Flipping Real Estate - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Force 10 · 03-24-2004, 05:17 PM

I'm incorporated with two other parties and (we) the LLC have 2 houses, a condo and a duplex...so far. I'm happy with this initial investment and I'm using this LLC as my retirement.

I'm 31 and so fucking done with my job it's not even funny. I can't stand the thought of working for someone else much longer. I'm currently in school for a Licensed Real Estate Salesperson (LRES) cert. I figure I'll get my license as a change of pace for the now and it can only prove to help me in my future endeavors.

I'm fairly new to Real Estate but so far, am VERY happy with my return on the landlord business. It sure beats the shit out of my 401k and stocks. However, like I said, I need to work for myself.

I'm going to start flipping property within the next year. The way I see it, I can full time as a RE Agent and flip part time for a year or two until I'm comfortable enough to flip full time.

Does anyone have experience in flipping properties? I'm thinking I should keep the landlord LLC separate and create another LLC for the flipping. I'd like to get some ideas from you to throw around in my head.

Also, if you have any other real estate investing knowledge, please do share. My goal, and it is obtainable, is to be a millionaire in 10-14 years with a passive income of 300-500k yearly and grow that by an easy 20% thereafter with not so much work. Sounds good, huh? I’ll let you know how it goes.

Tell me your Real Estate Investing stories, please!!!

oh yeah, I guess I should add that I'm doing my REI in Texas.

Cynthetiq · 03-24-2004, 05:52 PM

I saw this book this weekend after talking to my boss about this very subject the day before.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...12757?v=glance

I looked at it briefly at Office Depot and it seems pretty even keeled for what I read for 20 mins and I read pretty fast.

Your plan sounds really impressive, I'd even be happy to just have a six figure passive income and be good with that. I'm looking forward to seeing how this thread grows.

Force 10 · 03-24-2004, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cynthetiq
I saw this book this weekend after talking to my boss about this very subject the day before.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...12757?v=glance

I looked at it briefly at Office Depot and it seems pretty even keeled for what I read for 20 mins and I read pretty fast.

Your plan sounds really impressive, I'd even be happy to just have a six figure passive income and be good with that. I'm looking forward to seeing how this thread grows.

What's stopping you? Have you read anything yet?

I actually looked that book over and if I remember correctly, I almost picked it up. I got this one:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/AS...725134-1316630
over that one as the author is better credentialed. (again, if I remember correctly)

I'll definately get a few more on flipping as I want to do some serious homework over the next few months on the subject.

I'm in the middle of:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...glance&s=books
I figured I might as well read this since my money is already invested in here ;-)

Cynthetiq · 03-26-2004, 01:17 PM

I just bought a place in NYC, and I have a one bedroom condo in Las Vegas that has been rented out for the past 3 months.

I've not read anything yet. I've got other pots bubbling so this is a bit on the back burner, but I know that I need to focus on this in the next 1-2 years.

I'm looking to do something bigger, but I need more capital monies for downpayments.

eribrav · 03-27-2004, 07:53 AM

This sounds like very frothy speculation to me. When people got this excited about the stock market in 1999-2000 it marked a huge short selling opportunity. Think about it.

Cynthetiq · 03-28-2004, 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by eribrav
This sounds like very frothy speculation to me. When people got this excited about the stock market in 1999-2000 it marked a huge short selling opportunity. Think about it.

I am thinking about it. While I don't think that I can sustain it for such a long term and flipping isn't such a passive thing since one has to find properties and then sell them either with some alterations or just as is, I know that buying and selling real property is a good way to make large profits fast. For me it's definitely going to be a rental property thing because that is truly a passive way of generating income.

My parents taught me how to speculate on property enough to make a profit, and I've watched them do it several times since I was a kid.

I have a friend who buys properties in upscale areas and renovates them to reflect high class tastes, she make no less than US$1,000,000 on each deal, but it took her years to get to that point and sometimes she can have monies and profits tied up into properties for a couple years.

I think of it like anything, there are those who are in the top of their game, the Micheal Jordan's of real estate, then there are the professionals, and then the semipro and the lucky shots. I'm just hoping to hit semi-pro or even a lucky shot.

