DEI37

Yeah, the design of the car does come from Holden, a GM of Australia company. The reasoning? Simple. Vastly cuts time to production, and most importantly...cost. I saw pics of the CTS-V. That car kicks ass. BMW's M5 test driver went out on the Nurburgring (sp?) road course, and in the first few laps with the car, had already bested the M5's fast lap...and he's familiar with the M5!!! That says something. Having the GTO in the form that they brought it back in is also smart. It's a proven platform. The engine is reliable, and the rest of the car has already had the majority of it's kinks worked out in the Australian marketplace. Sure, a few changes had to be made, but most of them probably come from having to switch the front seat positions and dashboard assemblies. GM did it right. The car looks to be the real deal, and based on the pro's reviews...it's gonna be stiff competition for anything in its class.

Now, for the personal attack on me, silent_jay...get a grip. NASCAR drivers are among the world's top athletes. There is competition in the NASCAR ranks, unlike F1, where a close race has 5 seconds separating first and second. In NASCAR, the entire field of 43 can be separated by that amount of time. That takes skill to drive 170+ mph, 3 wide, 10 deep. And, it's more fun to watch like that. You'll NEVER hear a team order to let a team mate win by pulling over and let him pass. Hell, no. Where I come from, if you want the spot, you don't whine to your "boss" to get your team mate to pull over, and let me by. You go race for it...you WORK for it. Gimme's...what a bunch of pansy asses.

I'll quit. I like this place too much to get really pissed...and that's where I'm headed. G'nite, y'all.

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DEI37

Oh, and by the way, yeah, I do like the Grand Prix. A lot of go for the money, and it out does most of the cars in it's class, and some in a higher class. I have driven a GTP Comp...it rides well, handles solidly, and even the interior feels like quality. I like the Grand Am GT as well, albeit to a lesser degree.

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silent_jay

sorry about the attack on NASCAR i just have issues with racing around an oval for 4 hours, and when they do a road course thier top speed is what 89 mph. F1 drivers are just more highly skilled in my opinion because they have to make left and right turns at break neck speeds and they have the lower competitors who don't always want to let the leaders pass clean. but they are not as skilled as FIA rally drivers these men and women are nuts going 100+mph with tree's a foot off your door that's crazy.

once again sorry for the personal attack it won't happen again

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DEI37

Thanks, silent_jay...apology accepted. No hard feelings here. I was tired, and not feeling good...may have blown it out of proportion.

And now...ON WITH THE SHOW!

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Scorps

Humm would have to look into that

dailyjo2003

The GTO doesn't really make me go Wow. Could of been better design.

merkerguitars

Well I saw one this past Monday....and wow these cars look better in person...I like the fact when you pop the hood they look easy to work on which = easier hotrodding. Very Comfortable on the inside too....It even has a factory strut bar on it.

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powerclown

Thats a GTO in name only.

These are GTOs.

[IMG]http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0RQAAAOMTrpmNsHV9QPj*GZW6qdXGyrJQ42z1d*XZqon467PhoJtrcmjFm2HGl6ySq0M6KuWUtlzvyHBkKTcuTdfJnygK30wIZ4NSQWMetyk/66_00159_2.jpg?dc=4675456584808861728[/IMG]

[IMG]http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0RQAAA98TvpiNsHV9QPj*GWLJ4*LlyUM72zf5!mH3XXeYwgykkFSeAlQkBIQnk93QVLj!8Wc8hgPuCXXiZY76uj1frT0uO5fFMOBS2GhNsrs/66_00172_3.jpg?dc=4675456584811274864[/IMG]

A GTO, ahhaahahahaa, thats a good one. Its a Sunfire/GrandPrix/Celica/Cougar girly car.

HunterDevourer

Think Holden is owned by GM, but they run independently in R&D (I assume) due to the different needs of the Australian market. Though Holden have begun to use corvette engines in their sports cars...and I think they now use mainly American V8s...(When they make a V8 car that is, majority of their designs are V6s or 4 cylinders I think...)

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HunterDevourer

http://www.holden.com.au/www-holden/...d=5&catid=1004
Can see some pictures of the Holden Monaro there, quite similar but it has larger rim sizes on the mag wheels, maybe a few other differences.
Powerclown : I wouldn't suggest you say that to any Australian holden fans, you'd get a bloody nose quick smart
Holden re-released the monaro because it was resurrecting the old coupe from the 70s, and most people I've talked to reckon they did it justice.

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mr_mcrafe

I'm disappointed it looks quite so similar to the Monaro, although the Monaro can look bloody good. The top spec one looks awesome in real life...

onetime2

The designers should be forced to drive Yugos until they can fully comprehend what an opportunity they just wasted. GTOs were awesome cars. That's a Grand Am with a big engine. Absolute waste of a billion $ to come up with.

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stingc

Do you realize that the original GTO was a rebadged LeMans/Tempest with a bigger engine? It was not a standout car for its time (looks-wise). Its only because of the history that people think it looks so unique now. The philosophy on the new GTO is exactly what the old one was - a normal, relatively cheap car with a great engine.

