Supervisor Difficulties - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

kurty[B] · 11-25-2003, 01:04 PM

Alright, when the U.S. economy recessed for a bit there I was layed off, and took a rather shitty job at Atmel as a Production Operator. I was only hoping to use it as a temporary position till things got better and other more rewarding jobs were more widely available. Well, up until a few months ago that has really only started happening in my area (taken a while for the Colorado Front Range to bounce back). But yeah, so, I've been there for a year and a half now.

Everyone who works for my supervisor despises him, most the other supervisors do not like the way he manages, but I guess he's been with the company for 10+ years and has built up some amazing clout, cause through all the complaints about him, nothing has ever happened to him.

So, he moved me from a rather lazy area of the fab to an extremely busy area over 6 months ago, and I wouldn't have minded that he did that, except for the fact that he gave me the options "You can move to Strip, or leave?!" (Strip is the area I work in now, removing resist from silicon wafers). If he simply came up and said "I need you up in Strip to help out", I would've gladly taken the position without any grumbling and what not. Still seeing things as rather bleak jobwise I went ahead and took the position with no complaints. And during this time I started school, so full-time school + full time night job = extremely tiring after 8-15 weeks. I tried to explain this to him, but now I'm on his "Shitlist" and nothing I say breaks through his thick skull it seems.

So, one night I came in late from a break. He busted me, and had me start paging him when I go and come back from breaks (no probs, just standard disciplinary action). So, I've been doing that just fine for a month or so now. Then, one night after I had a calc and econ test at school and had been up for 24 hours before going into work at my 12 hour shift, I even told him how tired I was, he offered coffee, but I can't stand coffee, and in general really try and avoid caffeine. But I guess two people e-mailed him and complained that I wasn't "pullin'-my-weight", he told me if that happened again I'd be fired, I tried to explain my situation, again he wouldn't listen. So, then, after that he started watching my work e-mail, and popped me for sending e-mails to a few girls simply asking them what time they had breaks that night. A little out there, but I'll deal, he pulled me aside and told me I need to start looking for a job, because he's going to put me on a Production Improvement Plan and I WILL FAIL (exact words he used), plus somewhere in there he threw in a "you weren't raised right", and I snapped back at that, I probably shouldn't have, but attacking my parents I won't take anymore.

So, after that talk, that night I paged coming back from break, and he called, and said I was leaving my tools idle too much. Ever since he talked to me about "pulling-my-weight" I have been busting my ass simply to keep my job long enough to find another one at least. I told him No, and he continued to argue with me about things. Finally I got sick of his arguing and slammed the phone down on him (I'm pretty sure everyone in the area heard the whole conversation, and what not, I tried to keep my cool, but when people accuse me of something I'm not doing that like attacking my parents is something I don't stand for). So, later that night in an angry state I told my Specialist (person who does lots of managing of our area, but really has no power) to Fuck Off, and he later talked to me about why I was so pissed, and went and talked to my supervisor about it, I only worked one night since then and my supervisor hadn't said anything at all.

I finally went to HR (should've done that long ago), and told them all the above, and they listened and took it all down, and pretty much sounded like they would talk to him, but I've seen other people do this before, and things simply got worse for them (sad thing about night shift, is non of the big-wigs are there to really see how the supervisors really are). So, the only option they gave me was to pursue another area/supervisor to work under.

I'm going to suffer through this next week of work (double-time), and I have been looking for other jobs, have had some interviews and what not, but no follow ups, simply, "we're waiting for final decisions to be made". Could either be BS, or managers going on vacation, because of holiday.

But yeah... What are your opinions. I'm pretty much done with that place, but having lived paycheck to paycheck for the last year and a half, and literally having no extra money on any paycheck since I worked there I've depleted all savings I've had, and getting fired/quitting really isn't an option. I'm going to tough it out as long as I have to, but seriously hope another job is available soon. Any advice though, I know my supervisor at this point is simply trying to push my buttons and really get me to mess up so he has a legitimate reason to get rid of me. Ugghh, just frustrating.

water_boy1999 · 11-25-2003, 01:30 PM

Believe me, I seriously feel your agony. I went through a very similar situation. My recruiter and I (sales person) were a great team together but we needed managerial support which we didn't have the first few years I worked there. When we finally got a manager, she was awesome....for the first few weeks. Then we started to see the patterns she was forming of lack of work, personal e-mails all day long, personal phone calls when she should have helped with the organizational management of our office, coming in at 9:30am, leaving for lunch at 11:30am, coming back at 2:23pm, then leaving for what she called "Business meetings" at 4:00pm.

