Buying a car this weekend - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

hambone · 03-16-2007, 07:40 AM

Ok, I would like anyone's advice opinions on this as soon as possible.

This is how it went:
My wife and I have been sharing 1 car for about 2 years now(2003 Honda Accord Coupe) and its about time we get another one.

The requirements for the new one are the following:
1. 4-door
2. Decent gas mileage
3. Under $20,000
4. New or Used is ok, but now leaning towards new (see below)
5. Roomy enough to store stuff.
6. Can eventually fit a carseat in the back
7. ABS
8. Side airbags a plus
9. Stereo not too important, but do like the aux audio jack some have

---
We initially looked at a Prius and liked it, but for 2006 or 2007 models, they are a little out of our price range. So we looked some more.

2 days ago and went an test drove a Toyota Matrix. I liked the look, the room was ok, and the motor totally disappointed me. On the highway, it really whined getting up to speed. (its a 1.8) But gas mileage seems to be good on that.

Yesterday I drove a Mazda3 (2007, hatchback model, 2.3L). I really liked it. It ran good, felt tight to the road and rode comfortably. It also looks very nice inside and comes standard (the hatchback models at least) with side airbags, the aux audio jack, and ABS. The front was very roomy, and the hatchback allows for much storing. Both backseat fold down too.

My concerns with it are, its still a little pricey (they only sell new ones where I went and I do like the features on the 2007 as opposed to 2006 anyway) and I am not too sure if there is quite enough room in the backseat . However, in this size of car, I think its pretty normal amount of room.

Mazda has a 3.9% financing deal until April 2nd, so that is awesome (we have the money to buy it outright,but instead will let it sit in our savings account which is earning 5.1%).

Anyway, please lend me your thoughts! I am seriously considering trying to negotiate a good price on this this weekend. Is this a good buy? Any alternatives?

Thanks.

desal75 · 03-16-2007, 07:59 AM

What about a Pontiac G6?

dirtyrascal7 · 03-16-2007, 08:46 AM

First, I wouldn't put any time constraints on making a purchase this big... unless you have no other mode of transportation, I would take my time and do plenty of research and test driving to reduce the chance of having buyer's remorse later on.

That said, you might want to look at the Hyundai Sonata... it competes against the Honda Accord and Toyota Camry. You can get a 234-hp V6 model that lists around $21k... so with a little negotiation you could probably get it for under $20k. The V6 gets pretty decent gas mileage also at 20/30mpg. It is sporty like the Mazda 3, but a bit roomier... plus it comes with a 10-year/100k mile warranty.

hambone · 03-16-2007, 08:50 AM

Thanks everyone, keep em coming.

I kind of like the whole hatchback design. I know that not a huge factor, but my wife and I both do like it.

And while, yes it seems rushed, we have been looking for a new car for around 6 months, its just reaching critical annoyance levels at this point and we would really like to make this change soon.

I will look at the Sonata online and see if it seems what we want, then maybe take one for a ride.

I don't know about the Pontiac. Looks neat, but seems like its even a little tighter in the back than the Mazda.

politicophile · 03-16-2007, 09:52 AM

2007 VW Jetta starts at $16,490 with the 2.5 liter. 2.0T is a little out of your pricerange: $22,110 - but that's a really stellar vehicle.

2007 Subaru Legacy Special Edition starts at $20,795. AWD is probably not a big priority in CA, but this is a very nice vehicle. I can't stand FWD, so this one would be near the top of my list.

2007 Subaru Impreza 2.5i starts at $17,995. The WRX is slightly out of your stated price range, but even the base model is a solid vehicle - fun to drive.

2007 Chevrolet Cobalt SS starts at $18,850 - A very well-respected performance car in this price range. I'm not a domestic fan, but this is a nice car.

