Am I A Xenophobe? - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

clifclav · 10-17-2003, 05:58 AM

I have traveled quite a bit during my lifetime. I've spent several months at a time in both England & Ireland. I've visited Italy, The Netherlands, & West Germany at the time. I've vacationed in Canada, Mexico, The Bahamas & Venezuala.

I've also decided tentatively that I am never going to leave the United States again.

My main reason for this is that I belong to the school of quality over quantity. I want to spend all of my future travel dollars getting intimately acquainted with one country or even possibly one region of one country. While I recognize that I may miss out on never seeing New Zealand or Thailand, I also recognize that I would love to be able to live like a native of Charleston SC for three weeks. Or spend three weeks just taking walking tours of New York.

My questions are these. Does anyone else subscribe to this line of reasoning? Am I being to narrow-minded? Will I have not lived a full life if I never climb Uluru?

Or is it OK to travel within and study one country remarkably well? I feel pretty well justified in choosing America. It is my native country and I feel that there is certainly enough to spend a lifetime visiting and studying.

Your comments and thoughts are most appreciated.

cetacean · 10-17-2003, 03:55 PM

Hey Clif, I can respect your reasoning. After all, the US has so much to offer. From Mountains to desert to plains to coast to rainforest and everything in between, the US has got it all. However, I think that life is longer than you think. Why make such a definitive statement as to not travel beyond our borders.

I have a similar rational in that I love to travel to far off distant lands, but while I am there, I prefer to settle in to a small region and become intimately familiar with it. I know that my whole outlook on life has changed based on the experiences and friendships that I have made in my travels. I also find that traveling out of the country makes me really appreciate what we have here once I return. It is always a great feeling at the US customs desk at the airport when the officer stamps your passport, looks you in the eye and says, "Welcome home."

Macheath · 10-18-2003, 04:30 AM

Cetacean has hit the nail on the head. Absence makes the heart grow fonder. Coming BACK is a beautiful feeling but you wouldn't get that feeling if you didn't leave occasionally.

Never say never...

clifclav · 10-20-2003, 06:54 AM

Both valid points and I thank you for them. What you are talking about cetacean is what I want to do in the U.S. I specifically brought up Chrarleston in my original post because that is the vacation I am taking in February. I plan to find either an extended stay place in town or even better yet a home or apartment to sublet for two weeks and get intimately acquanted with the city of Charleston.

There are so many places in the US that i want to do this in that I can't ever see doing it in another country. Who knows.

Liquor Dealer · 10-20-2003, 11:27 AM

A person could spend a lifetime just touring the U.S. and never come close to seeing it all. I've been abroad several times and will admit that we don't have some of the antquities that you'll find in Europe but there is so much more to do and see than one could ever do in a lifetime - if you want to spend a totally laid back week or two try the Delta Queen on the Mississippi - No cruise ship will ever pamper you like they do on this boat.

clifclav · 10-20-2003, 11:53 AM

LD - I've heard that about the Delta Queen and other riverboats. They are supposedly a great way to travel up and down the Miss.

Plus the good thing is that if one of them starts to go down I can almost certainly swim the mile to shore. If some cruise liner goes down steaming from NYC to Bermuda my ass is shark food.

jerseyboy · 10-20-2003, 03:10 PM

I can understand quality over quantity, but you have to admit that alot of places are very similar, and once you get to know Charleston it is going to be a lot like other places in the US. Sure things will have different names but basically they will be the same. I'd much rather go places that are drastically different. Half the fun of travelling is seeing things you have never seen before and might not ever see again. That includes hearing foreign languages and trying exotic cuisine. You cannot get those things by visiting a bunch of small towns in America.

Liquor Dealer · 10-21-2003, 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jerseyboy
I can understand quality over quantity, but you have to admit that alot of places are very similar, and once you get to know Charleston it is going to be a lot like other places in the US. Sure things will have different names but basically they will be the same. I'd much rather go places that are drastically different. Half the fun of travelling is seeing things you have never seen before and might not ever see again. That includes hearing foreign languages and trying exotic cuisine. You cannot get those things by visiting a bunch of small towns in America.

Guess you've never been to a small town in New Mexico called Carlsbad - there's a hell of a hole down there -

or to Wall, SD - home of the world's largest drug store and... the Bad Lands - closest you'll ever get to walking on what could be the moon or another world. One of the most eerie, and beautiful places on earth - also one of the most desolate.

Or drive a short distance to the west of Wall to Rapid City, home of Mt. Rushmore. There's sculpture.... and then there is sculpture.