The story doesn't even remotely stop there. My point is, we tried to take it to upper management MANY times. But this gal was hot looking, big tits, and she used it to pull the wool over the upper management's eyes. So, finally, after many months of keeping my cool, I took it upon myself to handle the situation. I confronted her about it, and she wouldn't let me finish....she said after all the slack she gives us I should be more respectful...she left crying before I could really get into it. Well, she cleaned up her act for a few days so we thought she got the message. Sure enough, the disappearing act started again and I confronted her again....except this time I had a different demeanor. I was seriously pissed off and I wasn't going to let my paycheck suffer or my mental state for that matter.

Well, I was written up for insubordination. She lied on the report as well, saying I threatened her, cursed at her, etc......so, I asked the upper management when was I able to write my letter of Bad Management about her....didn't happen. I quit a few weeks later. She was fired two weeks after I left but I had about a dozen counter offers to get me back into the company. ALL upper management was kissing my ass because they knew they were wrong and had mishandled the situation.

I don't have solid advice to give you because I almost lost my sanity in the same type of situation. Sometimes people are in management and they have no reasons whatsoever for being there. I wish you the best of luck. Get another job then this will be all behind you.

TheBrit · 11-25-2003, 01:47 PM

Would it be below the belt to get some sort of evidence? For example, record conversations between you. If he lays you off, and does so unfairly, you could take the company to a tribunal.

Cynthetiq · 11-25-2003, 02:11 PM

Sad but that's life... it's a shame, HR is supposed to be there to assist you, but seems like they aren't doing their job or don't want to "ruffle feathers"

collect evidence on everything. Log it all down. it will be easier for you to present your case to HR or even any groups like Labor borads, Unions, Lawyers, etc.

txlovely · 11-25-2003, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cynthetiq
Sad but that's life... it's a shame, HR is supposed to be there to assist you, but seems like they aren't doing their job or don't want to "ruffle feathers"

collect evidence on everything. Log it all down. it will be easier for you to present your case to HR or even any groups like Labor borads, Unions, Lawyers, etc.

I agree - log everything. But it would be even better to have a union rep or other labor rep duke it out for you. Otherwise, I would suggest going over your supervisor's head to his supervisor. Write a letter or request a meeting with the company president. Look into whether or not your company supplies its employees with third party employee assistance and legal aid - if so, pursue that.

I would also refuse to meet with him alone. Most importantly, and I know this is something you already know, you need to really put a lot of effort into a serious job hunt. No one should have to endure that kind of treatment while trying to eek out a living.

Network - ask your family and friends if they know of any type of employment you might be interested in. You might be surprised at how much help you get.

I really wish you a lot of luck.

RHix613 · 11-26-2003, 05:55 AM

I've been a manager/supervisor in a warehouse setting for the past ten years, although I don't agree with how he handled your situation completely, I don't agree with your arguments either. Just because you are "trying" to work and go to school doesn't give you the right to get special attention at work. That is your choice to try and work full-time and go to school full-time. I do understand trying to better yourself and that is great. But your supervisor has other employees to worry about and if they are complaining it makes it harder on him. It does sound like he is trying to scare you into working harder (which sounds like it was working) by threatening to fire you. If he wanted you gone, you would be gone (unless you work for a union). Being in management over a large group of individuals where each one does a different task to make the finished project complete is a very difficult task.

One last thought, when you applied for the job at the company and you accepted you basically gave a verbal commitment to do the job required and expected. If that changes then you have the choice to leave and continue, if you continue you have again committed to the company. Although you are going to school you still have a responsibility to the company that is giving you a paycheck.

Cynthetiq · 11-26-2003, 06:30 AM

I reread your tale, and agree with RHix....

I too supervised over 15 people, and I had a job I needed to accomplish. I don't care that one makes their choices in life, like have kids, be single, go to school, return to school, be a musician, etc. Those are your own choices, plain and simple. Now if your problems stem from something covered by Americans Disibilities Act, then you have some ground. But since this is a conscious choice you made of going to school, then you have to pay the dues whatever those dues may be.

