Wow I read this story a long time ago, it's cool to see that a lot of other people found it as interesting as I did. I don't believe it, but I have to admit it was a very unnerving thing to read. If something like that would ever happen, now or 100 years from now, it would be terrible.

I told a bunch of people about the site, and some of them actually think some of it is real.

Because $$$ they got the money and the man power to fuck up and not care about the first or fiftyth guy they send there that doesnt come back, also they are leading in a lot of computing stuff, or were a few years back, they could be closer then WE know :S

the thing that pisses me off is that there no NO EXACT DATES to anything with these guys.. they say civil war in 2004, why the hell dont thay say that North Calgary is going to go into a civil war with south Calgary to take over the oil business and thus control alberta in such a such way. they are always very vuage so as soon as anything remotely similar happens people jump and support it.

This was proved wrong a long time ago.

His story came from some "do it yourself" pen & paper RPG made back in 1981 that had to do with time travel.

I can't believe the guy got this many people actually question whether or not he's telling the truth :lol:

hey stompy i dont think its real but could you please go more in depth to what you said

Yeah, a couple of people have posted that it's fake and not backed it up. Please do =)

Back it up? Hahaha, you're telling me to back up my claim that this man isn't a time traveler? :lol:

Take a minute to think about what you just said.

I'll take a look around when I have more time and will post the link. I read the article sometime last summer in which it explained the RPG. Even had a picture of the box. I don't remember what it was called, but it was an RPG geared toward people who wanted to make their own. It gave you the basis of the storyline which was a post-apocalyptic scenario. All the person had to do was fill in gaps.

Trust me, the man is NOT from the future. Believing this is like believing David Blane can actually do real magic. It's an illusion and I'm shocked at the amount of people that do question whether or not it's real.

Asking someone to disprove it is like asking to disprove that the events in Star Wars actually took place a long time ago in a galaxy far far away. Sure, George Lucas made the story, but... what's to say an alien that keeps universal history didn't deliver it to him? Well, the reason most people wouldn't believe it because it's too far fetched. Trust me, we won't have the technology in 30 years to travel back in time.

Doesn't mean it's not a good read, but yes, it's fake. I promise.

[edit]

Just do a search on Google for it. First few results returned this: http://www.anomalies.net/cgi-bin/bbs...c;f=9;t=000040

and this:

http://www.spearweasel.com/rpg/twheel/darkfutr.htm

How could they tell if it moved faster than light if nothing can see it?

I've checked several times some of the physics based time travel information he has listed.

Now, before I present my findings I have to say that I pride myself on being as knowledgable as a civilian can be about time travel. I read H.G. Wells at age 7 and never looked back. I hold several degrees in advanced mathmatics.


From what most theories about time travel and gravity control state, this guy is right on the money. I mean right on the money. According to theory. Assuming he has complete control over the environment inside the field, it could work. The problem is that Earths magnetic field is not 100% consistant. The only place that this could work is in an environment that is unnefected by gravity, radiation, and what I call string flux. This place could only theoretically exist in a very specific area of space. I suppose several of the theories I am basing my conclusions on could be completly wrong. To be honest, I don't think we are very close to time travel with this type of device.

I don't want to get into great detail, but if you want to ask me questions, please do.

I think what really gets my attention about this isn't the science. It isn't the civil war. It isn't even the massive World War III. What really gets my attention is the social state he described. I was amazed as I sat in my chair reading about what I still consider a possible time stream. The family/community/localization state of what he was talking about it facinating. I've often wondered what would happen if 'all this crap' ended. Every day things DO get worse. We are fooled and tricked and lied to so often that an end seems more than just possible; it seems likely. It's okay to be scared by a loss of rights. Remember that this discussion was going on between November 2000 and January 2001. This predates the September 11 attacks. He also mentioned a president in 2004 who was like Abe Lincoln, in that he tried to reunite the US. Could that have been Kerry? Sounds damned close to me. I mean the guy even looks like Lincoln. I have a lot to think about. Even if this is a different or non existant timestream, just the fact that it could happen should scare people. I know I have a lot to think about.

Because the future has an infinite number of possibilities, therefore many people from the future would be here.

Yet they are not, so that means three things:

1) The world is about to end, therefore there are no humans left to figure out time travel.

