amalek

So I've been dating a girl for about 7 months now. We started off great and it's generally been really good. Sex, intimacy, etc, is all in place. I was laid off about 2 months in, however, and I've been kinda de facto living with her ever since then. Before that, we dated and saw each other almost every night after work, after I got done tutoring, etc.

I guess the long and the short of it is that she's currently in a conundrum with her work situation (she's doing great monetarily as a nurse but it's killing her and she hates it). We've had discussions in the past about things we need to work on but this time she's pretty serious. To sum up, she says she doesn't feel secure with me and/or doesn't feel a serious commitment. My actions speak louder than what I've told her in our discussions.

My question is, assuming she's correct, is anyone else out there terrible at expressing through actions how you feel for someone you love? Am I lazy or just inconsiderate? Or both? When I had a job, I got her thoughtful little gifts all the time - she mentioned needing highlighters for work, I randomly surprised her with them one day. She wanted a new coffee pot, I researched and got her a really good one that she loves. She wanted a tea pot because she makes a lot of tea, so I got her a nice one from Kitchen Kapers a while back. I'm very confused by the whole thing.

rahl

As soon as you figure out what's going on inside a womans head, you let me know.

Seriously though, it sounds like she's at a crossroads in her professional life and is taking it out on you.

__________________
"Your life is Yours alone...Rise up and live it"

Craven Morehead

A couple of things to consider:
Is she needy?
Is she insecure?

If either is yes, then you might not ever be able to provide the committment she's looking for.

And one thing to consider about yourself, you mention "started off great and it's generally been really good" but then you provide only sex and intimacy to substantiate your point. Isn't there more?

amalek

She's not really needy or insecure. No more than your average gal.

For instance, I think the problem this last time is that I didn't think to call ahead or text her saying "hey, stopping by my parents' house really quickly, don't wait up " or something along those lines (I was already out tutoring for the evening before going to my parents' and she was expecting me back, so she didn't eat, look up places to move in California, etc). So yeah, that's pretty shitty on my part no matter how you look at it.

There is much more. Sharing goofy moments, being completely uninhibited around each other, hanging out with mutual friends all the time, talking about vacation spots we'd like to go to, sharing interests, blah blah the rest of it. It's all great.

---------- Post added at 07:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:05 AM ----------

good point :P

That's the way I feel sometimes. But hey, maybe I'm just not being there for her enough now that she is at this big crossroads. Small things, like my above post, but enough to make her doubt my seriousness or my commitment, I'm sure.

ShaniFaye

this probably wont help, but I will throw it out there anyway. One of the things I really really really came to hate about my ex husband was that he thought buying me things was an expression of "love". He would buy me stuff but never just turn off the tv for us to sit and talk, or do for our child if I was upset, or EVER remember to take the garbage out no matter how many times I asked etc...For me it couldnt be farther from the truth. Spending money on me does not tell me you love me.

Its little things that do... leaving me a note in my purse or in the bathroom or in my car telling me things like how I make him feel... letting me be the one to bitch and bitch and bitch about something until I can get it "out" even though he may be pissed about the same thing... sympathizing and not downplaying things that upset me and being excited about something I am even though its not his thing lol

Those are just an example... and are returned in like kind by me

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I want the diabetic plan that comes with rollover carbs. I dont like the unused one expiring at midnite!!

Cimarron29414

I would consider the possibility that your inability to express your feelings adequately (to her standards) coupled with the fact that you are unemployed and living with her - all combined, she might feel like she is being used. I would reassure her that you intend to see this relationship all the way through and that you are deeply appreciative of her generosity. Basically, spin the negative to a positive. You can't rightly say, "Yeah, I know I'm mooching off you and you probably feel pressured to stay in a job you hate because you have both of us to support."

I don't mean any of this as a criticism of your circumstance. Just be extra sensitive to how she might perceive it and go the extra mile so she doesn't feel exploited. Be attentive.