2007 Pontiac G6 starts at $17,825 - A bit larger than the others I have listed - a better choice if you need more space.

The Mazda would also be a good choice. At this stange in the process, I suggest you just go out a testdrive a bunch of cars, including the ones I have listed, to see what you like. Car buying is a very subjective activity, so you will only end up with the best vehicle for you if you take the time to sample all the possibilities firsthand. Good luck with your shopping process.

braisler · 03-16-2007, 10:32 AM

Buying a new car, any new car, is for suckers. Sorry, but you are taking a 25-40% hit on depreciation as soon as you drive it off the lot. Then you will not look so wise with your savings earning 5.1% and your 3.9% loan.

3.9% loan of $20000 on a car that is only worth $14000 is a bad deal. Find a car that is a year old or less from a private party (NOT A DEALER) and buy theirs at $14000 outright. Or less! Use the power of having the cash to make the deal happen. If a private party is asking $15000 for their used car, likely most of their potential buyers have to talk with a bank about financing, etc. etc. etc. If you come up with $13000 (or whatever you think the car is really worth) in cash, they may be inclined to take it.

All that aside, you can find some real nice cars under $20000 on the used market. I bought a 2003 BMW 525i touring wagon last year for $19500. Original owner still had the sticker - she paid $55800!!! Moral of the story - let someone else suffer the depreciation.

S44 · 03-16-2007, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by braisler

Moral of the story - let someone else suffer the depreciation.

That's a valid point, but there's also a tremendous amount of risk involved with buying a used car. It could have been in a major accident and be passed off as pristine, despite the huge loss you would be dealt by buying an accident-ridden car. It could have certain features not working...like maybe the airbags were taken out and never put back in...or electrical problems...or a poorly cared for powertrain (though that's less of a problem these days). And, as an aside, you can NEVER blindly trust CarFax..my parents' Lexus was in four accidents--that's four police reports, four trips to the collision shop--and yet NOTHING shows up on CarFax or Autocheck.

Personally I love the Mazda3...but its major draw is its sportiness and that doesn't seem to be one of your priorities. If you like the sporty feel to the point where you are in love with the Mazdas, take a look at the Mazda6 (probably the 4-cyl i to keep it in your price range). They are amazing cars, loads of fun to drive, but they're at the end of their produce cycle and selling really slowly--just have a look at the amazing incentives. On my dealer's lot, there are still tons of '06 leftovers. Oh, and it comes in a hatch version taht looks identical to the sedan, or a wagon if that's your thing.

The Hyundai Sonata that someone mentioned would be an excellent choice based on your listed priorities. It's comfortable, great value, well-built, powerful V6/economical I4, roomy, very safe, and has that crazy warranty.

Honda Accord is another great choice...quite similar to the Hyundai, but more fun to drive and less depreciation...although its starting price is higher.

Stay away from the G6...it's a subpar car and depreciation is killer.

I love the Subarus, but living in CA will mean that all AWD will really do is add weight and hurt fuel mileage.

hambone · 03-16-2007, 03:22 PM

Thanks everyone...lots to still consider

DEI37 · 03-16-2007, 04:47 PM

You can get a new Altima under $20k. The G6 is a good car, too.

jorgelito · 03-16-2007, 05:02 PM

Get a Honda Civic. The DX and LX levels are cheaper, definitely under 20K. If you want, I can give you a referral for a car dealer (internet quote for around the INVOICE price).

hambone · 03-16-2007, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jorgelito

Get a Honda Civic. The DX and LX levels are cheaper, definitely under 20K. If you want, I can give you a referral for a car dealer (internet quote for around the INVOICE price).

Sure, please send me that. I will look into it.

jorgelito · 03-16-2007, 07:10 PM

Ok Mr. Hambone, I just pm'ed you allthe info. Also, don't forget - California DMV has a fees calculator so you can know exactly (pretty damn close) the taxes, and fees are supposed to cost. Dealers frequently pad this area, but I brought in my dmv sheet with the exact numbers so they couldn't pull a fast one.

newtx · 03-17-2007, 03:38 AM

Not much of a risk factor when spending $20,000 or less on a quality used vehicle. Stay with a 1/2 year old vehicle with low miles and still under full factory warranty that is transferrable to you. Let somebody else take the huge depreciation on the new vehicle. Some personal favorites in your price range in no particular order: 04 accura 3.2tl, Honda Accord EX, Toyota Camry, Nissan altima or maxima.

