cudaboy

How many of you are into the old muscle cars?
Any brand preferances?

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Lockjaw

I've always been partial to Fords but when it comes to old muslce cars I hold no loyalties. I'd sooner drive a 4-4-2 as an old Cougar or Hemi Challenger.

GetRdone

I am an automotive enthusiast...or gearhead....of all types. Muscle cars are great for their purpose, look badass, and throw you back in your seat. Due to living in WI, and the cost of buyin and owning a muscle car, i havent had the pleasure of really owning my own, but if the money was there im sure i would. A GTO Judge would be a hell of a ride to get a hold of, as would a Yenko. I dont really have a hardcore brand preference, but usually i stay away from fords, with occasional exceptions.

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cudaboy

LOL I can agree with you on that. I have done a fiew restorations on the ford front, there not bad cars but trying to date code and nos parts are a night mare.

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TheClarkster

I love em to death!
I've only owned two so far though, but hey not bad for being 19.
My first was a rustbucket 1968 Cougar that I sold not too long ago.
Now I have a 1967 Cougar XR7 that just had its engine and transmission rebuilt, and I put headers and dual exhaust on it. Oh man... I love the sound of a V8!

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BadNick

I've been very interested in cars since I was about 7yo and I was 18yo in 1967 ...so as you might guess, I grew up loving muscle cars of all sorts. I grew up often hanging around garages with car guys, a group of them had hot rods of all sorts, as in '32, '34, '40 Fords etc. Of the muscle cars, Fords were always my least favorite but there are plenty of Fords I'd enjoy owning now. I'd say most of my youth I leaned heavily toward Mopars with Chevy's a close second. Among my immediate friends and their big brothers who owned muscle cars, it seemed that Fords never quite performed up to Chrysler and Chevy products. Of course there are exceptions, a local guy that showed up one day with his brand new Boss 429 Mustang left a strong impression. One of the guys had an early '60's Dodge 413 Wedge in a big coupe, forgot the exact model, but it was very quick. My best friend owned a '68 440 Magnum Charger, another good friend had a 440 GTX, another had a 383 RoadRunner, the Ford guy had a '60 406ci Galaxie with trips and some other work ...beautiful car but couldn't run with the fastest; he sold it and got (not sure the model year) I think a '68 390 Fairlane GT, moded it, nice but couldn't hang with the fast guys. Another buddy had an LT1 Vette, the guy with the 440 GTX sold it and got a 427 Vette. Thru all this, I eventually bought a '67 XKE so that gives you a hint where my head was at; I loved that car since the first time I saw a picture of it when they came out in '61 and told myself I'd own one someday; so I bought myself the '67 Roadster a few months after graduating from college.

All around performance was something I always wanted and I always followed sports car racing, F1, CanAm, TransAm etc so I wanted something that would do more than go fast in a straight line and can barely stop at the end ...even though that is a crude oversimplification of typical muscle cars. A 427 Cobra was more like my idea of an ideal muscle car; moded Vettes also appealed to me but I didn't like all the typical rattles in older Vettes ...the new ones seem much better built.

Since one of my close friends built a car for drag racing, a little gasser HenryJ running in H or G/Gas, and of course the other guys also drag raced regularly at local strips, during much of my late teens/early twenties we went to the local drag strips more than once a week. I still love drag racing too.

Now I own a '95 Toyota Supra, still with stock twin turbos but I run as much boost as I can get away with ...dyno'd 435rwhp/455rwtq so it's no slouch; it has moded suspension with fully adjustable coilovers so I can set it up like I want. I consider it something of a Japanese engineered modern muscle car. It accelerates like crazy, stops better than most cars ever made, pulls very high g's cornering. I road race it pretty regularly, not hard core wheel to wheel road racing, just those HPDE events at local road courses like Pocono and Watkins Glen.

I'm pretty sure when my two boys, 9 and 10yo, get a bit older, we'll end up building a hot rod of some sort and to stay within my budget, a spruced up version of some rat rods I've seen appeal to me.

soundmotor

I've always been a Ford/Mercury fan for the reason that you can still find decent 1960's 2-dr sedans w/ V8's (Falcon, Fairlane, Galaxie, LTD, Torino, Comet, etc.) for reasonable prices. Mid-year Mustangs & Cougars (68-73) aren't terrible but it is getting harder to find them without a large succession of owners.

