumbag and a scapegoat, his politics are irrelevant If anyone has ever read the Illuminatus Trilogy, it cleverly shows the assasination as having 5 different shooters all working for different people all with different politics, some of them double or triple agents working for more than one organization. I dont think its supposed to be historicly accurate (as i think John Dillenger turned out to be the fatal shooter) but it is a good illustrative of how there is SO MUCH politics going on that we dont even know about. Probability is high that our facts are so distorted and limited that while were trying to pick out the correct spider web to express the situation, the situation can only be expressed in terms as huge as the web of servers that make up the internet. Multiple governments, hundreds of organizations (heard of and not) and thousands of people. BTW I live in Dallas :P __________________ If I could be anyone in the world I would be Britney Spears. Shes in so many commercials about pepsi... www.ximcity.com Last edited by xim; 11-24-2003 at 05:07 PM..

11-27-2003, 05:13 PM	#9 (permalink)
Journeyman Like John Goodman, but not. Location: SFBA, California	When every single US president to date is a WASP except for an Irish Catholic, it feels good to know that the only diversity in the top job of the nation was with a guy who shares your heritage. Because of this, I'm simply upset at the fact that 5 years of presidency (who's he gonna lose to in 64?!) were taken away from the one guy who broke the homogeny, and my feelings increase exponentially by the idea that someone got away with it. I don't care who, but with all the oddities surrounding the situation, it doesn't look like LHO was alone. As for who I think would have done it and under what motive, the only theory I ever gave credit to is Castro, which I base on the number of times we've tried to hit him. But apparently there's some new evidence coming out that points to a tentative behind-the-scenes relationship between Kennedy and Castro in the spirit of peace and cooperation. I dunno how credible that is, though, but if so... kinda takes away his motive.

12-06-2003, 12:50 AM	#11 (permalink)
vicx Insane	I've been a staunch beleiver ever since I understood the magic bullet theory, but that Peter jennings expose witht he computer generated models explained that pretty clearly, and it no longer seems like a magic bullet to me. The speed at which the three shots were fired are something of a mystery though. How the hell is someone able to fire an old mannlicher bolt-action so quickly. It just doesn't seem possible, especiallyif you watch the Zapruder film and time it out. I remember reading that they got a specialist and sharpshooter to try to shoot three shots as quickly as LHO did, with an identical rifle, and it was impossible to do at that speed, much less with any accuracy whatsoever. LHO was good, but he wasn't impervious to the laws of physics, nor was he a superman. ANyways I beleive there was another shooter to this day thanks to that little bit of info about the timing of the shots. Anyone have any feelings about this in particular? __________________ Foolish man give wife grand piano. Wise man give wife upright organ.

12-07-2003, 04:01 PM	#12 (permalink)
thingstodo A Storm Is Coming Location: The Great White North	I think the JFK group got help from the Mafia to get elected and then blew them off later because they didn't want the public connection the boys were asking for. __________________ If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves. Stangers have the best candy.

12-08-2003, 07:36 AM	#13 (permalink)
Bookman Insane	I read that he was looking @ the wrong country's/state's Nuclear reactors.

12-08-2003, 08:38 AM	#14 (permalink)
geodaro Psycho	I think he was killed because he liked football and kept playing it in his front yard even though the neighbors told him to quit making so much noise. My neighbor threatened me with the same action of I didn't stop playing my drums. Maybe the government should look into him!

12-10-2003, 04:25 AM	#16 (permalink)
thingstodo A Storm Is Coming Location: The Great White North	Wasn't that Mel Gibson movie of a year or two ago about the first actual full scale conflict over there that started things? I think the title was We We Soldiers or something like that. Looks like we've managed to twist this around to something new! __________________ If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves. Stangers have the best candy.

12-24-2003, 12:57 PM	#17 (permalink)
fastom Psycho Location: way out west	It'd be nice to have a clear DVD of the Zapruder tape that hasn't been altered. The one i saw on TV was as the tires on the car didn't turn at a consistant rate. (looking at the valve stems)

12-26-2003, 01:04 AM	#18 (permalink)
Gertie Psycho	Some say it was Sam Giancana because Kennedy was boffing Judith Exner. Who knows? I'm convinced that Oswald did not act alone.

12-27-2003, 06:30 AM	#19 (permalink)
hundred-peons Upright	Quite a few reasons... Catholic president in a modern day Clinton-Lewinski scandal. Marilynn Monroe, JFK and Bobby Kennedy were in a sort of sick incest love triangle. She turns up mysteriously dead and allegedly pregnant, soon after they do as well. The people that immediately had motive were LBJ +Jackie O. LBJ gets the presidency by default. Jackie O now widow, marries a multi-millionaire shipping magnate, Aristotle Onassis.(who it's believed she had affairs with while JFK was still alive) Do research on Marilynn's suicide, and JFK's murder. Lee Harvey Oswald was nothing more than a fall guy, what better way to keep a secret than to offer a fall guy, then have the fall guy suddenly die too.