ChrisJericho · 03-17-2007, 06:23 PM

The subaru impreza wagon is also a good choice!

imouseone · 03-17-2007, 09:19 PM

I recommend:

awd - Subaru Impreza 2.5i
fwd - Mazda 3
Can't go wrong with any Toyota or Honda
Stay away from VW's imo

hambone · 03-18-2007, 07:04 AM

Ok, so here is the story:

I was all set to go with the Mazda3. They were giving me 3.9% on a 60 month loan and for $586 UNDER invoice (incl. destination charge...if that shouldn't be, then its afew dollars OVER invoice) in Galaxy Gray (my choice).

Perfect.

I get there, the guy comes out and says, sorry he was moving the car and he hit something. He even showed me, big dent above the tire. I don't want any problems if I am actually getting a new car, so I asked if they had any more. The had one in Galaxy gray, but with leather interior (+$580) or a silver one, just like I wanted.

I was bummed , but said we could still do the silver.

We go in do all the paperwork, get the credit check, all looks great. He then comes back and says he was wrong and the 3.9% for 60 month deal ended Friday (this was Saturday, and I had initially went to him on Thursday, when he insured me that it would be good through the weekend at least).

Anyway, this pissed me off, and I told him so. He had now switched the car and the interest rate on me, and while I agreed the price is awesome, that still sucks for my monthly payments.

He said they had a 3.9 for 36 months or something, but again doesn't help.

I even asked if I could get the leather interior for the same price and he said no, so I decided enough was enough and walked out (literally, I had to walk back home since my wife had our car

)

Good thing is I did the whole internet quote thing and got a hit in SF for the color I want, the make I want, for only 3 dollars more than this place (so still $583 UNDER invoice), with a 3.9% rate on 48 months.

That is good just this weekend I believe, but I refuse to be pressured, so I contacted him, told him, I was shopping for better financing, but would let him know if I can make it today or not. Also, told him I am shopping around for Civics now too (have some quote feelers out now too). My gut still wants the Mazda3, but not if it comes with the pressure.

S44 · 03-18-2007, 08:03 AM

http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/disp...entives.action

Put in your zip and find the real financing deal in your area.

Mazda3's can easily be had for under invoice. The amount below invoice you got is a good target price, but you can get the same elsewhere (as you figured out)

I'd still go with a leftover 2006 Mazda6 if I were you....

hambone · 03-18-2007, 09:07 PM

I still can't decide....

Drove the Civic today. Liked the Mazda more, but can't decide how much more.

Now just trying to find rock bottom financing.

My current choices are:
Mazda3 5-Door sTouring model
Honda Civic EX (or LX) 4-Door Sedan
Honda Fit Sport

I plan to drive the Fit soon, cause I keep reading good things, EXCEPT for acceleration. It can't be too crappy, or its off the list.

Right now, if money and financing weren't the drawbacks, I would get the Mazda. These Honda's can probably be gotten cheaper, but I have a draw continuously to the stinkin Mazda.

AHHHHHHH

blizzak · 03-19-2007, 02:05 AM

As much as I just hate civics as a matter of personal preference, I hate Mazda even more in terms of reliability. Probably the best indicator is the JD Power rankings, among hundreds of other articles and discussions out there:

http://www.jdpower.com/autos/Honda/Civic/2007
http://www.jdpower.com/autos/mazda/m...2007/hatchback

That having been said, Toyota still has the best quality out of any car company. In my line of work, I frequent car plants very much and have been in and out of GM, Honda and Toyota plants and can tell you that Toyota has the most stellar quality control you could imagine from an auto manufacturer. Honda is still very high up there, and from what I have heard honda makes the best engines. Between Honda and Mazda I would highly recommend the Honda. It really is a scenario of getting what you pay for in the long run.