2) Time travel is impossible. At least in a backwards way.

3) There are people here from the future, they are just not revealing themselves -->
a) There are no major wars in the future for us to be warned about
b) The future-people are afraid of affecting our world, since their own existance can be terminated if they do the wrong thing (I remember somewhere on the TFP about if someone went back in time and asked an Austrian farmer for directions to a village, the farmer would not have met a woman and would not have had Hitler. Then WWII would not happen, so no baby boomers, so no technical revolution, so a more primitive world would exist, so time travel wouldnt exist at the time of the time travelers departure.. That raises some questions..)
^^^
Does that mean that the time traveler would simply 'not exist' if he tapped that Austrian farmer's shoulder? Or would he still exist, but unable to go forward in time again?

Very confusing. Makes me wonder....why do we even care?

Real or not, I just crapped my pants.

Are the Olympics still being played in the future?

60. As a result of the many conflicts, no, there were no official Olympics after 2004. However, it appears they may be revived in 2040.

We shall see about that one, fairly soon.

Interesting reading, entertaining anyhow. I'm buying more ammo just in case.

who knows? lots of it seems totally logical. if bush and cronies do jack the election, (and you can bet they will if they think they´re gonna lose) i myself would be ready for a little civil disobedience. could it lead to civil war? given the state of affairs of the world its not too far fetched. fear and war keep these elite assholes in their positions of power. regardless, the guy had his finger on the pulse and was a very astute judge of where current events may soon take us.
do i believe it. Hell no. But whoever the fuck he is, was or shall be, he´s a pretty sharp cookie. well planned and executed hoax.

That = Load of Crap.

To the people who say a lot of stuff he says is logical: You're crazy. He does not back up a single statement he made.

Why would they need Shit old computers to interpret new APL and BASIC code? Come'on!

And Unix stops working in 2038? Why? What a load of crap. "And I am sure some UNIX engineer can confirm this"

Yeah Im sure.

This is a load of bollocks.

Ok come on! They can timetravel, but they can't write a translator for BASIC and APL code? PUUUUUUUUUUUUUHLEAAASE.

he acts like this "feature" is unique to the 5100 series computers, which is nonsense, since they would not build a compiler into the the hardware, but into software.

I have just found the site about john titor and wanted to publish it here... Well, it seems i was defeated...

Anyway, I also feel that I need some answers. For instance: how come humanity has developed a time machine so early (2036)? why did he chose the internet to make his predictions public? Why didn't he go to the government or something? I am intrigued. :crazy:

I read this site several months ago and recall him saying America will have a civil war in 2005, correct? If so, we will find out if he is the real deal come next year.

it'll be over this election...or the results of the election and what people think it will mean for out foreign policy and domestic safety..............IF WE HAVE ONE.

I know, it is very coincidental, it almost fits together perfectly.

How do I know for a fact this is bull shit?

That "laser" is bent ~60 degrees. This could not possibly be due to gravitational lensing.

The sun bends star light by about 2 degrees (this is one of the comfirmations of general relativity). To warp space by enough to bend light 60 degrees in less than 20 cm you would have to have a gravitional field so strong that it couldn't help but create a singularity. Or at the very least destroy everything in an absoloutly massive radius.

Oh and of course there is the whole conservation of energy thing which kind of implies that to artificially create a gravititional field you would need to supply the same amount of energy as is in a mass that would create that field. i.e. E=mc^2.

There is honestly no way of generating that kind of power. Hydrogen bombs are nothing compared to this. Hell, the energy stored in the ocean/atmosphere is nothing compared to this.

It just makes no sense.

He says he was born in 1998. His name is John Titor. If he was really trying to be secretive about his whereabouts, he wouldn't have given this information, given the possibility that someone could threaten to take him hostage as a child.

Although I must admit; this following statement does intrigue me: "Real disruptions in world events begin with the destabilization of the West as a result of degrading US foreign policy and consistency. This becomes apparent around 2004 as civil unrest develops near the next presidential election."

He mentioned that that's not his real name =) Titor come from TIme TravellOR, apparantly.

So is this election going to determin if this shit actually happens?