Everyone talks about Vegas but have you ever visited Branson, MO. Shows that might make Vegas blush with envy.

You can vist DC and tour the Smithsonian, the Air & Space Museum is the best in the world if you're into airplanes but... If you ever vist Liberal, KS check out there aviation museum - not the Smithsonian but on a par with it.

You say when you see one town you've seen them all - not in a hundred years. A person could never live long enough to actually see this country.

jerseyboy · 10-21-2003, 03:58 PM

Okay so you have pointed out some exceptions to what I have said, but for the most part, the things you have mentioned (aside from DC) are the only things to really do in those towns. Sure there are probably a few smaller things to see, but for the most part a sightseeing tour of those towns could be done in a weekend. Then what would you do for the next 10 days or so, pretty much anything you can do in any other town in America.

clifclav · 10-22-2003, 12:11 PM

jerseyboy - perhaps there are a lot of the same things to do in all of the towns in the country but exploring all of the things that make them different is part of what I'm talking about. Example: I eat at the Applebees near my house quite frequently. Good food, good prices, friendly people. I know its a chain restaurant but it's my local standby. When i travel I never go to an Applebees of TGIFridays or such. I always seek out people who can tell me of local place that offer something different and special to the area. Hell the local COC or policeman can tell you ten good places at the drop of a hat.

Yes there probably is only one day to spend at the Worlds largest ball of string museum. But the three days you spend there with the locals talking about what a yahoo the guy that runs the ball of string museum can be wonderful.

jerseyboy · 10-22-2003, 12:29 PM

Maybe I just have a different opinion on what I find interesting. I'd much rather see something completely different that I cannot see anywhere else, rather than seeing the local take on something. It really just doesnt excite me to visit places like the worlds largest ball of string, I'd much rather see an amazing cathedral or walk down a winding street full of interesting shops selling things I never though could be bought or sold. Perhaps the thing that interests me most though, is history. But not just any history, I am not interested in visiting every historical house that George Washington spent one night in during the revolutionary war. I'd much rather see the places where pivotal events took place.

I am also not very enthusiastic about vacations that involve just lying on the beach. I find these to be quite boring, and would much rather spend my time shopping or finding interesting views than just sitting in the sand absorbing the sun rays.

jvwgtr · 10-23-2003, 06:08 AM

I guess the most important thing is that we will always have a lot to learn from every community on the planet, whether it's the next town over, or the other side of the world.
Different people travel for different reasons, though...it depends on what you're looking for - history, art, architecture, or the perfect cup of cappuccino.
It sounds like you travel to learn about your fellow man, and you can't go wrong no matter where you look.
Hell, you could save a bundle and just hang out at your local mall or bus stop.

clifclav · 10-23-2003, 09:46 AM

very good point jvwgtr - although the bus stops in Washington can be a little sketchy.

losthellhound · 11-03-2003, 03:06 AM

I dont think you're exibiting any signs of being a xenophobe. Actually quite the contrary. The idea of wanting to explore and understand all the places in the States means you are open to things and people different from yourself. I can understand how you feel. I dont think I could explore all of Canada in a year of travelling. (less people, alot more land mass, and Im a nature person, so I think I'm beat).

splck · 11-04-2003, 10:12 AM

For me traveling is not just about seeing a place and the people, it's more about experiencing the culture. Traveling around in one's own country exclusively doesn’t give you that sense of a different culture, while traveling in different countries with different languages offers an endless culture change.
I agree with Macheath that leaving your own country and then returning really makes you appreciate what you have at home.
I think more people should travel abroad; it will open up their eyes to other ideas and broaden their views of the world around us.

jerseyboy · 11-05-2003, 07:27 PM

What splck is saying is especially true of those of us living in the states. Being so far away and from the rest of the world and coming from a relatively isolated country as america, you dont really get a good feel for what the rest of the world thinks. Everyone in America should spend some time abroad, if only for a short vacation but more preferably for an extended period of time. It can really open your eyes to the way the world really works.

GuttersnipeXL · 11-05-2003, 07:49 PM

Pretty much what everyone said here is what I would say. If you want to truly seee this country, road trip....just go for it. You could never plan on seeing or doing some of the things that you'll stumble across in say, Appalachia, or in a canoe on one of Minnesota's 10,000 lakes. There is so much to do, like someone said, you'll never see it all in a lifetime. Go with where the wind takes you.

