Need advice on 2003 Honda Accord that engine died - Brand NEW - Page 2 - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

blockmaan2000 · 01-24-2004, 09:16 PM

Not trying to flame, but she should have checked the oil regularly even in a new car. Some dealerships would have claimed negligence on the owner and told her to get stuffed. Sorry, but you've got to take some responsibility for your stuff.

mbchills · 01-24-2004, 11:09 PM

A new engine sounds like the best you can do in this situation, itll be a waste of money to get lawyers and sue, and all that. just get the engine and be happy you get anything

mr_mcrafe · 01-25-2004, 02:25 AM

You're lucky to get a new engine. Stop be unreasonable by trying to get a new car for no decent reason. It's stuff like this that adds to the cost of cars, because Honda has to pay unfair expenses for stupid/unreasonable people.

As for paying for the PDI though, that sounds unfair on the dealer's part so I'd follow that up and try to get my $1000 back.

big_bubba · 01-27-2004, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by james t kirk
Yeah, there is a better business bureau, but they are essentially toothless. All they do is have members, i.e. companies who have paid into the club. The worst that can ever happen is that the better business bureau will take away their memberships.

IRSEG,

The dealer doesn't have to pay a dime, it's Honda that is out and it's no skin off their nose.

As a car hound myself, i can assure you that a nonoriginal engine is a detrement to a resale. If you check out some of the resale ads for such things as classic cars, etc. the ad will always feature "Matching Numbers", i.e. the Serial number of the engine and the car itself match. It's very important to have that indication of originality.

Now i know that your run of the mill accord is not a classic vette, but the concept is the same. The car is not "right" if the engine has been replaced. This will cause many potential buyers of the vehicle to walk away. Myself included. If i was going to buy an accord (used with 2,000 miles on it) and i found out the orginal factory engine in it had blown and the dealer replaced the engine with another one, i would walk away from the seller. I am just not interested.

Plus, swapping engines is not a desireable thing to be doing to a car with 3,700 km on it (roughly 2, 000 miles). Dealer or not.

The idea of laying out 35 grand a few weeks ago in good faith and having the car pop its clock after 2,000 miles is mind boggling. Then to find out that there was no oil in engine for some reason is even more mind boggling.

When you buy a new car, there is an expectation of quality on the part of the purchaser that such major fuck ups are not going to happen.

About originality. I'm not trying to be an ass---but an Accord is NOT a muscle/classic car and will likely never be regarded in the same manner as one. I can udnerstand the importance of numbers matching-ness on a Hemi Cuda or Shelby GT500, but if there are even any accords AROUND in 30 years, chances are nobody is going to want them. It's just a car. It isn't rare or overly valuble.

I agree, a new car IS out of line. With the new engine, it'll be just like a brand new car.

Expectation of quality? You're right there should be one. This is why I'm staying away from new cars, especialy imports. Don't get me wrong, I know some imports are of very high quality, but when something like this happens, you really have to wonder. I'd rather have an old car with no computers in them and cheap parts so that I can fix them myself, thank you.

james t kirk · 01-27-2004, 03:13 PM

Footnote:

The dealer has poured 3.1 litres of oil into the original engine, said sorry, the car is fine, we are NOT going to replace the engine.

They have said that the car is fine.

So much for Honda building a better car, or offering better customer service.

Did they check the big end connecting rod bearings - NO.

Did the analyze the oil - NO.

All they did was add 3 litres of oil and tell her to fuck off.

DEI37 · 01-27-2004, 03:48 PM

If all they did was add three liters of oil, then everything should be fine. To lose three quarts out of a 5 quart engine, while significant, shouldn't be a disaster. That should still be a 200,000 mile engine. Engines that DON'T burn oil bother me. A properly running and maintained engine WILL use oil...Ford calls 1 quart per 1000 miles normal, and will say "see ya later, have a nice day" if you complain about 2 quarts in one oil change period. After reading through it all again, the dealer has no obligation for a new motor even, and would probably have the warranty claim denied for engine replacement.

james t kirk · 01-29-2004, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DEI37
If all they did was add three liters of oil, then everything should be fine. To lose three quarts out of a 5 quart engine, while significant, shouldn't be a disaster. That should still be a 200,000 mile engine. Engines that DON'T burn oil bother me. A properly running and maintained engine WILL use oil...Ford calls 1 quart per 1000 miles normal, and will say "see ya later, have a nice day" if you complain about 2 quarts in one oil change period. After reading through it all again, the dealer has no obligation for a new motor even, and would probably have the warranty claim denied for engine replacement.

I can tell you work at a dealership.