My second choice would be Buick or AMC. Again, for the value quotient.

soundmotor

ranger

for class and muscle it's 1965 mustang, dark blue or 1967 camaro, black

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cudaboy

I figured I tell you guys a little about my self and my car addictions. Obviously by my nic i am a Mopar fan , I love my Pontiacs and Chevy's too. I never really got into the Fords because growing up Mustangs were everywhere. It was like everyone had a 67 or 68 and they were always complaining about how a Mopar or Chevy kicked their butt at the drags.
I do automotive restoration and engine machine work for a living so I have seen the ins and outs of all the makes Including Honda. Out of all the cars I have redone The fords are usually the biggest pain in the axx when it comes time for numbers/date coded parts. Alot of people say Mopars are but I havent had much of a problem yet.(maby just lucky) If you really want a hard car to document try a 1970 elcamino ss. Gm was not very kind on build plate information.
If you want a easy car to build and Don't care about anything being date correct then do a Mustang or a Camaro. Hell you could order the hole car from a mag. LOL
I must give Ford credit with the 302 it is one of the best designed motors (factory built and mass produced) it is one tuff small block.
In my opion it is a toss up between the 350 chev and 340 mopar, I must say I have to lean to the sbc because the stopped the 340 in 73 and went 360(which came out in 70, not many people knew that) I like the 360 till its recent demise to crate motor only but the 350 chevy has also gone that route. Ill keep my mouth shut on big blocks or ill go on for hours lol
sorry didn't mean to start rambeling.

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TM875

My little baby is a garaged '67 Mustang convertible. It's only got the weak little sixer, but the body is in great shape. I was able to purchase it for less than $5K, so once I get some savings built up, I'll be able to really restore her to her muscle-car glory.

Only tough part...do I want the 350, or should I just go all the way with the 427?

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cudaboy

It all depends on how much you want to spend, and how much renforcement you uant to do the the car to hold it together with w 427.

I think a good combo would be a 90's 5.0 HO with a 5 speed.

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IanSturgill

I must say that even though all muscle cars are cool, a 1969 camaro would be the best. The one I want to build would be a 350 shortblock daily driver with regular looking rims(no 18's). I plan on Deep Red with Metal Flake, and some cream racing stripes.
As cool as old muscle cars are, you cant beat a late model supra or ZX. The racing inspired quality and low expense are to much to pass up for me.

GetRdone

im not sure if a supra of zx is really that much more cost effective, except on gas maybe. Old muscle cars are nice because not only do they perform, but because of how long theyve been around, parts are somewhat cheap and very easy to get. Not to mention that u can liscense them under collecters cars, so no emissons, and low insurance. On a side note about the supra, a guy i know just aquired a 1100hp supra.......that thing is nuts, stands on the rear wheels easy.

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THGL

Just average it out. Get a 390! If I remember correctly, the 67-68 GT-A's came with the 390 (or it was an option).

I heard somewhere that the company building those "Elenor" GT500's are buying up all the 67-68 fastbacks they can get their hands on, even the rust buckets... and driving the prices up for the rest of us.

BigTruck1956

Even a warmed 289 or 302 coupled to a 4 speed would give you plenty of pep

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Lockjaw

You must not have seen too many turboed and stroked small block Chevys or 5.0 Mustangs.
Besides far too many Supras are dyno queens. What good is 1000 horsepower if you can't hook it up?

bodypainter

Please don't tell me you're going to put a Chevy engine in your Mustang.

If it's a 6 cylinder now you have some suspension work to do before you can even think about a big block. I'd be looking for a 351W for that car.

DDDDave

*DDDDave raises his hand here*

I'm a Chevy man myself. Any 68 - 72 A-Body wil do.

Right now I've got a '72 El Camino SS with a big block 402. With the lowered stance and the lumpy idle from the high-lift cam the damn thing is so intimidating no ricer punk will even look at me no less run me from a stoplight. Oh well.

Gotta watch out for those supercharged Cobra mustangs and Turbo Z cars, though.