Once you punch the clock or come into work you have a duty to fulfill. If you cannot fulfill that duty, then you can and will be replaced. What you do outside of work CANNOT and SHOULD NOT interfere with it.

Let me put it to you in a different way... How would you feel if someone constantly asked your boss for special treatment because of a child, and you had to work harder because of it? How would that make you feel? Would it be fair to you since you don't have children?

RHix613 · 11-26-2003, 11:48 AM

Cynthetiq, excellent point. That is exactly what I was trying to say.

kurty[B] · 11-26-2003, 12:49 PM

I understand where you guys are coming from, and understand he's also trying to do a job, and manage many people. When I signed up for school I talked to him about it, and at that time he claimed to understand if I'd come in tired occassionally and what not.

I don't think this supervisor has ever actually fired anyone in the 5-6+ years he's been a supervisor. Everyone who's worked with or for him for the past few years simply says he yells, and tries to make certain peoples lives miserable till they quit. They say he picks simply one person to make his target, and doesn't relent. In the year and a half I've been there I've seen him go after two people, one I didn't particularly know, the other was a good worker, until he made things miserable for her, then her productivity fell through the floor because of how miserable she felt coming into work. Luckily she had money saved up, and was able to quit and survive for a while while looking for another job.

Dunno, it's a holiday work week, and it's double-time pretty much all this week, I'm going to try and avoid him as much as possible, try and stay calm, and do what needs to be done. None of his higher-ups will be there, so I won't be able to go ask his supervisor if I can transfer under a different supervisor, and HR won't be there. So... Uggghhh, guess I'll just deal for now.

diddagirl · 11-27-2003, 12:12 AM

Sounds like he is simply trying to push your buttons, and make you feel like a piece of garbage so that you quit. This guy probably has issues, and feels insecure, so when he picks a
"target" and does everything in his power to make them quite- it probably some how makes him feel better about himself and his position at work. DO NOT give in and let him get to you enoug so that u screw up your job. Let the rude and uncalled for things he says slide off your back. AND become the best worker you can be. Dont give him anything to nag you about- good luck.

kurty[B] · 11-27-2003, 07:16 AM

Thanks didda, I'll need it. That's what I've been trying to do, so far sorta seems to be working. I will continue the search for employment elsewhere in the meantime.

Dunno, guess I really won't know what gonna happen till next week when HR is back from vacation and we all get to talk.