And if so, whos going to live if this shit is true.

its the apocalypse... it made for an interesting read...but c'mon its obviously a very well crafted fiction (very well crafted) this is hard sci-fi at its best

I'm no expert but...

http://www.gsp.com/2038/

Dude. 32 bit unix systems haven't been industry standard for over 4 years. As a matter of fact, HP is dropping support for 32 bit unix hardware and s/w this year.

Yes, there are still those that will run the os and hardware until it dies. But the rest of the world is on 64 bit, which John Titor didn't know about when he initially tried to fool us all. Long story short, as much as many of us would like to believe, this guy is FOS.. And S doesn't stand for string.

Well, Bush is now back in office... I guess it's not too long now before we'll see Titor's predictions for what they are. And as for:

I don't have a link, but look up something called quantum entanglement. The grossly basic idea is that two particles, originated from the same source though taking different paths, and travelling the speed of light, will arrive at the same place at the same time. In other words, while one can take a direct course at the speed of light, the other can travel twice as far but arrive at the same instant, meaning it must have travelled faster than the speed of light. It's one of the basic problems of quantum physics.

I've been reading through the John Titor page, almost at the end now. I think it's a fascinating read, but I personally don't believe it because he goes to great lengths to explain that he doesn't particularly care if we believe him. From what little I understand, it seems that everything that can happen, will happen, so I don't see why he can't give out stock tips? What would be the harm?

All the science both makes sense and doesn't make sense to me, as it's all just technical jargon that I can't possibly begin to get my head around.

He tells us things that will happen in the future, things that won't be proven or disproven for years to come. Only now, four years or so after he started posting, can we even begin to see if he was right.

If he really didn't want us to benefit by telling us things (such as when earthquakes or bombings happen), why didn't he say something like "911"? Something vague enough that before the attacks we wouldn't understand, but straight afterwards we'd say 'Ah, that's what he meant!' Saying '911' on the message board wouldn't have a hope in hell of preventing the September 11 attacks only six months later so nobody on Earth would benefit from him hinting about it. I cannot imagine for a second that somebody on those boards would see '911' and then stay away from New York city six months later.

Considering the September 11 attacks are arguably the number 1 trigger for the conflicts that the US and the West are involved in now, and he says that the current conflicts are the lead-ups to WW3 and the US Civil War (any day now, it seems), it makes sense that he would make some reference, even a heavily disguised one, to the events that cause the wars in the future.

And yes, to those who don't believe it, all this talk is a waste of time but whether I believe it or not is overshadowed by the conversation it generates.

Can you post some links that state these facts? I've done a lot of research on astrophysics, and consider myself to have a more than average knowledge base on such subjects. I have never heard any scientifical proof relating to anything similar to this, other than sci-fi books.

No offence to you, but it sounds like you watched too much Back to the Future when you were a kid.



I just wanted to state one thing that has already been stated, which proves, more than anything I could say, that this guy is a fake.

WHY DOESN'T HE GIVE US ANY DATES OR ACUTAL FACTS ABOUT EVENTS THAT ARE ABOUT TO HAPPEN?

If he's from the future, wouldn't he know that Bush was going to win? Why didn't he say flat out that the president of the united states is going to be george bush in 2004 after the election? Why doesn't he make bets on sports and things like that?

I knew that Bush was going to win!

I didn't read too far into his predictions, because I have seen it all before on those 'psychic' sites, where others have made generalizations and 'predictions', which 'come true' becaue they are so general that something close to it must happen around the time (usually 1 year) that they say it's going to happen.

Also, I went to the site and couldn't handle it. I find it quite offencive to my eyes.

If he's such a great man, and a time traveller, who would obviously know how to make a lot of money, and who would probably be rich from being able to actually go back in time and bet on things, or simply because he's a genius who works for a multi-billion dollar company, in his time, why does he have to have links to tripod? Why are there advertisments on his page?

That page is horrible. I would think that someone from the future would be able to afford to make a better site.

Also, he said "Time travel is not a secret in 2036 and I expect it will become more common."

If time travel is going to become more common, wouldn't we know about it by now? What would stop it from being more common if you are able to go back in time? Time wouldn't be a factor anymore, so saying that it will 'become' more common is irrelevant.

This whole site is a joke, and it's only entertaining because of that fact.

I'll give you some physics about time travel.


There are 3 possible ways that you could possibaly travel back through time.

1) Travel at a speed faster than the speed of light.