03-16-2007, 07:40 AM	#1 (permalink)
hambone Zeroed In Location: CA	Buying a car this weekend Ok, I would like anyone's advice opinions on this as soon as possible. This is how it went: My wife and I have been sharing 1 car for about 2 years now(2003 Honda Accord Coupe) and its about time we get another one. The requirements for the new one are the following: 1. 4-door 2. Decent gas mileage 3. Under $20,000 4. New or Used is ok, but now leaning towards new (see below) 5. Roomy enough to store stuff. 6. Can eventually fit a carseat in the back 7. ABS 8. Side airbags a plus 9. Stereo not too important, but do like the aux audio jack some have --- We initially looked at a Prius and liked it, but for 2006 or 2007 models, they are a little out of our price range. So we looked some more. 2 days ago and went an test drove a Toyota Matrix. I liked the look, the room was ok, and the motor totally disappointed me. On the highway, it really whined getting up to speed. (its a 1.8) But gas mileage seems to be good on that. Yesterday I drove a Mazda3 (2007, hatchback model, 2.3L). I really liked it. It ran good, felt tight to the road and rode comfortably. It also looks very nice inside and comes standard (the hatchback models at least) with side airbags, the aux audio jack, and ABS. The front was very roomy, and the hatchback allows for much storing. Both backseat fold down too. My concerns with it are, its still a little pricey (they only sell new ones where I went and I do like the features on the 2007 as opposed to 2006 anyway) and I am not too sure if there is quite enough room in the backseat . However, in this size of car, I think its pretty normal amount of room. Mazda has a 3.9% financing deal until April 2nd, so that is awesome (we have the money to buy it outright,but instead will let it sit in our savings account which is earning 5.1%). Anyway, please lend me your thoughts! I am seriously considering trying to negotiate a good price on this this weekend. Is this a good buy? Any alternatives? Thanks. __________________ "Like liquid white from fallen glass, Nothing to cry over"

03-16-2007, 07:59 AM	#2 (permalink)
desal75 Psycho Location: Western New York	What about a Pontiac G6? __________________ The Man in Black fled across the desert and the Gunslinger followed.

03-16-2007, 08:46 AM	#3 (permalink)
dirtyrascal7 That's what she said	First, I wouldn't put any time constraints on making a purchase this big... unless you have no other mode of transportation, I would take my time and do plenty of research and test driving to reduce the chance of having buyer's remorse later on. That said, you might want to look at the Hyundai Sonata... it competes against the Honda Accord and Toyota Camry. You can get a 234-hp V6 model that lists around $21k... so with a little negotiation you could probably get it for under $20k. The V6 gets pretty decent gas mileage also at 20/30mpg. It is sporty like the Mazda 3, but a bit roomier... plus it comes with a 10-year/100k mile warranty. __________________ "Tie yourself to your limitless potential, rather than your limiting past." "Every man I meet is my superior in some way. In that, I learn of him."

03-16-2007, 08:50 AM	#4 (permalink)
hambone Zeroed In Location: CA	Thanks everyone, keep em coming. I kind of like the whole hatchback design. I know that not a huge factor, but my wife and I both do like it. And while, yes it seems rushed, we have been looking for a new car for around 6 months, its just reaching critical annoyance levels at this point and we would really like to make this change soon. I will look at the Sonata online and see if it seems what we want, then maybe take one for a ride. I don't know about the Pontiac. Looks neat, but seems like its even a little tighter in the back than the Mazda. __________________ "Like liquid white from fallen glass, Nothing to cry over"