Rodney · 03-28-2004, 04:09 PM

Well, I have seen flipping work, but it is speculative; and when a market tanks the speculators who are still holding the bag can get reamed. Especially now, with housing prices going up in the major markets mainly because of lower interest rates. If rates rise (_when_ rates rise, that is), prices will fall or at least stagnate. So when you do make plans, do allow for an acceptable worst-case scenario (for example, that you can afford to rent the property at a loss for X months or years if necessary.)

DDDDave · 03-29-2004, 08:41 AM

Congratulations.

Where in the country are you? What types of properties are you doing?, all residential?

I do seperate LLC's for each deal. You've seen how easy it is to form one and it helps to keep everything straight.

It does seem easy, and it is one at a time, but it can be pretty overwhelming when you are trying to do a bunch of deals. You will have to have some staff to help you. (You can get real creative here too).

As was mentioned earlier, having your equity tied up is one of the caveats. Taxes are another huge factor. Do you understand the 'dealer' concept? Once you buy properties to flip, the profits are not capital gains but ordinary income (36% vs 15%). You will also not be able to use 1031 exchanges to defer your profits indefinitely. Once you are classified as a dealer by the IRS, it is difficult to convince them otherwise. Basically, you have to stop doing deals.

Now is about the time that you get yourself a really good real estate attorney. He will save you more than he costs. If he doesn't, get a better one. Get a good accountant.

Glad to see you realize this is not a get-rich-quick proposition. I try to do 2 - 3 deals a year. Hold for a year or two and then make a decision - keep or sell.

Good Luck.

Force 10 · 03-29-2004, 08:55 AM

Thanks DDDave. Right now I'm invested in Victoria Texas. I'll be investing in Austin Texas fairly soon. Right now we're just doing residential but we're thinking about doing office spaces and the likes.

I am a bit familiar with the dealer concept. That's why I was asking if anyone else had ideas as I hear the government can lump your rentals in with the flip properties and really screw you. How can I ensure I don't get classified as a dealer. I've read tid-bits about being classified as a dealer but no real meat on the subject. I have good backing and a steady flow of money to play with but I want to make sure I do this right so I don't screw myself. Suggestions for reading?

Thanks for the reply!

DDDDave · 03-30-2004, 08:46 AM

What I just said.....

"Now is about the time that you get yourself a really good real estate attorney. He will save you more than he costs. If he doesn't, get a better one. Get a good accountant. "

There is no way to 'assure' that you will not be classified as a dealer by the IRS. But an attorney and an accountant can give the best most current advice.

Don't trust anything you read. The laws and rules change all the time and it won't do you any good when something screws up.

I would also suggest taking the RE Broker class as soon as you can after the Salesperson class. That is where you will really learn something about the business. It is the next level and will definitely seperate you from 'hobbyists'.

Want to really know the residential business? Take a few appraisal classes.

Good Luck

Force 10 · 03-30-2004, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DDDDave
What I just said.....

"Now is about the time that you get yourself a really good real estate attorney. He will save you more than he costs. If he doesn't, get a better one. Get a good accountant. "

There is no way to 'assure' that you will not be classified as a dealer by the IRS. But an attorney and an accountant can give the best most current advice.

Don't trust anything you read. The laws and rules change all the time and it won't do you any good when something screws up.

I would also suggest taking the RE Broker class as soon as you can after the Salesperson class. That is where you will really learn something about the business. It is the next level and will definitely seperate you from 'hobbyists'.

Want to really know the residential business? Take a few appraisal classes.

Good Luck

That's where I'm heading with this. Broker is at the top of the list. I need to get my LRES first, though.

Appraisal class, huh? I thought about it but it's the easiest one to get so I figured the LRES and Broker coarses would cover the material. I'll add that to my list.

Thanks for your take on all of this. It's good to hear other opinions for sure!

Phaenx · 03-31-2004, 04:46 AM

My dad used to flip properties like a bastard he says, he did that for a while and built up an insane amount of cash until he became part of the Real Estate Professors something or other and opened his own college. Having just bought books for my classes, I can imagine why he was worth what he was.

But then he had a heart attack and everything tanked when the 2nd in command took over, got raped by the government and he just kind of gave up. Moral of the story, go to the gym more.

Force 10 · 03-31-2004, 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Phaenx
My dad used to flip properties like a bastard he says, he did that for a while and built up an insane amount of cash until he became part of the Real Estate Professors something or other and opened his own college. Having just bought books for my classes, I can imagine why he was worth what he was.