BoCo

Agreed! Just because you can slap a logo on a car doesn't make it the real thing. The current Impala is also an embarrassment.

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onetime2

It's not about where it came from/how it was produced but that it had classic lines and styling details that set it apart from its origins. This new version has none of that, only some badges saying GTO. They had an opportunity to create something significant, instead they threw a V8 into a generic car and didn't add any style to it.

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bad30th

The Impala is a completely different case.....they took it from a large-displacement, front engine REAR WHEEL DRIVE V8 in a full size car to a small displacement FRONT WHEEL DRIVE V-fucking-6 in a mid-size car....

The GTO, however is still front engine rear wheel drive with plenty of power in that LS1 to eat the old GTOs alive.....

Like I said, I am not a fan of the looks of it, but jesus christ, the originals werent exactly pretty in ther day either. But they performed, and thets what mattered to people.

To all those who say "ITS NOT A GTO ! ! !" Why do you say that? What makes it not a GTO? I mean the names been gone for 30 years or more, what did you expect it to look like when it came back? Exactly like the original? Because I tend to think thats the only way you would have been happy with it....

powerclown

see 2005 Ford Mustang GT, 2005 Chevrolet Corvette

(actually look like the originals, gasp!)

Why even call it a GTO? What makes a GTO a GTO? What makes a Vette a Vette?

They should call it The 2005 Pontiac Cupcake...

bad30th

ROFL thats the best line I've heard all day!

Peryn

Hmm....yeah...i can hardly tell the difference between the new and old one.

The fact is, you only think they looked like the originals because you got to see them evolve. Take out all the middle ones, and they hardly look like theyd be the same car. Hell, the 62 and 63 Dont even look too much like the same car. I do imagine that if GM had kept the GTO name around, it would still probably end up look very similar to this one by now. But you wouldn't think anything of it, because you would have seen it evolve.

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bad30th

That was kinda part of my point that I forgot to include, Peryn. Thank you for pointing that out

Scorps

Damn right I really don't care that it looks like a Grand Am, I just want the HP.......I would also love to aftermarket the shit out of that car with 17 or 18 inch rims redone interior and a sound system!

Damnfinn

doesn't do a thing for me.
Understated styling means to me they can't think of anything exciting.

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Damnfinn

BoCo, those are true Goats !

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Damnfinn

Right on Powerclown !

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Scorps

I'm just glad they didn't make a Judge yet!


Can't remake that!

onetime2

Not true at all. If they had added some style it would be a different story. There isn't a scoop, line, or curve that shows any originality in the new version. While the old ones were supposed to be "sleepers" they held hints other than a nameplate that they were different from their forefathers.

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Damnfinn

Pain train, Sorry if I stepped on your toes, I wasn't slamming you or the car so much as showing I'm an old fart that prefered the classic GTO. No disrepect intended.

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Scorps

I'm a young lad and I still like the classics more....just that I wouldn't mind taking one for a rip!

No hard feelings!

lakefire

I had to join this conversation and put an end to all of this:

1) Yes this is a re-badged Monaro (and Holden is owned by GM)...
2) The firebird was a re-badged Camaro but you didn't see people whine and complain about that all the live long day.

3) Retro is ugly. It's a novelty design that quickly wears away: ie thunderbird.

4) What is a GTO? Is it flashy hood ornaments? goofy colored stripe combinations. Or is it a Rear wheel drive 2+2 kick you in the teeth type of performing car?

I don't understand how you can HATE this car so much without even driving it. It's funny. Granted the design doesn't have anything to be desired, but it doesn't have anything to hate either.

The interior however is class leading (in my opinion) and the suspension (as rated by magazines) is world class.

Would you rather have in the pontiac line-up a bunch of 4 door v6 family cars? or would you like to have a GTO that can kick the ass of some POS mustang?

anyways, most of ya'll frustrated me with your pure ignorance off of a design. Retro sucks, that is why the mustang will have a tired look in only a couple of years.



Here's something I did in photoshop for fun. LONG live the GTO!

silent_jay

wow just when i thought i couldn't dislike this car anymore this happens. Orange looks good on very few cars and this is not one of them. Not flaming just opinion,

I'll take a proven European company over a fancied up Grand Prix anyday.

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bad30th

proven by whom.....

PoteMatic

I do not liek the new one at all i dont know why i just dont like that look or the look of many of the new pontiacs.

Scorps

What are you talking about, orange looks sweet!

merkerguitars

You should see the yellow one at a dealership I went to....actually doesn't look too bad.....and I checked the sticked price....Good performer for the money

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silent_jay

you have your opinion i have mine c'est la vie.

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Scorps

True

Cordachine007

TO PAIN TRAIN:
I like the performance of the new GTO for the price, but I was hoping for something a little different in exterior styling. That said it is still pretty sweet.

Nice war.

Scorps

LOL I didn't mean for this thread to turn into a war.....I just posted the new pictures!

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miko

OMG, absolutely horrible!
I can't believe they actually did a good design job with the Solstice when they're putting out crap like this.

silent_jay

let's not get on that Solstice, if that's a good job well they should go beck to the drawing board.

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