03-16-2007, 09:52 AM	#5 (permalink)
politicophile Addict	2007 VW Jetta starts at $16,490 with the 2.5 liter. 2.0T is a little out of your pricerange: $22,110 - but that's a really stellar vehicle. 2007 Subaru Legacy Special Edition starts at $20,795. AWD is probably not a big priority in CA, but this is a very nice vehicle. I can't stand FWD, so this one would be near the top of my list. 2007 Subaru Impreza 2.5i starts at $17,995. The WRX is slightly out of your stated price range, but even the base model is a solid vehicle - fun to drive. 2007 Chevrolet Cobalt SS starts at $18,850 - A very well-respected performance car in this price range. I'm not a domestic fan, but this is a nice car. 2007 Pontiac G6 starts at $17,825 - A bit larger than the others I have listed - a better choice if you need more space. The Mazda would also be a good choice. At this stange in the process, I suggest you just go out a testdrive a bunch of cars, including the ones I have listed, to see what you like. Car buying is a very subjective activity, so you will only end up with the best vehicle for you if you take the time to sample all the possibilities firsthand. Good luck with your shopping process. __________________ The peculiar evil of silencing the expression of an opinion is, that it is robbing the human race; posterity as well as the existing generation; those who dissent from the opinion, still more than those who hold it. If the opinion is right, they are deprived of the opportunity of exchanging error for truth: if wrong, they lose, what is almost as great a benefit, the clearer perception and livelier impression of truth, produced by its collision with error. ~John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

03-16-2007, 10:32 AM	#6 (permalink)
braisler Addict Location: Midway, KY	Buying a new car, any new car, is for suckers. Sorry, but you are taking a 25-40% hit on depreciation as soon as you drive it off the lot. Then you will not look so wise with your savings earning 5.1% and your 3.9% loan. 3.9% loan of $20000 on a car that is only worth $14000 is a bad deal. Find a car that is a year old or less from a private party (NOT A DEALER) and buy theirs at $14000 outright. Or less! Use the power of having the cash to make the deal happen. If a private party is asking $15000 for their used car, likely most of their potential buyers have to talk with a bank about financing, etc. etc. etc. If you come up with $13000 (or whatever you think the car is really worth) in cash, they may be inclined to take it. All that aside, you can find some real nice cars under $20000 on the used market. I bought a 2003 BMW 525i touring wagon last year for $19500. Original owner still had the sticker - she paid $55800!!! Moral of the story - let someone else suffer the depreciation. __________________ --- You do not really understand something unless you can explain it to your grandmother. - Albert Einstein --- Last edited by braisler; 03-16-2007 at 10:33 AM.. Reason: <grammar> ;)

03-16-2007, 03:22 PM	#8 (permalink)
hambone Zeroed In Location: CA	Thanks everyone...lots to still consider __________________ "Like liquid white from fallen glass, Nothing to cry over"

03-16-2007, 04:47 PM	#9 (permalink)
DEI37 Go faster! Location: Wisconsin	You can get a new Altima under $20k. The G6 is a good car, too. __________________ Generally speaking, if you were to get what you really deserve, you might be unpleasantly surprised.

03-16-2007, 05:02 PM	#10 (permalink)
jorgelito All important elusive independent swing voter... Location: People's Republic of KKKalifornia	Get a Honda Civic. The DX and LX levels are cheaper, definitely under 20K. If you want, I can give you a referral for a car dealer (internet quote for around the INVOICE price).

03-16-2007, 07:10 PM	#12 (permalink)
jorgelito All important elusive independent swing voter... Location: People's Republic of KKKalifornia	Ok Mr. Hambone, I just pm'ed you allthe info. Also, don't forget - California DMV has a fees calculator so you can know exactly (pretty damn close) the taxes, and fees are supposed to cost. Dealers frequently pad this area, but I brought in my dmv sheet with the exact numbers so they couldn't pull a fast one.

03-17-2007, 03:38 AM	#13 (permalink)
newtx Addict	Not much of a risk factor when spending $20,000 or less on a quality used vehicle. Stay with a 1/2 year old vehicle with low miles and still under full factory warranty that is transferrable to you. Let somebody else take the huge depreciation on the new vehicle. Some personal favorites in your price range in no particular order: 04 accura 3.2tl, Honda Accord EX, Toyota Camry, Nissan altima or maxima.