But then he had a heart attack and everything tanked when the 2nd in command took over, got raped by the government and he just kind of gave up. Moral of the story, go to the gym more.

Uhh.. Yikes. Tell pops we love him. I'll be sure to go to the gym in my free time. Actually, I'm pretty active with hiking and what not.

Like you footer, makes sense to me!

zf0enix · 03-31-2004, 11:54 PM

I'm really interested to see how this thread goes. I recently bought 2 duplexes and am in the process of buying more single family homes. But, I'm figuring out I don't like landlording that much, just negotiating and making the deals.

I'm a CPA and am currently pursuing a lender's license (that interests me more than an agent's license).

This'll be good!

Cynthetiq · 04-01-2004, 05:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by zf0enix
I'm really interested to see how this thread goes. I recently bought 2 duplexes and am in the process of buying more single family homes. But, I'm figuring out I don't like landlording that much, just negotiating and making the deals.

I have 1 property in Las Vegas and I live in NYC. I have a management company deal with it all. I get a check in the mail, I have costs to help offset my income and when something breaks I don't have to get woken up at 2am to have some pipes fixed.

The management company has a $200 limit of unauthorized fixit spending, anything more they have to call me for approval.

I like it this way, and when I have more properties, I'll set up my own management company to deal with it.

Back to the thread, I'm going to be meeting next week with my mortgage broker to find out just how much financing I can get for our next deal (my LV place I bought before I got married)

Force 10 · 04-01-2004, 07:07 AM

Exciting Stuff zf0enix and Cynthetiq. I'll keep this thread abreast of what I'm doing in the RE business and how things are going. It's nice to see others doing the same types of things I am. Fell free to bounce ideas off of me and I'll do the same with you.

Right now, I (the LLC) manages the repairs and all on the property but I imagine that will change quickly when we aquire more properties. Cyn has the right idea. Don't hassle with the headaches, simply get the check in the mail ;-).

DDDDave · 04-01-2004, 10:13 AM

This is what I do....

http://www.ccim.com/about/ccim.html

Good to hear people involved in the business. The more the merrier.

Good Luck to all.

Force 10 · 04-01-2004, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DDDDave
This is what I do....

http://www.ccim.com/about/ccim.html

Good to hear people involved in the business. The more the merrier.

Good Luck to all.

Nice, I'll look into this.

Thanks D!

Aletheia · 04-03-2004, 06:04 PM

Very intresting thread. I have just started the path to get a California Real Estate Salesperson's License.

Force 10 · 04-05-2004, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Aletheia
Very intresting thread. I have just started the path to get a California Real Estate Salesperson's License.

Yeah, how are you taking the classes, just interested? I opted for the oinline courses as I work full time. Seems to be working well for me.

Yakk · 04-05-2004, 07:22 AM

Being my usual paranoid self:
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/fea...ace-wells.html

Quote:

Only in about 20 metro areas, mostly located in eight states, does the relationship of home price to income defy logic. The bad news is that those areas contain roughly half the housing wealth of the country. In California, the price of a home stands at 8.3 times the annual family income of its occupants; in Massachusetts, the ratio is 5.9:1; in Hawaii, a stunning, 10.1:1. To some extent, there are sound and basic economic reasons for this anomaly: supply and demand. Salaries in these areas have been going up faster than in the nation as a whole. The other is supply: These metro areas are "built out," with zoning ordinances that limit the ability of developers to add new homes. But at some point, incomes simply can't sustain the prices. That point has now been reached. In California, a middle-class family with two earners each making $50,000 a year now owns, on average, an $830,000 home. In the late 80s, the last time these eight states saw price-to-income ratios this high, the real estate market collapsed.

Be careful all of you.

Cynthetiq · 04-05-2004, 10:19 AM

thanks for the article. As I travel around the US the first things I look at are the cost of homes, then I look at the industry and wages in the area.

I'm usually flabbergasted at the disparity and wonder how people make ends meet.

Aletheia · 04-05-2004, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ruprex
Yeah, how are you taking the classes, just interested? I opted for the oinline courses as I work full time. Seems to be working well for me.

Yep I am doing the online thing to. Seemed the most practical thing to do since I am already going to a state University full time and work part time. Which school are you doing it with? I went through Allied and so far they seem pretty good.