Let's not forget that the engine stopped running and the car had to be towed into the dealer.

Stopped, not acted up, stopped.

The problem was traced to a lack of oil. 3.1 litres out of 4 were missing.

That's not good anyway you cut it.

If my friend was a lawyer and initiated a legal action against the dealer they would cave. Because she is not and I am starting to wonder about her commitment, they tell he to screw off.

All is not well with this engine, I can assure you.

Moonduck · 01-29-2004, 07:22 AM

Modern engines have an absolute ton of sensors in them. the computer monitors more of the engine's processes than most people are aware. If her engine had zero problems and wasn't making a funny noise before it ceased working, then odds are that some sensor detected the issue and killed ignition to prevent further damage. It happens with these engines.

An oil analysis wouldn't hurt and would likely detect if there was scoring in the bearings, though something like that is best handled independantly (so that the dealer is not capable of influencing results), and that means out of pocket expense.

A new engine is best case scenario. An engine swap does nothing to the car's value except improve it. A 3700km newer engine won't graphically increase value, but it adjusts it up a smidge./ Original engines are entirely meaningless unless the engine/car has some sort of scarcity attached to it. There is nothing scarce about a 2003 Accord.

Most likey, the engine is fine. Most likely, it simply detected an issue and shut itself off. Were it my vehicle, I would make damned sure to have it checked with great regularity to prevent problems down the road (well, if it were my vehicle, I would've checked the oil sooner).

Just because you "know cars" doesn't mean that you know the law. You might want to advise her to contact an attorney before building her expectations up with the possibility of an entire new car.

james t kirk · 01-29-2004, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Moonduck
Modern engines have an absolute ton of sensors in them. the computer monitors more of the engine's processes than most people are aware. If her engine had zero problems and wasn't making a funny noise before it ceased working, then odds are that some sensor detected the issue and killed ignition to prevent further damage. It happens with these engines.

An oil analysis wouldn't hurt and would likely detect if there was scoring in the bearings, though something like that is best handled independantly (so that the dealer is not capable of influencing results), and that means out of pocket expense.

A new engine is best case scenario. An engine swap does nothing to the car's value except improve it. A 3700km newer engine won't graphically increase value, but it adjusts it up a smidge./ Original engines are entirely meaningless unless the engine/car has some sort of scarcity attached to it. There is nothing scarce about a 2003 Accord.

Most likey, the engine is fine. Most likely, it simply detected an issue and shut itself off. Were it my vehicle, I would make damned sure to have it checked with great regularity to prevent problems down the road (well, if it were my vehicle, I would've checked the oil sooner).

Just because you "know cars" doesn't mean that you know the law. You might want to advise her to contact an attorney before building her expectations up with the possibility of an entire new car.

Good post, but i have given up on her because she doesn' t listen to anything, so it's her problem now.

I still can't believe the entire issue however.

coventryblack · 01-30-2004, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DEI37
Engines that DON'T burn oil bother me. A properly running and maintained engine WILL use oil...Ford calls 1 quart per 1000 miles normal,

What? a quart per 1000??? I have a 68 Ford truck with an FE 390 that uses about that... 'cause its been road hard and put away wet. For a new car however that is entirely unacceptable. I've put 175,000 on my tacoma with Mobile1, which gets changed no sooner than every 10k and it doesn't lose any detectable amount.

james t kirk · 01-31-2004, 05:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by coventryblack
What? a quart per 1000??? I have a 68 Ford truck with an FE 390 that uses about that... 'cause its been road hard and put away wet. For a new car however that is entirely unacceptable. I've put 175,000 on my tacoma with Mobile1, which gets changed no sooner than every 10k and it doesn't lose any detectable amount.

Exactly.

Engines should NOT be burning oil. 1 quart every 1000, why not just add the oil right to the gasoline cause everyone driving behind you is going to be swearing and cursing your hunk of junk.

big_bubba · 01-31-2004, 09:56 PM

If it runs, it's fine. If it dies or seizes, THEN go after honda for a new engine. If not, grow up and stop trying to milk it for more than it's worth.

pocon1 · 02-07-2004, 08:33 PM

As far as burning oil, the limit for most manufacturers is about 500-1000 miles per quart. Anything above that is hunky-dory. However, a low-mileage new car should not even be burning a quart per 3,000 miles.

james t kirk · 03-02-2004, 10:13 AM

Some of you may remember this thread....

http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...threadid=40942

Well, the story just took another twist.......

After Honda Canada told my friend to screw off, there was nothing wrong with the original motor, they just poured 3 litres of oil into and told her she was good to go, the same thing happened again.

Yep, low oil, no oil light, engine cuts out. They still don't know what's happening.