2) Pray that wormholes exist (wormholes could exist in the overlapping of gravitational fields of two very very very massive objects, like supermassive black holes. Since gravity bends space-time, it's possible that one could be sent to a new time and space after passing through this field, since they will overlap and change the value of space-time.)

3) Fall into a black hole.


Here are some reasons why you wouldn't be able to travel through time using these three possible ways.

1) No object with a mass can travel the speed of light, let alone exceed it. Your mass increases as you travel faster, and as you approach the speed of light, your mass approaches infinity. E = mc^2 is what proves this. m, which is mass, changes as you approach the speed of light. To get m, you have to use a formula that looks like this.

m(v) = m(0) / sqrt(1-v^2/c^2)

If you look at this and figure it out, if your velicoty (v) is the speed of light (c), you end up getting something equal to c/c, which is 1.

Now, you take 1-1, which equals 0.

Try to take the square root of 0, then try to divide by 0. Possible? Nope!

If you get close to c, you will notice that the denominator gets closer and closer to 0. If you divide something by a number that is very close to 0, you get a very large number. This proves that, as you increase speed, close to the speed of light, your mass increases and approaches infinity, but never reaches it, because it's impossible to get there, due to the equation, or, if our math skills just aren't good enough to figure out an equation with a denominator of 0, you will reach a mass of infinity, which is impossible, and due to E=mc^2, the energy it takes you to get there would be infinity(c^2). In other words, you would have an infinite mass, and it would take an infinite amount of energy to get there.


2) wormholes

Even if wormholes do exist, which I think they don't, how are we going to find one? We would have to use number 1 to get us to a binary orbiting system, since it would be insanely far away. The only place that supermassive blackholes exist is at the centre of galaxies, as far as I know. To have two orbiting eachother is a very rare and improbable occurrence. People would have to have travelled for more than 59 years to get to these rare celestial miracles. It would be more probable to have visited aliens, and more feasible.

Another problem is, you would get shot to a random space and time. It would be impossible to tell what part and time of the universe you would end up in.


3) Same as above, to get to a black hole, you would have to use case 1, since they are many many light years away from us. The closest would probaby be the one at the centre of our galaxy, which is further than anyone can comprehend. It would take us millions of years to even get there.

Just to give a little example of how far it is. It's so far away that we, as in our solar system and star, do not feel the effects of the insane amount of gravitational pull that the supermassive black hole has at the centre of our galaxy.

If you were to come close to a black hole, you would not survive. Due to the level of acceleration you would experience, whatever part of you that was going in first would be stretched out across a great distance, compared to your trailing end. You would be stretched to death.



I also noticed someone talking about moving things faster than the speed of light.

Yes, it has happened, but they moved a photon faster than the speed of light. Photons do not have a mass. When it's said that nothing can move faster than the speed of light, it's referring to objects with a mass.



I also wanted to point out this post.



Well stated. I was going to touch on the same thing, but figured I would let you do the job for me, and since you already posted it, which woul dhave been my strongest argument, I thought I would continue to give you the credit.

I wanted to go a little further.

Someone on here posted that they have been into researching time travel and everything since a very young age. They said they have degrees in mathematics and such. Now, props to that, but I would just like you to explain a few things for me.

I understand your points about gravity and magnetic fields being a factor in such cases, but, what about the singularity that this would produce? You would need to have a supermassive black hole to bend light like that, which is what the above poster pretty much stated.

And, if you read, in this post, about wormholes, that is the only way i can see time travel being possible by using gravity as the means. The bending of space-time through gravitational fields doesn't change your time. It changes the rate of space-time. It's the overlapping of two gravitationally bend space-times that change the value of space-time. As far as I know, and believe, at the moment, this is the only way to actually change that value. If you can show me otherwise, I would be greatful.

I just can't see how simply using one gravitational source can change your space-time, rather than just change the rate of space-time, unless you get into singularities, which would rip you apart, because you would be dealing with black holes.


Anyway, enough of my rant. It's fake, and you should be able to agree after this post.

Nothing so special about time travel. We're all time travellers, moving at precisely one minute per minute into the future.

Before stating facts of something that is not understood realize that all the equations and science you used are not absolute truth. For instance E=mc^2 is a mathematical model that may or may not be correct. When our mathematical models fail it does not mean things cannot happen it means that using this current model we cannot show this behavior. This happens with a lot of mathematical models especially when you get things like dividing by 0.