Rodney · 04-05-2004, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cynthetiq
thanks for the article. As I travel around the US the first things I look at are the cost of homes, then I look at the industry and wages in the area.

I'm usually flabbergasted at the disparity and wonder how people make ends meet.

If they've got even a prayer of affording a house, they take a mortgage with payments of up to 50 percent of their annual income. Once upon a time, no lender would make such a loan. Now it's not uncommon around here.

If they're low-income in a high-property-cost area, they live four or six to a one-bedroom apartment, 10 or 15 to a house. That's the way people used to live in urban areas, back in the early part of our century. We've come back to that again. O brave new world, you look a lot like 1910.

Of course, the well-to-do don't see any of this, and they can pretend that it doesn't exist.

veruca · 04-06-2004, 03:45 AM

I just passed my RE sales associate exam here in Florida, very exciting for me, I have to wait 6 months before I can take my brokers class, but, it is on the top pf my list! I am glad to see there are people here, i can ask questions too.

Force 10 · 04-06-2004, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Aletheia
Yep I am doing the online thing to. Seemed the most practical thing to do since I am already going to a state University full time and work part time. Which school are you doing it with? I went through Allied and so far they seem pretty good.

http://www.careerwebschool.com

Does your school allow you to keep the study materials or do you just have access to the site for an amount of time?

Force 10 · 04-06-2004, 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by veruca
I just passed my RE sales associate exam here in Florida, very exciting for me, I have to wait 6 months before I can take my brokers class, but, it is on the top pf my list! I am glad to see there are people here, i can ask questions too.

Likewise, how was the test and what do you recommend for study material?

Aletheia · 04-06-2004, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ruprex
http://www.careerwebschool.com

Does your school allow you to keep the study materials or do you just have access to the site for an amount of time?

I get to keep them. As for the class itself, I have up to a year to finish it before my access is cut.

veruca · 04-06-2004, 10:11 AM

the test was...i did fail it the first couple times, then i got some great advice, dumb it down. i was reading WAY to much into the questions and getting them wrong. it's a lot harder than your school exam, very differant. the questions are very ambiguous, and most of the time, all of the answers could be right, you just have to pick the "most" right. the math was easy, just remember your formulas, and you will breeze through.
my school (IFREC) has a special study class, where they give you a study book. it takes all the important ideas, and words, and takes out all the crap. so, you just get the basic knowledge, which is good for me, because i get distracted by huge paragraphs, when i only need a sentence. and there is a test, at the end of the book, that is very similar to the real test. i would suggest, taking the class, if u you have an IFREC near you

beerman · 04-09-2004, 08:32 AM

Keep in mind that people only write books about how to do a new real estate investing scheme when it is time to get out. They need the novices in the market to take their place before the fall / stagnation period. I believe Rodney was right on.

O/T- I'm selling my business and looking to enter the Real Estate industry as an analyst. I have a degree in Real Estate Finance / Entrepreneurship.... Anyone looking for help?

biff · 04-10-2004, 01:54 PM

Looking for help?! I bet you will have several people (including myself) saying, what a silly question! hehe

I have been interested in doing real estate investment for about the last 4 years, but have done nothing but read a bunch of books on the subject (including the flipping book mentioned above), and went to one meeting of the local real estate investors club.

I just need a kick in pants to get started, but my first priority is to buy my first home this year, hopefully by July, when our lease is up...

I just need to get started, but I guess I am just afraid, so I am open to any suggestions.

Anyone here have the Carlton Sheets program? Just curious.

Mobo · 04-11-2004, 02:31 PM

Forget Carleton Sheets. his only value is getting people moving and for that i congratulate him.

I have been flipping properties and buying foreclosures for the past few years. My training is fairly extensive. I was a real estate attorney for years but gave it up because i was doing pretty well in real estate.