10-17-2003, 05:58 AM	#1 (permalink)
clifclav absolute relativist Location: D.C.	Am I A Xenophobe? I have traveled quite a bit during my lifetime. I've spent several months at a time in both England & Ireland. I've visited Italy, The Netherlands, & West Germany at the time. I've vacationed in Canada, Mexico, The Bahamas & Venezuala. I've also decided tentatively that I am never going to leave the United States again. My main reason for this is that I belong to the school of quality over quantity. I want to spend all of my future travel dollars getting intimately acquainted with one country or even possibly one region of one country. While I recognize that I may miss out on never seeing New Zealand or Thailand, I also recognize that I would love to be able to live like a native of Charleston SC for three weeks. Or spend three weeks just taking walking tours of New York. My questions are these. Does anyone else subscribe to this line of reasoning? Am I being to narrow-minded? Will I have not lived a full life if I never climb Uluru? Or is it OK to travel within and study one country remarkably well? I feel pretty well justified in choosing America. It is my native country and I feel that there is certainly enough to spend a lifetime visiting and studying. Your comments and thoughts are most appreciated. __________________ Neither rain , nor cold, nor dark of night shall.......ahh whatever, just get me a beer!

10-20-2003, 06:54 AM	#4 (permalink)
clifclav absolute relativist Location: D.C.	Both valid points and I thank you for them. What you are talking about cetacean is what I want to do in the U.S. I specifically brought up Chrarleston in my original post because that is the vacation I am taking in February. I plan to find either an extended stay place in town or even better yet a home or apartment to sublet for two weeks and get intimately acquanted with the city of Charleston. There are so many places in the US that i want to do this in that I can't ever see doing it in another country. Who knows. __________________ Neither rain , nor cold, nor dark of night shall.......ahh whatever, just get me a beer! Last edited by clifclav; 10-20-2003 at 11:50 AM..

10-20-2003, 11:27 AM	#5 (permalink)
Liquor Dealer Super Agitator Location: Just SW of Nowhere!!! In the good old US of A	A person could spend a lifetime just touring the U.S. and never come close to seeing it all. I've been abroad several times and will admit that we don't have some of the antquities that you'll find in Europe but there is so much more to do and see than one could ever do in a lifetime - if you want to spend a totally laid back week or two try the Delta Queen on the Mississippi - No cruise ship will ever pamper you like they do on this boat. __________________ Life isn't always a bowl of cherries, sometimes it's more like a jar of Jalapenos --- what you say or do today might burn your ass tomorrow!!!

10-20-2003, 11:53 AM	#6 (permalink)
clifclav absolute relativist Location: D.C.	LD - I've heard that about the Delta Queen and other riverboats. They are supposedly a great way to travel up and down the Miss. Plus the good thing is that if one of them starts to go down I can almost certainly swim the mile to shore. If some cruise liner goes down steaming from NYC to Bermuda my ass is shark food. __________________ Neither rain , nor cold, nor dark of night shall.......ahh whatever, just get me a beer!

10-22-2003, 12:11 PM	#10 (permalink)
clifclav absolute relativist Location: D.C.	jerseyboy - perhaps there are a lot of the same things to do in all of the towns in the country but exploring all of the things that make them different is part of what I'm talking about. Example: I eat at the Applebees near my house quite frequently. Good food, good prices, friendly people. I know its a chain restaurant but it's my local standby. When i travel I never go to an Applebees of TGIFridays or such. I always seek out people who can tell me of local place that offer something different and special to the area. Hell the local COC or policeman can tell you ten good places at the drop of a hat. Yes there probably is only one day to spend at the Worlds largest ball of string museum. But the three days you spend there with the locals talking about what a yahoo the guy that runs the ball of string museum can be wonderful. __________________ Neither rain , nor cold, nor dark of night shall.......ahh whatever, just get me a beer!

10-17-2003, 03:55 PM	#2 (permalink)
cetacean Insane Location: New York, NY	Hey Clif, I can respect your reasoning. After all, the US has so much to offer. From Mountains to desert to plains to coast to rainforest and everything in between, the US has got it all. However, I think that life is longer than you think. Why make such a definitive statement as to not travel beyond our borders. I have a similar rational in that I love to travel to far off distant lands, but while I am there, I prefer to settle in to a small region and become intimately familiar with it. I know that my whole outlook on life has changed based on the experiences and friendships that I have made in my travels. I also find that traveling out of the country makes me really appreciate what we have here once I return. It is always a great feeling at the US customs desk at the airport when the officer stamps your passport, looks you in the eye and says, "Welcome home."

10-18-2003, 04:30 AM	#3 (permalink)
Macheath Junkie Location: Sydney, Australia	Cetacean has hit the nail on the head. Absence makes the heart grow fonder. Coming BACK is a beautiful feeling but you wouldn't get that feeling if you didn't leave occasionally. Never say never...