Listening to people on both sides of this argue facts on things that are theoretical is really kind of funny.

Do I think this guy is real? No. Do I think time travel is impossible? No, i guess it may be possible i can't prove it is impossible. Do I think moving faster than the speed of light is a guarenteed method of traveling through time? No. Do I think traveling the speed of light is impossible? No.

There is no proof on either side of time travel.

Why can't you argue physics with someone who said they physically went back in time?

If there were no proof on either side, then you just proved that this guy didn't go back in time. If he did it, he would be able to prove it.

As far as proven physics (as in proven physically, rather than with 'just' math), it would seem possible that one might be able to travel back in time, but far too unlikely for humans to ever reach that goal.

You're right, things may be disproven in the future, but don't say that the formula E=mc^2 isn't physically proven. Aspects of it might change, but if it weren't truth, atomic bombs wouldn't exist. That's physical proof for you.

Time dilation is fact as well. So is the fact that a massive object can not travel faster than the speed of light. If it were to do so, a singularity would occure.

By me saying that no massive object can travel faster than the speed of light, I mean that this object wouldn't exist in our physical world the way we do if it were to happen. Black holes have proven this for us.

Anyway, there is proof on either side that time travel might, or might not be, possible, but for humans, it's proven that it's more than likely (as in you would have a better change of winning the lottery 234235234235 times in a row) that it is impossible.


Now, you could go and argue that all math or all physics may not be true, since we only have this little portion of the universe to test things, but that would just be silly. Physics holds truth higher than your thoughts on things, since many people have put a lot of thought into the science, and have proven them to be physically true for many situations. Once you go and prove them to not be true, I'll regard your thoughts as being more valid than what I have learned through the scientists that have done the leg work.

ok e = mc^2 has almost nothing to do with atomic bombs,

secondly, e = mc^2 is a mathematical model. a tool used by mathematicians and engineers to help design and build technology. It will be valid for some occasions, but eventually situations will occur where it is not valid. infact this has already happened in quantum mechanics.

another example is newtonian physics, these models have been proven to be inaccurate again and again but are still used as they make designing things easy and understandable. They arent physics, they are models used to represent certain aspects of it.

That equation has nothing to do with the creation of the atomic bomb?

What? Are you joking?

So I guess I'm wrong to think that Einstein warned the states about Germany's work on creating different types of weapons, one possibly being the atomic bomb. That's when Einstein sent President Franklin D. Roosevelt a letter warning him about the possible creation of the atomic bomb.

I guess I'm also wrong to say that atomic bombs work by splitting atoms up, to create great amounts of energy. And I guess I must then also be wrong to say that the study of atomic bombs is also used to try to think about a way to reverse this great scientific discovery, by trying to create mass out of energy, rather than creating energy out of mass, which is how they work.

E=mc^2 has nothing to do with creating energy out of mass, or mass out of energy.

Also, models are how things are explained. I don't see you explaining anything valid on here. It's easy to sit there and say everything is a model, therefore it's not true. Prove it!

Yes, models are how things are explained, but they are rarely, if ever, perfect. The physical world is, generally, too complex to completely map out in mathematics, much less with our current systems. What's more, models are usually made for use in a perfect environment, not the physical world.

As for, "I don't see you explaining anything valid on here," that is a statement full of ignorance. That's not meant to be taken as an insult by any means, but to say that it is invalid to state that E=mc^2 is not a model shows a lack of understanding on your part, especially when Hanabal is correct in stating that it has not held up when it comes to the realm of quantum mechanics.

"but to say that it is invalid to state that E=mc^2 is not a model shows a lack of understanding on your part"

Now, do you mean invalid to state that it is a model? Or, invalid to state that it isn't a model?

Either way, if you are saying that I said that E=mc^2 isn't a model, you show more ignorance than myself, and a lack of understanding is shown on your part.

If you are saying that it isn't a model, than you show more ignorance, aswell, and a great deal of a lack of understanding on your part.

I didn't state that it isn't a model, in fact, I stated that it is a model.