These are a few websites i visit almost daily.

hxxp://www.flippinghomes.com
hxxp://www.thecreativeinvestor.com/
hxxp://www.foreclosureforum.coml
hxxp://therealestatelibrary.com/

Aletheia · 04-14-2004, 12:44 AM

Thanks for the links Mobo.

phyzix525 · 04-15-2004, 12:54 PM

The best thing you can do is ask around your area and see if there is an investor will to lend out his own money. I have a guy here in Tulsa who does that. All I have to do is find a property I like for say around 30K that fixed up would be worth 50K. I go to him and he writes me a check for 40K closeing costs are less then a 1000 and I use the 10K to fix the prop. Then in 3 months I sell the property for 50K and pay off my loan with a 1% prepayment fee and I pocket the rest. I typically make around 10K per house or I don't buy it. trick is not doing the work yourself and hiring a cheap handyman or a few mexicans. I try not to lift a finger seeing as how I don't really have the time. I also have a guy that looks for properties for me, if he finds one I buy it through him, it saves me time and money.

biff · 04-26-2004, 08:01 PM

mobo, thanks for the info on carlton. i see your point...

Force 10 · 02-07-2005, 01:11 PM

Update:

I've been a Licensed REATOR for a few months now. I now own 9 rental properties. The flipping is going slow as there isn't a big market for that where I am. I've flipped 2 properties and the first one just broke even. The second I made 12k on and this next one I think I stand to make about 30K. We'll see. Being a real estate agent has it's advantages for sure. However, I wish to hell my partner would agree to contract this work out. I'm getting tired of fixing toilets and painting walls

Merlocke · 02-07-2005, 07:30 PM

I just got an invitation to join a Russ Whitney course in Real Estate.
Has anyone heard much about these classes?

I'm interested as it's actually got Canadian Content in it, and I'm thinking of joining the game up north

.

mastertakana · 02-16-2005, 07:48 PM

i got my house for 40k. it took 5 grand and three weeks to fix up. i hope to sell it for 75-80k this year. i cant wait for two years for the capital gains tax break. it was an estate auction, the previous owner is deceased and his family was liquidating his estate.

one piece of advice to anyone is, find a good banker to deal with, get help with the labor and dont mess with houses if you dont have some experience or know someone who does.

i think that the carton sheets, etc. programs are useful, but not necessary.

a2k · 02-28-2005, 08:58 PM

Ruprex, it sounds like you've made quite a bit of progress in the year! Congrat's. I'm hopefully headed down the same path as you. I'd like to make a full-time income ($100k) in 2005 fixing and flipping properties. My initial plan of attack is to send out letters to every house that fits my criteria in the areas I'm interested in working to see if I can find some wholesale deals.

I'm in Seattle, where the market is ridiculous. Anybody else doing real estate deals in Seattle?

DDDDave · 03-01-2005, 07:24 PM

Here is an excellent series of articles from the Wall Street Journal Online about a first time real estate investor in the Seattle market.

http://www.realestatejournal.com/indinvestor/landlord/

03-24-2004, 05:17 PM	#1 (permalink)
Force 10 Had to leave this awesome space	Flipping Real Estate I'm incorporated with two other parties and (we) the LLC have 2 houses, a condo and a duplex...so far. I'm happy with this initial investment and I'm using this LLC as my retirement. I'm 31 and so fucking done with my job it's not even funny. I can't stand the thought of working for someone else much longer. I'm currently in school for a Licensed Real Estate Salesperson (LRES) cert. I figure I'll get my license as a change of pace for the now and it can only prove to help me in my future endeavors. I'm fairly new to Real Estate but so far, am VERY happy with my return on the landlord business. It sure beats the shit out of my 401k and stocks. However, like I said, I need to work for myself. I'm going to start flipping property within the next year. The way I see it, I can full time as a RE Agent and flip part time for a year or two until I'm comfortable enough to flip full time. Does anyone have experience in flipping properties? I'm thinking I should keep the landlord LLC separate and create another LLC for the flipping. I'd like to get some ideas from you to throw around in my head. Also, if you have any other real estate investing knowledge, please do share. My goal, and it is obtainable, is to be a millionaire in 10-14 years with a passive income of 300-500k yearly and grow that by an easy 20% thereafter with not so much work. Sounds good, huh? I’ll let you know how it goes. Tell me your Real Estate Investing stories, please!!! oh yeah, I guess I should add that I'm doing my REI in Texas. Last edited by Force 10; 03-24-2004 at 06:07 PM..