Towed to the dealer, still there, no resolution, no assistance from Honda Canada.

So much for Honda being any better than GM in terms of Customer Service.

I will post more details when i learn of them.

01-24-2004, 11:09 PM	#42 (permalink)
mbchills Insane Location: NJ	A new engine sounds like the best you can do in this situation, itll be a waste of money to get lawyers and sue, and all that. just get the engine and be happy you get anything __________________ rawr.

01-27-2004, 03:48 PM	#46 (permalink)
DEI37 Go faster! Location: Wisconsin	If all they did was add three liters of oil, then everything should be fine. To lose three quarts out of a 5 quart engine, while significant, shouldn't be a disaster. That should still be a 200,000 mile engine. Engines that DON'T burn oil bother me. A properly running and maintained engine WILL use oil...Ford calls 1 quart per 1000 miles normal, and will say "see ya later, have a nice day" if you complain about 2 quarts in one oil change period. After reading through it all again, the dealer has no obligation for a new motor even, and would probably have the warranty claim denied for engine replacement. __________________ Generally speaking, if you were to get what you really deserve, you might be unpleasantly surprised.

03-02-2004, 10:13 AM	#54 (permalink)
james t kirk Junkie Location: Toronto	Honda Accord - Remember the new one that had no oil Some of you may remember this thread.... http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...threadid=40942 Well, the story just took another twist....... After Honda Canada told my friend to screw off, there was nothing wrong with the original motor, they just poured 3 litres of oil into and told her she was good to go, the same thing happened again. Yep, low oil, no oil light, engine cuts out. They still don't know what's happening. Towed to the dealer, still there, no resolution, no assistance from Honda Canada. So much for Honda being any better than GM in terms of Customer Service. I will post more details when i learn of them.

01-24-2004, 09:16 PM	#41 (permalink)
blockmaan2000 Crazy	Not trying to flame, but she should have checked the oil regularly even in a new car. Some dealerships would have claimed negligence on the owner and told her to get stuffed. Sorry, but you've got to take some responsibility for your stuff.

01-25-2004, 02:25 AM	#43 (permalink)
mr_mcrafe Banned Location: auckland, nz	You're lucky to get a new engine. Stop be unreasonable by trying to get a new car for no decent reason. It's stuff like this that adds to the cost of cars, because Honda has to pay unfair expenses for stupid/unreasonable people. As for paying for the PDI though, that sounds unfair on the dealer's part so I'd follow that up and try to get my $1000 back.

01-27-2004, 03:13 PM	#45 (permalink)
james t kirk Junkie Location: Toronto	Footnote: The dealer has poured 3.1 litres of oil into the original engine, said sorry, the car is fine, we are NOT going to replace the engine. They have said that the car is fine. So much for Honda building a better car, or offering better customer service. Did they check the big end connecting rod bearings - NO. Did the analyze the oil - NO. All they did was add 3 litres of oil and tell her to fuck off.

01-29-2004, 07:22 AM	#48 (permalink)
Moonduck Junkie Location: SE USA	Modern engines have an absolute ton of sensors in them. the computer monitors more of the engine's processes than most people are aware. If her engine had zero problems and wasn't making a funny noise before it ceased working, then odds are that some sensor detected the issue and killed ignition to prevent further damage. It happens with these engines. An oil analysis wouldn't hurt and would likely detect if there was scoring in the bearings, though something like that is best handled independantly (so that the dealer is not capable of influencing results), and that means out of pocket expense. A new engine is best case scenario. An engine swap does nothing to the car's value except improve it. A 3700km newer engine won't graphically increase value, but it adjusts it up a smidge./ Original engines are entirely meaningless unless the engine/car has some sort of scarcity attached to it. There is nothing scarce about a 2003 Accord. Most likey, the engine is fine. Most likely, it simply detected an issue and shut itself off. Were it my vehicle, I would make damned sure to have it checked with great regularity to prevent problems down the road (well, if it were my vehicle, I would've checked the oil sooner). Just because you "know cars" doesn't mean that you know the law. You might want to advise her to contact an attorney before building her expectations up with the possibility of an entire new car.

01-31-2004, 09:56 PM	#52 (permalink)
big_bubba Psycho	If it runs, it's fine. If it dies or seizes, THEN go after honda for a new engine. If not, grow up and stop trying to milk it for more than it's worth.

02-07-2004, 08:33 PM	#53 (permalink)
pocon1 Banned	As far as burning oil, the limit for most manufacturers is about 500-1000 miles per quart. Anything above that is hunky-dory. However, a low-mileage new car should not even be burning a quart per 3,000 miles.