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Scorps

I will some day own a 1969 Chevy Camaro SS/RS with a 454. All I need to do is get a house with a damn garage.

GetRdone

mmmmm SS. Ive never owned a big block, but theres something about hearing one idle.....u just hear it and you know it could beat whatever your driving.

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Scorps

Oh ya and idleing with 3 inch exhaust is enough to rattle windows. There is a guy around the corner from me that has a Olds 442 and that thing makes my house windows rumble when hes goes by

c172g

I've got a 73 Camaro, black with gold stripes. So far, since 1986, it's had a new rear end (blew out the 4:11 & now has 3:55), new paint the eve of my wedding in 1995 as well as new interior, new rims, tires, and just about everything else. The only remaining part on the car from when I bought it is the Muncie 4 speed, which will most likely outlive me and my son who I'll pass the car onto when he's of age. When I bought it it had a souped up 350, which started burning oil at about six months of ownership, so I rebuilt an awesome running 350 with the holley carb and all the goodies. It ran like no other.

Then, being a smart kid, I decided I needed a bigger motor. Sold the 350 and put in a high horsepower 396 bored to 408. What a friggin mistake. The cam was so big it shook the car & wouldn't idle under 1500 rpm. Sold that to a friend who promptly blew it up & the car sat for about 5 years with no motor.

Just before I got married I put a stock 350 (slight cam & pistons) and a holley carb back in. Runs nice, drives nice, everything is smooth, it can still haul ass. I drive it about five hours a year.

Ideal car would be a 1969 Mustang Fastback. Don't know why, just love the look of one.

Scorps

Nothing runs better then a 350, my dad told me that because he has owned just about every chevy you can think of.

lt1s10

My first car was a 1966 Chevy II Nova. My dad helped me start it as a project a year before I got my license. We finished it a month after I got my license. I was the only one of friends that had more then enough horsepower to get into trouble but didn't. I think that since I helped build the car I knew and understood what it was capable of and more importantly what it couldn't do.

I'd like to build another one day or maybe a 69 Chevelle.

Gnzo

TM, I am going to say GET THE 350! Now let me explain before I get reamed for suggesting you put a Chevy (sacrilege!) engine into your mustang. With your question, you just compared the name of a car with the engine of a car. A 65-67 Ford mustang GT350, which I assume you mean by "350" actually had a 289 small block V8. Also offered in '67 was the 390 big-block V8. In '67 Ford made the mustang 2 in wider and 2 in longer. Now able to hold a big-block, the 390 was Ford's answer to the Camaro SS 396 (although the 390 couldn't match the Camaro's horses). The race-bread 427 wasn't offered until 1968 and was actually only offered for a limited time because of the cost involved in making it and maintaining it was so high. Ford replaced the 427 with a 428 later that year. The 428 dyno'ed at just over 400hp which was more than the Camaro could put out. Because of this, the 427 is harder and more expensive to get. Also in '68, Ford released the 302, a stroked version of the classic 289. (Note: The 428 was actually offered in '67 from Shelby as the GT500, but not from Ford)

So your question should be, 289, 390, or 428? The answer is 289. Most Mustang experts will tell you that although the 428 is an amazing engine, it makes the mustang extremely nose heavy and its handling ability falls far short of the 289. The 390 shouldn't even be considered. Only slightly lighter than the 427, and 428, it doesn't put out anywhere close to the horse power that its big brothers do. The 289 is a very common engine; parts are easy to find, and since the engine won't match the vin anyway, having it bored 30 over is an easy way to improve its performance. You can easily get that engine to put out 300hp on the dyno with some very common modifications.

TM, you have purchased my favorite mustang, or almost favorite. I love the 67 GT Convertible. It is a really fun car that should bring you years of enjoyment! I hope you enjoy it!

Scorps

Why not the 302? I thought the 5 litre(4.9L) was the best engine Ford ever built?

Ilow

Hmmm, all this fun talk about muscle cars makes me wish I wasn't a student. I think If I had the means i's go for a nice Mopar. I like the Roadrunners, but a HemiCuda droptop would sure do it too, with a nice 727 torqueflite...
I do like some of the GM's too, a Chevelle SS or a 442 convert. (some cars just look right in soft top form.