03-24-2004, 05:52 PM	#2 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	I saw this book this weekend after talking to my boss about this very subject the day before. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...12757?v=glance I looked at it briefly at Office Depot and it seems pretty even keeled for what I read for 20 mins and I read pretty fast. Your plan sounds really impressive, I'd even be happy to just have a six figure passive income and be good with that. I'm looking forward to seeing how this thread grows. __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

03-26-2004, 01:17 PM	#4 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	I just bought a place in NYC, and I have a one bedroom condo in Las Vegas that has been rented out for the past 3 months. I've not read anything yet. I've got other pots bubbling so this is a bit on the back burner, but I know that I need to focus on this in the next 1-2 years. I'm looking to do something bigger, but I need more capital monies for downpayments. __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

03-29-2004, 08:41 AM	#8 (permalink)
DDDDave Addict Location: Sarasota	Congratulations. Where in the country are you? What types of properties are you doing?, all residential? I do seperate LLC's for each deal. You've seen how easy it is to form one and it helps to keep everything straight. It does seem easy, and it is one at a time, but it can be pretty overwhelming when you are trying to do a bunch of deals. You will have to have some staff to help you. (You can get real creative here too). As was mentioned earlier, having your equity tied up is one of the caveats. Taxes are another huge factor. Do you understand the 'dealer' concept? Once you buy properties to flip, the profits are not capital gains but ordinary income (36% vs 15%). You will also not be able to use 1031 exchanges to defer your profits indefinitely. Once you are classified as a dealer by the IRS, it is difficult to convince them otherwise. Basically, you have to stop doing deals. Now is about the time that you get yourself a really good real estate attorney. He will save you more than he costs. If he doesn't, get a better one. Get a good accountant. Glad to see you realize this is not a get-rich-quick proposition. I try to do 2 - 3 deals a year. Hold for a year or two and then make a decision - keep or sell. Good Luck. __________________ I am just a simple man trying to make my way in the universe... "Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you have imagined." - Thoreau "Nothing great was ever accomplished without enthusiasm" - Emerson

03-30-2004, 08:46 AM	#10 (permalink)
DDDDave Addict Location: Sarasota	What I just said..... "Now is about the time that you get yourself a really good real estate attorney. He will save you more than he costs. If he doesn't, get a better one. Get a good accountant. " There is no way to 'assure' that you will not be classified as a dealer by the IRS. But an attorney and an accountant can give the best most current advice. Don't trust anything you read. The laws and rules change all the time and it won't do you any good when something screws up. I would also suggest taking the RE Broker class as soon as you can after the Salesperson class. That is where you will really learn something about the business. It is the next level and will definitely seperate you from 'hobbyists'. Want to really know the residential business? Take a few appraisal classes. Good Luck __________________ I am just a simple man trying to make my way in the universe... "Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you have imagined." - Thoreau "Nothing great was ever accomplished without enthusiasm" - Emerson Last edited by DDDDave; 03-30-2004 at 08:50 AM..

03-27-2004, 07:53 AM	#5 (permalink)
eribrav Junkie Location: upstate NY	This sounds like very frothy speculation to me. When people got this excited about the stock market in 1999-2000 it marked a huge short selling opportunity. Think about it.

03-28-2004, 04:09 PM	#7 (permalink)
Rodney Observant Ruminant Location: Rich Wannabe Hippie Town	Well, I have seen flipping work, but it is speculative; and when a market tanks the speculators who are still holding the bag can get reamed. Especially now, with housing prices going up in the major markets mainly because of lower interest rates. If rates rise (_when_ rates rise, that is), prices will fall or at least stagnate. So when you do make plans, do allow for an acceptable worst-case scenario (for example, that you can afford to rent the property at a loss for X months or years if necessary.)

03-29-2004, 08:55 AM	#9 (permalink)
Force 10 Had to leave this awesome space	Thanks DDDave. Right now I'm invested in Victoria Texas. I'll be investing in Austin Texas fairly soon. Right now we're just doing residential but we're thinking about doing office spaces and the likes. I am a bit familiar with the dealer concept. That's why I was asking if anyone else had ideas as I hear the government can lump your rentals in with the flip properties and really screw you. How can I ensure I don't get classified as a dealer. I've read tid-bits about being classified as a dealer but no real meat on the subject. I have good backing and a steady flow of money to play with but I want to make sure I do this right so I don't screw myself. Suggestions for reading? Thanks for the reply!

