Discussion - The nature of magic in fiction - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

losthellhound · 10-23-2003, 11:23 AM

Disclaimer - Im not really sure how many people visit this thread, and of those people, Im not really sure if there is a base of people who write, or even enjoy what is regularly called fantasy.. Some of the things I have posted here have floated by with no responses, or views for that fact, so I'm not sure.. I'll put out this bone, and see who bites..

What has been your favorite "system of magic" in literature (that you've read, or even better, what you've written yourself)

mb99usa · 10-23-2003, 11:24 AM

What do you mean by "system of magic"? Could you offer some examples?

Thanks

losthellhound · 10-23-2003, 11:31 AM

Okay..
Some settings offer magic as a thing you can learn.. (Riftwar Saga). You can learn phrases and write words of power
In Tad WIlliam's Memory Sorrow and Thorn, magic is something simpler, the way a song is sang..

A system of magic is simply put.. the way magic works.. and how people/or whatever influence it and use it..

mb99usa · 10-23-2003, 11:36 AM

I've always liked it when magic was something not easily done. A person wishing to perform magic either already had or was forced to go through intense training. Makes for a stronger argument the power magic can have.

Sorry but I cannot think of any examples right now.

Lunchbox7 · 10-23-2003, 12:13 PM

Magic is a hell of a lot of power. i personally think that power should be earned through discipline. Any system with this philosophy I usually like.

losthellhound · 10-23-2003, 11:00 PM

I agree with the price of magic, and that it is a hell of a lot of power.. I tend to favor the wild magic though.. Stories where even though magic is powerful, and difficult, it is also fickle.. more it choosing people, then people choosing it

mb99usa · 10-24-2003, 05:57 AM

Or the kind of magic that does not always work as expected. Always adds a good twist as well as some comedic touches.

J.R.V.A. · 10-30-2003, 03:13 PM

Is magic in the eye of the beholder, or the magican? As far as system of magic in writing, I don't read a lot of fantasty stuff, but to me, The magic of writing is when I am whisked off to some place other than where I am at. In that sense, A lot of good writers to me are magicians. As far as writing goes, to me, it is magic when I write. I hear a word, or a phrase, and the words seem to flow from me like magic. It may not be that good, but it feels like someone else it doing it.

vonstalhein · 10-30-2003, 03:24 PM

I love fantasy! I read a book once, called something like 'Something of Recluse' and the system was brilliant. The premise was that there existed three primary types of magick, White, black and grey, but it totally turned my preconceptions on their head. It reasoned black, comforting and all absorbant was the 'good' type. White was chaotic basically, and grey was a really dangerous mixture. The wya people used this magick is something i really identified with. Basically, you had to find the power within yourself, and it took a great deal of concentration and internal willpower to control and master, and it more often than not left the caster extremely fatigued. At the end of the seocnd novel in the series, three 'good' magus' kill themselves in summoning a huge storm! i loved it!!!

ratbastid · 10-30-2003, 04:41 PM

In the <i>His Dark Materials</i> series, what we would call "magic" is referred to in the alternate universe of the story as "Theological Science". It has a very mysterious, scientific, steam-punkish feel. Very neat.

losthellhound · 10-30-2003, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ratbastid
In the <i>His Dark Materials</i> series, what we would call "magic" is referred to in the alternate universe of the story as "Theological Science". It has a very mysterious, scientific, steam-punkish feel. Very neat.

I love the idea that magic can be mixed with science.. Often it gets a very turn of the century industrial revolution feel.

Eldaire · 10-30-2003, 06:35 PM

I like the type of magic like in Alleria.com. It involves a lot of focus and a lot of training, as well as a clear mind.

losthellhound · 10-30-2003, 08:59 PM

Seems there is a trend here.. Lots of work, Sacrifice, etc..

A friend and me were talking about that trend tonight.. We think that there is a tendancy towards it taking alot of work because 1) We have always been taught that to get anything you have to work hard, and that translates into literature, even fantasy or 2) it lends an air of "anyone can do it if thye work hard at it"

What do you think of a .. Royal system.. Its harder to explain, but think about it.. To use magic you have to be of a certain family, have the right bloodlines, and there isnt any work for you to use the power you now have.. (No add to that a devine right of kings attiture where because the royal mage is so powerful, they have to use the power accordingly)

vonstalhein · 10-31-2003, 03:26 AM

sounds interesting. Also sounds like it should fit with the style of your prologue (from what i can gather) but it must sound, and FEEL right.

losthellhound · 10-31-2003, 01:50 PM

Im thinking I can do that

thanks

10-23-2003, 11:23 AM	#1 (permalink)
losthellhound Thats MR. Muffin Face now Location: Everywhere work sends me	Discussion - The nature of magic in fiction Disclaimer - Im not really sure how many people visit this thread, and of those people, Im not really sure if there is a base of people who write, or even enjoy what is regularly called fantasy.. Some of the things I have posted here have floated by with no responses, or views for that fact, so I'm not sure.. I'll put out this bone, and see who bites.. What has been your favorite "system of magic" in literature (that you've read, or even better, what you've written yourself) __________________ "Life is possible only with illusions. And so, the question for the science of mental health must become an absolutely new and revolutionary one, yet one that reflects the essence of the human condition: On what level of illusion does one live?" -- Ernest Becker, The Denial of Death

10-23-2003, 11:24 AM	#2 (permalink)
mb99usa Keep on rolling. It only hurts for a little while. Location: wherever I am	What do you mean by "system of magic"? Could you offer some examples? Thanks __________________ So, what's your point? It's not an attitude, it's a way of life.