11-25-2003, 01:04 PM	#1 (permalink)
kurty[B] Sauce Puppet	Supervisor Difficulties Alright, when the U.S. economy recessed for a bit there I was layed off, and took a rather shitty job at Atmel as a Production Operator. I was only hoping to use it as a temporary position till things got better and other more rewarding jobs were more widely available. Well, up until a few months ago that has really only started happening in my area (taken a while for the Colorado Front Range to bounce back). But yeah, so, I've been there for a year and a half now. Everyone who works for my supervisor despises him, most the other supervisors do not like the way he manages, but I guess he's been with the company for 10+ years and has built up some amazing clout, cause through all the complaints about him, nothing has ever happened to him. So, he moved me from a rather lazy area of the fab to an extremely busy area over 6 months ago, and I wouldn't have minded that he did that, except for the fact that he gave me the options "You can move to Strip, or leave?!" (Strip is the area I work in now, removing resist from silicon wafers). If he simply came up and said "I need you up in Strip to help out", I would've gladly taken the position without any grumbling and what not. Still seeing things as rather bleak jobwise I went ahead and took the position with no complaints. And during this time I started school, so full-time school + full time night job = extremely tiring after 8-15 weeks. I tried to explain this to him, but now I'm on his "Shitlist" and nothing I say breaks through his thick skull it seems. So, one night I came in late from a break. He busted me, and had me start paging him when I go and come back from breaks (no probs, just standard disciplinary action). So, I've been doing that just fine for a month or so now. Then, one night after I had a calc and econ test at school and had been up for 24 hours before going into work at my 12 hour shift, I even told him how tired I was, he offered coffee, but I can't stand coffee, and in general really try and avoid caffeine. But I guess two people e-mailed him and complained that I wasn't "pullin'-my-weight", he told me if that happened again I'd be fired, I tried to explain my situation, again he wouldn't listen. So, then, after that he started watching my work e-mail, and popped me for sending e-mails to a few girls simply asking them what time they had breaks that night. A little out there, but I'll deal, he pulled me aside and told me I need to start looking for a job, because he's going to put me on a Production Improvement Plan and I WILL FAIL (exact words he used), plus somewhere in there he threw in a "you weren't raised right", and I snapped back at that, I probably shouldn't have, but attacking my parents I won't take anymore. So, after that talk, that night I paged coming back from break, and he called, and said I was leaving my tools idle too much. Ever since he talked to me about "pulling-my-weight" I have been busting my ass simply to keep my job long enough to find another one at least. I told him No, and he continued to argue with me about things. Finally I got sick of his arguing and slammed the phone down on him (I'm pretty sure everyone in the area heard the whole conversation, and what not, I tried to keep my cool, but when people accuse me of something I'm not doing that like attacking my parents is something I don't stand for). So, later that night in an angry state I told my Specialist (person who does lots of managing of our area, but really has no power) to Fuck Off, and he later talked to me about why I was so pissed, and went and talked to my supervisor about it, I only worked one night since then and my supervisor hadn't said anything at all. I finally went to HR (should've done that long ago), and told them all the above, and they listened and took it all down, and pretty much sounded like they would talk to him, but I've seen other people do this before, and things simply got worse for them (sad thing about night shift, is non of the big-wigs are there to really see how the supervisors really are). So, the only option they gave me was to pursue another area/supervisor to work under. I'm going to suffer through this next week of work (double-time), and I have been looking for other jobs, have had some interviews and what not, but no follow ups, simply, "we're waiting for final decisions to be made". Could either be BS, or managers going on vacation, because of holiday. But yeah... What are your opinions. I'm pretty much done with that place, but having lived paycheck to paycheck for the last year and a half, and literally having no extra money on any paycheck since I worked there I've depleted all savings I've had, and getting fired/quitting really isn't an option. I'm going to tough it out as long as I have to, but seriously hope another job is available soon. Any advice though, I know my supervisor at this point is simply trying to push my buttons and really get me to mess up so he has a legitimate reason to get rid of me. Ugghh, just frustrating.

11-25-2003, 01:30 PM	#2 (permalink)
water_boy1999 Fly em straight! Location: Above and Beyond	Believe me, I seriously feel your agony. I went through a very similar situation. My recruiter and I (sales person) were a great team together but we needed managerial support which we didn't have the first few years I worked there. When we finally got a manager, she was awesome....for the first few weeks. Then we started to see the patterns she was forming of lack of work, personal e-mails all day long, personal phone calls when she should have helped with the organizational management of our office, coming in at 9:30am, leaving for lunch at 11:30am, coming back at 2:23pm, then leaving for what she called "Business meetings" at 4:00pm. The story doesn't even remotely stop there. My point is, we tried to take it to upper management MANY times. But this gal was hot looking, big tits, and she used it to pull the wool over the upper management's eyes. So, finally, after many months of keeping my cool, I took it upon myself to handle the situation. I confronted her about it, and she wouldn't let me finish....she said after all the slack she gives us I should be more respectful...she left crying before I could really get into it. Well, she cleaned up her act for a few days so we thought she got the message. Sure enough, the disappearing act started again and I confronted her again....except this time I had a different demeanor. I was seriously pissed off and I wasn't going to let my paycheck suffer or my mental state for that matter. Well, I was written up for insubordination. She lied on the report as well, saying I threatened her, cursed at her, etc......so, I asked the upper management when was I able to write my letter of Bad Management about her....didn't happen. I quit a few weeks later. She was fired two weeks after I left but I had about a dozen counter offers to get me back into the company. ALL upper management was kissing my ass because they knew they were wrong and had mishandled the situation. I don't have solid advice to give you because I almost lost my sanity in the same type of situation. Sometimes people are in management and they have no reasons whatsoever for being there. I wish you the best of luck. Get another job then this will be all behind you. __________________ Doh!!!! -Homer Simpson

11-25-2003, 02:11 PM	#4 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	Sad but that's life... it's a shame, HR is supposed to be there to assist you, but seems like they aren't doing their job or don't want to "ruffle feathers" collect evidence on everything. Log it all down. it will be easier for you to present your case to HR or even any groups like Labor borads, Unions, Lawyers, etc. __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