03-31-2004, 04:46 AM	#12 (permalink)
Phaenx The Northern Ward Location: Columbus, Ohio	My dad used to flip properties like a bastard he says, he did that for a while and built up an insane amount of cash until he became part of the Real Estate Professors something or other and opened his own college. Having just bought books for my classes, I can imagine why he was worth what he was. But then he had a heart attack and everything tanked when the 2nd in command took over, got raped by the government and he just kind of gave up. Moral of the story, go to the gym more. __________________ "I went shopping last night at like 1am. The place was empty and this old woman just making polite conversation said to me, 'where is everyone??' I replied, 'In bed, same place you and I should be!' Took me ten minutes to figure out why she gave me a dirty look." --Some guy

03-31-2004, 11:54 PM	#14 (permalink)
zf0enix Psycho Location: PacNW	I'm really interested to see how this thread goes. I recently bought 2 duplexes and am in the process of buying more single family homes. But, I'm figuring out I don't like landlording that much, just negotiating and making the deals. I'm a CPA and am currently pursuing a lender's license (that interests me more than an agent's license). This'll be good! __________________ One step closer to the edge...

04-01-2004, 07:07 AM	#16 (permalink)
Force 10 Had to leave this awesome space	Exciting Stuff zf0enix and Cynthetiq. I'll keep this thread abreast of what I'm doing in the RE business and how things are going. It's nice to see others doing the same types of things I am. Fell free to bounce ideas off of me and I'll do the same with you. Right now, I (the LLC) manages the repairs and all on the property but I imagine that will change quickly when we aquire more properties. Cyn has the right idea. Don't hassle with the headaches, simply get the check in the mail ;-).

04-01-2004, 10:13 AM	#17 (permalink)
DDDDave Addict Location: Sarasota	This is what I do.... http://www.ccim.com/about/ccim.html Good to hear people involved in the business. The more the merrier. Good Luck to all. __________________ I am just a simple man trying to make my way in the universe... "Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you have imagined." - Thoreau "Nothing great was ever accomplished without enthusiasm" - Emerson

04-03-2004, 06:04 PM	#19 (permalink)
Aletheia Psycho	Very intresting thread. I have just started the path to get a California Real Estate Salesperson's License.

04-05-2004, 10:19 AM	#22 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	thanks for the article. As I travel around the US the first things I look at are the cost of homes, then I look at the industry and wages in the area. I'm usually flabbergasted at the disparity and wonder how people make ends meet. __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

04-06-2004, 03:45 AM	#25 (permalink)
veruca Psycho Location: 4 privet drive	I just passed my RE sales associate exam here in Florida, very exciting for me, I have to wait 6 months before I can take my brokers class, but, it is on the top pf my list! I am glad to see there are people here, i can ask questions too. __________________ How you turned my world, you precious thing You starve and near exhaust me Everything I've done, I've done for you I move the stars for no one

04-06-2004, 10:11 AM	#29 (permalink)
veruca Psycho Location: 4 privet drive	the test was...i did fail it the first couple times, then i got some great advice, dumb it down. i was reading WAY to much into the questions and getting them wrong. it's a lot harder than your school exam, very differant. the questions are very ambiguous, and most of the time, all of the answers could be right, you just have to pick the "most" right. the math was easy, just remember your formulas, and you will breeze through. my school (IFREC) has a special study class, where they give you a study book. it takes all the important ideas, and words, and takes out all the crap. so, you just get the basic knowledge, which is good for me, because i get distracted by huge paragraphs, when i only need a sentence. and there is a test, at the end of the book, that is very similar to the real test. i would suggest, taking the class, if u you have an IFREC near you __________________ How you turned my world, you precious thing You starve and near exhaust me Everything I've done, I've done for you I move the stars for no one

04-09-2004, 08:32 AM	#30 (permalink)
beerman Upright Location: Bristol, CT	Keep in mind that people only write books about how to do a new real estate investing scheme when it is time to get out. They need the novices in the market to take their place before the fall / stagnation period. I believe Rodney was right on. O/T- I'm selling my business and looking to enter the Real Estate industry as an analyst. I have a degree in Real Estate Finance / Entrepreneurship.... Anyone looking for help?

04-10-2004, 01:54 PM	#31 (permalink)
biff Upright	Looking for help?! I bet you will have several people (including myself) saying, what a silly question! hehe I have been interested in doing real estate investment for about the last 4 years, but have done nothing but read a bunch of books on the subject (including the flipping book mentioned above), and went to one meeting of the local real estate investors club. I just need a kick in pants to get started, but my first priority is to buy my first home this year, hopefully by July, when our lease is up... I just need to get started, but I guess I am just afraid, so I am open to any suggestions. Anyone here have the Carlton Sheets program? Just curious.