10-23-2003, 11:31 AM	#3 (permalink)
losthellhound Thats MR. Muffin Face now Location: Everywhere work sends me	Okay.. Some settings offer magic as a thing you can learn.. (Riftwar Saga). You can learn phrases and write words of power In Tad WIlliam's Memory Sorrow and Thorn, magic is something simpler, the way a song is sang.. A system of magic is simply put.. the way magic works.. and how people/or whatever influence it and use it.. __________________ "Life is possible only with illusions. And so, the question for the science of mental health must become an absolutely new and revolutionary one, yet one that reflects the essence of the human condition: On what level of illusion does one live?" -- Ernest Becker, The Denial of Death

10-23-2003, 11:36 AM	#4 (permalink)
mb99usa Keep on rolling. It only hurts for a little while. Location: wherever I am	I've always liked it when magic was something not easily done. A person wishing to perform magic either already had or was forced to go through intense training. Makes for a stronger argument the power magic can have. Sorry but I cannot think of any examples right now. __________________ So, what's your point? It's not an attitude, it's a way of life.

10-23-2003, 11:00 PM	#6 (permalink)
losthellhound Thats MR. Muffin Face now Location: Everywhere work sends me	I agree with the price of magic, and that it is a hell of a lot of power.. I tend to favor the wild magic though.. Stories where even though magic is powerful, and difficult, it is also fickle.. more it choosing people, then people choosing it __________________ "Life is possible only with illusions. And so, the question for the science of mental health must become an absolutely new and revolutionary one, yet one that reflects the essence of the human condition: On what level of illusion does one live?" -- Ernest Becker, The Denial of Death

10-23-2003, 12:13 PM	#5 (permalink)
Lunchbox7 Addict	Magic is a hell of a lot of power. i personally think that power should be earned through discipline. Any system with this philosophy I usually like.

10-24-2003, 05:57 AM	#7 (permalink)
mb99usa Keep on rolling. It only hurts for a little while. Location: wherever I am	Or the kind of magic that does not always work as expected. Always adds a good twist as well as some comedic touches. __________________ So, what's your point? It's not an attitude, it's a way of life.

10-30-2003, 03:13 PM	#8 (permalink)
J.R.V.A. Junkie Location: Utah	Is magic in the eye of the beholder, or the magican? As far as system of magic in writing, I don't read a lot of fantasty stuff, but to me, The magic of writing is when I am whisked off to some place other than where I am at. In that sense, A lot of good writers to me are magicians. As far as writing goes, to me, it is magic when I write. I hear a word, or a phrase, and the words seem to flow from me like magic. It may not be that good, but it feels like someone else it doing it. __________________ And as she plays, her sweet song of laughter floats through the air and warms my heart

10-30-2003, 03:24 PM	#9 (permalink)
vonstalhein Insane Location: Where You Live.	I love fantasy! I read a book once, called something like 'Something of Recluse' and the system was brilliant. The premise was that there existed three primary types of magick, White, black and grey, but it totally turned my preconceptions on their head. It reasoned black, comforting and all absorbant was the 'good' type. White was chaotic basically, and grey was a really dangerous mixture. The wya people used this magick is something i really identified with. Basically, you had to find the power within yourself, and it took a great deal of concentration and internal willpower to control and master, and it more often than not left the caster extremely fatigued. At the end of the seocnd novel in the series, three 'good' magus' kill themselves in summoning a huge storm! i loved it!!! __________________ No Win No Fee

10-30-2003, 04:41 PM	#10 (permalink)
ratbastid Darth Papa Location: Yonder	In the <i>His Dark Materials</i> series, what we would call "magic" is referred to in the alternate universe of the story as "Theological Science". It has a very mysterious, scientific, steam-punkish feel. Very neat.

10-30-2003, 06:35 PM	#12 (permalink)
Eldaire Loser Location: Davidson College, NC	I like the type of magic like in Alleria.com. It involves a lot of focus and a lot of training, as well as a clear mind.

10-30-2003, 08:59 PM	#13 (permalink)
losthellhound Thats MR. Muffin Face now Location: Everywhere work sends me	Seems there is a trend here.. Lots of work, Sacrifice, etc.. A friend and me were talking about that trend tonight.. We think that there is a tendancy towards it taking alot of work because 1) We have always been taught that to get anything you have to work hard, and that translates into literature, even fantasy or 2) it lends an air of "anyone can do it if thye work hard at it" What do you think of a .. Royal system.. Its harder to explain, but think about it.. To use magic you have to be of a certain family, have the right bloodlines, and there isnt any work for you to use the power you now have.. (No add to that a devine right of kings attiture where because the royal mage is so powerful, they have to use the power accordingly) __________________ "Life is possible only with illusions. And so, the question for the science of mental health must become an absolutely new and revolutionary one, yet one that reflects the essence of the human condition: On what level of illusion does one live?" -- Ernest Becker, The Denial of Death

10-31-2003, 03:26 AM	#14 (permalink)
vonstalhein Insane Location: Where You Live.	sounds interesting. Also sounds like it should fit with the style of your prologue (from what i can gather) but it must sound, and FEEL right. __________________ No Win No Fee

10-31-2003, 01:50 PM	#15 (permalink)
losthellhound Thats MR. Muffin Face now Location: Everywhere work sends me	Im thinking I can do that thanks __________________ "Life is possible only with illusions. And so, the question for the science of mental health must become an absolutely new and revolutionary one, yet one that reflects the essence of the human condition: On what level of illusion does one live?" -- Ernest Becker, The Denial of Death