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Gnzo

The 302 is a great engine, only it's harder to find than a 289 and they cost a bit more. If you wanted to spend a "bit more", instead of the 302, I would try to find a 289-4V Hi-Po from a '63-'67 mustang and have it completely rebuilt. The 289 Hi-Po featured a mechanical camshaft, threaded rocker arm stud (adjustable) and a recessed spring set. The other 289/302s use a press-in stud. You could have the machine shop bore it 30 over and then put an RV Cam in it. A little company called Holley makes a decent carb...

Anyway Pain, yes, the 302 is a great engine, but if I was starting another mustang project and replacing the 200, I would opt for the 289. Other than the reasons listed above, this is a '67 and the 302 wasn't offered until mid year '68. The numbers aren't going to match anyway, so maybe keeping the engine with the year isn't as big of a deal in this case...

theguyondacouch

Ford made a 427 as well. They also made a 429 hemi.

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bodypainter

Gnzo got what I missed - I was just thinking of a 350 being a Chevy engine and not the GT350 angle. I still remember being crushed to learn the Mustang that Steve McQueen drove in Bullit had a Chevy small block instead of Ford power.

Personally if I wasn't concerned with the car having the 'correct' engine, I would get the 351 Windsor. I am pretty sure it's the same size block as the 289/302 and may even use the same motor mounts (paging Merkerguitars - you probably know all about this). There are plenty of dress-up and performance parts for the 351W.

Ramega

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Gotta love those old Mercs, of course they are more Hot Rod than Muscle Car.

Martian

I love that Charger, all sleek and black and sexy...

IanSturgill

Good Point LockJaw, if i had unlimited funds, i would get a 69 Camaro, or maybe a Mach 1

THGL

Where did that information come from? That's the first time I've ever heard that.

bodypainter

To tell the truth, I don't know and I guess I can't even prove it's true. When the movie first came out (1968-ish) I was in all my pimple-face almost-teen glory. Too young to drive but not too young to read every hot rod magazine published. It was just common knowledge, that's all I can say. One of these days I'll have to search this wonderful newfangled internets thingy and see if I can prove or debunk it.

merkerguitars

Ok the difference between a 289/302 and 351W, all three of these engines are classified as Windsor engines, because they originated from the ford windsor plants, all are really good choices for an engine. the 289 and 302 are identical in block size, just the 302 has a bigger pistons iirc. Now the 351 windsor is a stroked out version of the 302, hence its a bigger block. It's just a little wider resulting in a wider intake manifold, and the bolts for the heads are 1/2" size and not 7/16". You can put 351W heads on a 302 or 289 you just need to get a special set of reducers, and to put 302 or 289 heads on a 351w you just need to bore the bolt holes bigger. Otherwise the layout of 351w stuff is the same, 289,302 timing chain covers will fit on a 351w so do accesory brackets, starters, oil pans, etc. And motor mounts hooke up the same and generally will fit in any car with a 302, the 351w was more of a truck motor. The only reason you see special exhaust headers though is the 351w can be a tighter squeeze against most strut towers. And also note that the 351w is considered a small block still despite it being a little bit bigger. Personally if had to choose any engine that I could own it would be the Boss 302 which is an oddball engine. The boss 302 consisted of a normal 302 block, connecting rods with bigger than normal bolts and Cleveland 4v (4 barrel) heads, the block has the bolt holes in the cleveland pattern and not the windsor style and a special designed intake manifold to match up the oddball combination of head/block. The only problems with ford windsor engines is that heads don't flow as well as the other 2 of the big 3, and the boss 302 with cleveland heads solved the problem of a small block ford with good flowing heads = lots of power.

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bodypainter

Note that the 351 Cleveland 4 barrel had quite different heads than the 351 Cleveland 2 barrel and a very large percentage of 351 Cleveland engines were 2 barrel.

Ramega

Isn't that nice? Maybe my all-time favorite muscle car.

Magpie0001

WOW!!!

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giddup

My first car was a red '65 Mustang. It didn't have as much power as some of the other cars, but that 289 would move the vehicle down the road. I bought my current car and like an idiot sold the other one. Later I saw it in the news because of a bad accident.