04-11-2004, 02:31 PM	#32 (permalink)
Mobo Upright	Forget Carleton Sheets. his only value is getting people moving and for that i congratulate him. I have been flipping properties and buying foreclosures for the past few years. My training is fairly extensive. I was a real estate attorney for years but gave it up because i was doing pretty well in real estate. These are a few websites i visit almost daily. hxxp://www.flippinghomes.com hxxp://www.thecreativeinvestor.com/ hxxp://www.foreclosureforum.coml hxxp://therealestatelibrary.com/

04-14-2004, 12:44 AM	#33 (permalink)
Aletheia Psycho	Thanks for the links Mobo.

04-15-2004, 12:54 PM	#34 (permalink)
phyzix525 Psycho Location: Broken Arrow, OK	The best thing you can do is ask around your area and see if there is an investor will to lend out his own money. I have a guy here in Tulsa who does that. All I have to do is find a property I like for say around 30K that fixed up would be worth 50K. I go to him and he writes me a check for 40K closeing costs are less then a 1000 and I use the 10K to fix the prop. Then in 3 months I sell the property for 50K and pay off my loan with a 1% prepayment fee and I pocket the rest. I typically make around 10K per house or I don't buy it. trick is not doing the work yourself and hiring a cheap handyman or a few mexicans. I try not to lift a finger seeing as how I don't really have the time. I also have a guy that looks for properties for me, if he finds one I buy it through him, it saves me time and money. __________________ It's hard to remember we're alive for the first time It's hard to remember we're alive for the last time It's hard to remember to live before you die It's hard to remember that our lives are such a short time It's hard to remember when it takes such a long time

04-26-2004, 08:01 PM	#35 (permalink)
biff Upright	mobo, thanks for the info on carlton. i see your point...

02-07-2005, 01:11 PM	#36 (permalink)
Force 10 Had to leave this awesome space	Update: I've been a Licensed REATOR for a few months now. I now own 9 rental properties. The flipping is going slow as there isn't a big market for that where I am. I've flipped 2 properties and the first one just broke even. The second I made 12k on and this next one I think I stand to make about 30K. We'll see. Being a real estate agent has it's advantages for sure. However, I wish to hell my partner would agree to contract this work out. I'm getting tired of fixing toilets and painting walls

02-07-2005, 07:30 PM	#37 (permalink)
Merlocke Location: Canada	I just got an invitation to join a Russ Whitney course in Real Estate. Has anyone heard much about these classes? I'm interested as it's actually got Canadian Content in it, and I'm thinking of joining the game up north . __________________ -=[ Merlocke ]=-

02-16-2005, 07:48 PM	#38 (permalink)
mastertakana Crazy	i got my house for 40k. it took 5 grand and three weeks to fix up. i hope to sell it for 75-80k this year. i cant wait for two years for the capital gains tax break. it was an estate auction, the previous owner is deceased and his family was liquidating his estate. one piece of advice to anyone is, find a good banker to deal with, get help with the labor and dont mess with houses if you dont have some experience or know someone who does. i think that the carton sheets, etc. programs are useful, but not necessary. __________________ All I know the time it is gettin dread Need alot of trees up in my head

02-28-2005, 08:58 PM	#39 (permalink)
a2k Crazy Location: Seattle	Ruprex, it sounds like you've made quite a bit of progress in the year! Congrat's. I'm hopefully headed down the same path as you. I'd like to make a full-time income ($100k) in 2005 fixing and flipping properties. My initial plan of attack is to send out letters to every house that fits my criteria in the areas I'm interested in working to see if I can find some wholesale deals. I'm in Seattle, where the market is ridiculous. Anybody else doing real estate deals in Seattle?

03-01-2005, 07:24 PM	#40 (permalink)
DDDDave Addict Location: Sarasota	Here is an excellent series of articles from the Wall Street Journal Online about a first time real estate investor in the Seattle market. http://www.realestatejournal.com/indinvestor/landlord/ __________________ I am just a simple man trying to make my way in the universe... "Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you have imagined." - Thoreau "Nothing great was ever accomplished without enthusiasm" - Emerson