10-20-2003, 03:10 PM	#7 (permalink)
jerseyboy Insane	I can understand quality over quantity, but you have to admit that alot of places are very similar, and once you get to know Charleston it is going to be a lot like other places in the US. Sure things will have different names but basically they will be the same. I'd much rather go places that are drastically different. Half the fun of travelling is seeing things you have never seen before and might not ever see again. That includes hearing foreign languages and trying exotic cuisine. You cannot get those things by visiting a bunch of small towns in America.

10-21-2003, 03:58 PM	#9 (permalink)
jerseyboy Insane	Okay so you have pointed out some exceptions to what I have said, but for the most part, the things you have mentioned (aside from DC) are the only things to really do in those towns. Sure there are probably a few smaller things to see, but for the most part a sightseeing tour of those towns could be done in a weekend. Then what would you do for the next 10 days or so, pretty much anything you can do in any other town in America.

10-22-2003, 12:29 PM	#11 (permalink)
jerseyboy Insane	Maybe I just have a different opinion on what I find interesting. I'd much rather see something completely different that I cannot see anywhere else, rather than seeing the local take on something. It really just doesnt excite me to visit places like the worlds largest ball of string, I'd much rather see an amazing cathedral or walk down a winding street full of interesting shops selling things I never though could be bought or sold. Perhaps the thing that interests me most though, is history. But not just any history, I am not interested in visiting every historical house that George Washington spent one night in during the revolutionary war. I'd much rather see the places where pivotal events took place. I am also not very enthusiastic about vacations that involve just lying on the beach. I find these to be quite boring, and would much rather spend my time shopping or finding interesting views than just sitting in the sand absorbing the sun rays.

10-23-2003, 06:08 AM	#12 (permalink)
jvwgtr Completely bananas Location: Florida	I guess the most important thing is that we will always have a lot to learn from every community on the planet, whether it's the next town over, or the other side of the world. Different people travel for different reasons, though...it depends on what you're looking for - history, art, architecture, or the perfect cup of cappuccino. It sounds like you travel to learn about your fellow man, and you can't go wrong no matter where you look. Hell, you could save a bundle and just hang out at your local mall or bus stop.

10-23-2003, 09:46 AM	#13 (permalink)
clifclav absolute relativist Location: D.C.	very good point jvwgtr - although the bus stops in Washington can be a little sketchy. __________________ Neither rain , nor cold, nor dark of night shall.......ahh whatever, just get me a beer!

11-03-2003, 03:06 AM	#14 (permalink)
losthellhound Thats MR. Muffin Face now Location: Everywhere work sends me	I dont think you're exibiting any signs of being a xenophobe. Actually quite the contrary. The idea of wanting to explore and understand all the places in the States means you are open to things and people different from yourself. I can understand how you feel. I dont think I could explore all of Canada in a year of travelling. (less people, alot more land mass, and Im a nature person, so I think I'm beat). __________________ "Life is possible only with illusions. And so, the question for the science of mental health must become an absolutely new and revolutionary one, yet one that reflects the essence of the human condition: On what level of illusion does one live?" -- Ernest Becker, The Denial of Death

11-04-2003, 10:12 AM	#15 (permalink)
splck it's jam Location: Lowerainland BC	For me traveling is not just about seeing a place and the people, it's more about experiencing the culture. Traveling around in one's own country exclusively doesn’t give you that sense of a different culture, while traveling in different countries with different languages offers an endless culture change. I agree with Macheath that leaving your own country and then returning really makes you appreciate what you have at home. I think more people should travel abroad; it will open up their eyes to other ideas and broaden their views of the world around us. __________________ nice line eh?

11-05-2003, 07:27 PM	#16 (permalink)
jerseyboy Insane	What splck is saying is especially true of those of us living in the states. Being so far away and from the rest of the world and coming from a relatively isolated country as america, you dont really get a good feel for what the rest of the world thinks. Everyone in America should spend some time abroad, if only for a short vacation but more preferably for an extended period of time. It can really open your eyes to the way the world really works.

11-05-2003, 07:49 PM	#17 (permalink)
GuttersnipeXL Giggity Giggity!! Location: N'York	Pretty much what everyone said here is what I would say. If you want to truly seee this country, road trip....just go for it. You could never plan on seeing or doing some of the things that you'll stumble across in say, Appalachia, or in a canoe on one of Minnesota's 10,000 lakes. There is so much to do, like someone said, you'll never see it all in a lifetime. Go with where the wind takes you. __________________ When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. HST