11-26-2003, 06:30 AM	#7 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	I reread your tale, and agree with RHix.... I too supervised over 15 people, and I had a job I needed to accomplish. I don't care that one makes their choices in life, like have kids, be single, go to school, return to school, be a musician, etc. Those are your own choices, plain and simple. Now if your problems stem from something covered by Americans Disibilities Act, then you have some ground. But since this is a conscious choice you made of going to school, then you have to pay the dues whatever those dues may be. Once you punch the clock or come into work you have a duty to fulfill. If you cannot fulfill that duty, then you can and will be replaced. What you do outside of work CANNOT and SHOULD NOT interfere with it. Let me put it to you in a different way... How would you feel if someone constantly asked your boss for special treatment because of a child, and you had to work harder because of it? How would that make you feel? Would it be fair to you since you don't have children? __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

11-27-2003, 12:12 AM	#10 (permalink)
diddagirl Addict Location: Calgary, AB	Sounds like he is simply trying to push your buttons, and make you feel like a piece of garbage so that you quit. This guy probably has issues, and feels insecure, so when he picks a "target" and does everything in his power to make them quite- it probably some how makes him feel better about himself and his position at work. DO NOT give in and let him get to you enoug so that u screw up your job. Let the rude and uncalled for things he says slide off your back. AND become the best worker you can be. Dont give him anything to nag you about- good luck. __________________ "Is it so small a thing to have enjoyed the sun, to have lived long in the spring, to have loved, to have thought, to have done." -Matthew Arnold

11-25-2003, 01:47 PM	#3 (permalink)
TheBrit Psycho	Would it be below the belt to get some sort of evidence? For example, record conversations between you. If he lays you off, and does so unfairly, you could take the company to a tribunal.

11-26-2003, 05:55 AM	#6 (permalink)
RHix613 Tilted	I've been a manager/supervisor in a warehouse setting for the past ten years, although I don't agree with how he handled your situation completely, I don't agree with your arguments either. Just because you are "trying" to work and go to school doesn't give you the right to get special attention at work. That is your choice to try and work full-time and go to school full-time. I do understand trying to better yourself and that is great. But your supervisor has other employees to worry about and if they are complaining it makes it harder on him. It does sound like he is trying to scare you into working harder (which sounds like it was working) by threatening to fire you. If he wanted you gone, you would be gone (unless you work for a union). Being in management over a large group of individuals where each one does a different task to make the finished project complete is a very difficult task. One last thought, when you applied for the job at the company and you accepted you basically gave a verbal commitment to do the job required and expected. If that changes then you have the choice to leave and continue, if you continue you have again committed to the company. Although you are going to school you still have a responsibility to the company that is giving you a paycheck.

11-26-2003, 11:48 AM	#8 (permalink)
RHix613 Tilted	Cynthetiq, excellent point. That is exactly what I was trying to say.

11-26-2003, 12:49 PM	#9 (permalink)
kurty[B] Sauce Puppet	I understand where you guys are coming from, and understand he's also trying to do a job, and manage many people. When I signed up for school I talked to him about it, and at that time he claimed to understand if I'd come in tired occassionally and what not. I don't think this supervisor has ever actually fired anyone in the 5-6+ years he's been a supervisor. Everyone who's worked with or for him for the past few years simply says he yells, and tries to make certain peoples lives miserable till they quit. They say he picks simply one person to make his target, and doesn't relent. In the year and a half I've been there I've seen him go after two people, one I didn't particularly know, the other was a good worker, until he made things miserable for her, then her productivity fell through the floor because of how miserable she felt coming into work. Luckily she had money saved up, and was able to quit and survive for a while while looking for another job. Dunno, it's a holiday work week, and it's double-time pretty much all this week, I'm going to try and avoid him as much as possible, try and stay calm, and do what needs to be done. None of his higher-ups will be there, so I won't be able to go ask his supervisor if I can transfer under a different supervisor, and HR won't be there. So... Uggghhh, guess I'll just deal for now.

11-27-2003, 07:16 AM	#11 (permalink)
kurty[B] Sauce Puppet	Thanks didda, I'll need it. That's what I've been trying to do, so far sorta seems to be working. I will continue the search for employment elsewhere in the meantime. Dunno, guess I really won't know what gonna happen till next week when HR is back from vacation and we all get to talk.