Sure, I may have been out of line when I said that I don't see that guy explaining anything valid on here, but I do know what I'm talking about, probably moreso than yourself, when it comes to relativity. I give myself a lot of pride in the fact that I can understand a lot more about the physical world than most people. When someone comes along and simply states that everything is just theory and all of these theories could be invalid, then goes on to state that they think they are, I take it as a personal insult to my intelligence, and I take it as that person insulting the many scientists who have devoted years of study on the subject. If you want to say it's invalid, show me why. Don't just say that you think it's invalid.

I do not know much about quantum mechanics, and if you do, post your thoughts. I would love to learn about the subject, so back everything up about the differences between quantum mechanics and relativity.

I do know this though.

Quantum mechanics is the study of the small, whereas relativity is the study of the large. They are on opposite sides of the spectrum, so it's no surprise that they don't fully fit together. A unified theory is what we need to find between the two to fully understand how everything truely works. So, to just say that relativity doesn't hold up in the realm of quantum mechanics could be wrong. Aspects of it don't, but it's a two sided situation. A lot of aspects of relativity, including the ones I had stated, have been proven in our physical world, which would neglect your comment about models being made for perfect environments.

I will admit that the theories and models I have posted on here may be wrong, but they are proven moreso than not, so to say that they are just theories that might not work is lazy. Scientists have given their entire lives to test and model these theories to best fit our physical world, and therefore, I hold their thoughts and findings on a very high platter. Scientists will go and disprove, or prove, a lot in relation to relativity, but like I have stated, many of the topics at hand have been proven to work in our current situation.

Since newtonian physics was touched upon here, we'll take a look at that for an example.

Many things that you learn in physics relate to Newton's laws. Why do we learn them even though there have been further proofs to explain things a lot better and more accurately (relativity)? Well, because Newton's laws still work for small general cases. They don't work in every situation, but they are still valid a lot of the time.

It's the same as relativity. It doesn't work correctly with quantum mechanics, but it's still valid. A lot of aspects have been tested and proven to work in our physical world. Therefore, we have more pros for these aspects being valid than not. It's likely that the models will need to be reshaped, but the general idea still holds, and I believe it will hold for the rest of human existance.

Can all of this change? Yes. At a great degree where we realize that E=mc^2 is no longer a formula that does us any good? It's more likely that this dude actually did go back in time.

Either way, this topic was about a guy who said he went back in time. Obviously his people would have been able to figure out the unanswered questions to the theories we are talking about, or they would have come up with something so new that has never been thought of before. It's possible, but if it happened, he would have told us.

He was the one who said that he had this crazy time machine that was able to bend light 60 degrees. That relates to the way things work in todays physics, so why not argue todays physics in this thread?

Why can't you argue about how things work physically in relativity with someone who supposedly broke the now accepted boundries that scientists believe, with using ideas based on todays boundries and physics? He should be able to answer them, shouldn't he? Or, we should be able to get someone to go and figure out what is going on exactly.

This argument has gone on a 360 degree turn. It has turned into a battle of who holds science on a higher platter, and who has more faith in science. The argument started off with, 'who thinks this guy is a fake'. I have stated why I think he is a fake, and everything i stated relates to him, physically.

To me, physics is something that people have worked on for a very long time and many people have devoted their lives to trying to figure out how the universe works around us. To say that it is probably wrong is ignorant. You're basically saying that all these people with a great amount of intelligence are probably wrong. Doesn't it seem like there's a bit of ignorance in that?

I first read this via Art Bell's web page a year or two ago, and seeing the pictures immediately takes me back to what I thought at the time..

For a guy from the future he sure drives a piece of crap car.


Nuh-uh, nice try. Now go get a Delorean and you might have something..

Devin

Alright, I too probably stepped out of line with the whole 'ignorance' statement. However, what I'm arguing is not that these great people are wrong so much as that their statements are imperfect and most likely will change as we progress scientifically. I don't believe, in the least, that this Titor is actually a time traveller. I'm just trying to say that time travel caused by faster than light speed movement may be possible and not to automatically throw it out because of the theory of general relativity. I had no intention of upsetting you, but as a physics major I'm saying that it's a rapidly changing field and forumulas and theories like Einstein's may not hold up in the near future as technology progresses and creates situations where modern-day mathematics and physics may or may not hold up. In all fairness, I kind of hope that they don't so that people like me can struggle to figure out improvements on old theories.