03-17-2007, 06:23 PM	#14 (permalink)
ChrisJericho eat more fruit Location: Seattle	The subaru impreza wagon is also a good choice! __________________ "A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows us that faith proves nothing." - Friedrich Nietzsche

03-17-2007, 09:19 PM	#15 (permalink)
imouseone Tilted Location: NY	I recommend: awd - Subaru Impreza 2.5i fwd - Mazda 3 Can't go wrong with any Toyota or Honda Stay away from VW's imo

03-18-2007, 07:04 AM	#16 (permalink)
hambone Zeroed In Location: CA	Ok, so here is the story: I was all set to go with the Mazda3. They were giving me 3.9% on a 60 month loan and for $586 UNDER invoice (incl. destination charge...if that shouldn't be, then its afew dollars OVER invoice) in Galaxy Gray (my choice). Perfect. I get there, the guy comes out and says, sorry he was moving the car and he hit something. He even showed me, big dent above the tire. I don't want any problems if I am actually getting a new car, so I asked if they had any more. The had one in Galaxy gray, but with leather interior (+$580) or a silver one, just like I wanted. I was bummed , but said we could still do the silver. We go in do all the paperwork, get the credit check, all looks great. He then comes back and says he was wrong and the 3.9% for 60 month deal ended Friday (this was Saturday, and I had initially went to him on Thursday, when he insured me that it would be good through the weekend at least). Anyway, this pissed me off, and I told him so. He had now switched the car and the interest rate on me, and while I agreed the price is awesome, that still sucks for my monthly payments. He said they had a 3.9 for 36 months or something, but again doesn't help. I even asked if I could get the leather interior for the same price and he said no, so I decided enough was enough and walked out (literally, I had to walk back home since my wife had our car ) Good thing is I did the whole internet quote thing and got a hit in SF for the color I want, the make I want, for only 3 dollars more than this place (so still $583 UNDER invoice), with a 3.9% rate on 48 months. That is good just this weekend I believe, but I refuse to be pressured, so I contacted him, told him, I was shopping for better financing, but would let him know if I can make it today or not. Also, told him I am shopping around for Civics now too (have some quote feelers out now too). My gut still wants the Mazda3, but not if it comes with the pressure. __________________ "Like liquid white from fallen glass, Nothing to cry over" Last edited by hambone; 03-18-2007 at 07:07 AM..

03-18-2007, 08:03 AM	#17 (permalink)
S44 Banned	http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/disp...entives.action Put in your zip and find the real financing deal in your area. Mazda3's can easily be had for under invoice. The amount below invoice you got is a good target price, but you can get the same elsewhere (as you figured out) I'd still go with a leftover 2006 Mazda6 if I were you....

03-18-2007, 09:07 PM	#18 (permalink)
hambone Zeroed In Location: CA	I still can't decide.... Drove the Civic today. Liked the Mazda more, but can't decide how much more. Now just trying to find rock bottom financing. My current choices are: Mazda3 5-Door sTouring model Honda Civic EX (or LX) 4-Door Sedan Honda Fit Sport I plan to drive the Fit soon, cause I keep reading good things, EXCEPT for acceleration. It can't be too crappy, or its off the list. Right now, if money and financing weren't the drawbacks, I would get the Mazda. These Honda's can probably be gotten cheaper, but I have a draw continuously to the stinkin Mazda. AHHHHHHH __________________ "Like liquid white from fallen glass, Nothing to cry over"

03-19-2007, 02:05 AM	#19 (permalink)
blizzak Crazy	As much as I just hate civics as a matter of personal preference, I hate Mazda even more in terms of reliability. Probably the best indicator is the JD Power rankings, among hundreds of other articles and discussions out there: http://www.jdpower.com/autos/Honda/Civic/2007 http://www.jdpower.com/autos/mazda/m...2007/hatchback That having been said, Toyota still has the best quality out of any car company. In my line of work, I frequent car plants very much and have been in and out of GM, Honda and Toyota plants and can tell you that Toyota has the most stellar quality control you could imagine from an auto manufacturer. Honda is still very high up there, and from what I have heard honda makes the best engines. Between Honda and Mazda I would highly recommend the Honda. It really is a scenario of getting what you pay for in the long run. __________________ Fueled by oxytocin!