__________________
Gives a man a halo, does mead.

"Here lies The_Jazz: Killed by an ambitious, sparkly, pink butterfly."

snowy

To the OP: Don't underestimate the power of just listening (and I mean really listening). Like Shani's husband, my SO just lets me talk and talk and talk (it isn't always bitching, though sometimes it is) and he listens without judgment. Although he is an engineer and always looking to solve a problem, he's come to understand that sometimes just letting me talk it out allows me to solve the problem.

I found a good outline of how to listen actively: Active Listening - Communication Skills Training from MindTools.com Active listening definitely makes it easier to listen and to overcome the barriers to listening (there are a lot of them).

Relationships aren't easy. My SO and I weren't born knowing how to communicate effectively with one another; it's something we've had to figure out and practice, practice, practice. Good communication will improve your relationship and reduce conflict. If you need more resources on effective communication in relationships, hit up your public library. I can guarantee they'll have a shelf of books on the subject, and an interest in improving your skills may catch your SO's eye and show that you really are invested in the relationship.

__________________
If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

amalek

Thanks for the heads up.

To the other person with a similar post (about buying things not being the best thing), this is true, but I buy her things sporadically and they're always very thoughtful. She's even remarked that they are, so I think that's pretty good.

When she gets home from work, I always listen to her talk about her day. I REALLY listen. I know everyone's name at her job at this point and I've only been up there to visit a handful of times. She always remarks how I really listen (because she'll say something like "my administrator did so and so today" and I'll say "Jenn?", to which she responds "well done! you really listen"). Shit like that. I actively listen and don't try to input anything. I myself am a problem solver, so I just sit back and let her talk without trying to solve anything.

ShaniFaye

Have you tried asking her what WOULD make her feel more secure?

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I want the diabetic plan that comes with rollover carbs. I dont like the unused one expiring at midnite!!

Cimarron29414

(I love you Shani.) Dude, don't ask that question. NEVER ask a question if you might not want to hear the answer. What if she says, "an engagement ring???" (and you aren't ready for that yet.) Talk about awkward.

__________________
Gives a man a halo, does mead.

"Here lies The_Jazz: Killed by an ambitious, sparkly, pink butterfly."

Hektore

Then you say, "I'm not ready for that, yet" and explain why not. If it turns out she has to be engaged now and it's a deal-breaker for her, better to find out by asking her than waiting until she gets pissed off enough to leave you high and dry over it. Besides, after it's over she might actually end up agreeing with you that your relationship isn't as ready for that step as she thought.

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The advantage law is the best law in rugby, because it lets you ignore all the others for the good of the game.

Jinn

+1

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CinnamonGirl

You say she's "upset again," which implies that she's been upset a lot lately. Does she no longer feel secure because you're not buying her stuff anymore? Because that's pretty lame.

Nurses work long hours...maybe you could do something special for her (that doesn't involve purchasing "stuff") on her days off, or when she gets home from work. Make her dinner, rub her shoulders, sing her a goofy song.

__________________
"...for though she was ordinary, she possessed health, wit, courage, charm, and cheerfulness. But because she was not beautiful, no one ever seemed to notice these other qualities, which is so often the way of the world."


"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?"

Hektore

Scrub her entire place from top to bottom, new bed sheets, mopped floors, even the toilet. All of it.

Her favourite dinner hot and ready when she gets home. With her particular drink and a home-made dessert.

A warm bath, scented candles, bath salts, a foot rub (as a nurse she probably spends all day on her feet). Maybe a small box of her favourite chocolates or a single stem of her favourite flower. Something small and inexpensive but still shows you pay attention to what she wants.

This one is probably the most important. THANK HER for helping to bail you out of your tough spot. Let her know just what it means to you and that you appreciate everything she is doing for you. People often spew lines about actions being more important than words while forgetting that speaking is itself an action.

Most of the women I know will tell you that it's not about money, it's about elbow grease. An $8 brass ring from a k-mart box can carry more meaning than a $15000 ring from Tiffany's, it all depends on the circumstances surrounding it. Same thing with cleaning her place, there is a huge difference between having her place cleaned (if you could afford it) and you getting down and dirty yourself.

__________________
The advantage law is the best law in rugby, because it lets you ignore all the others for the good of the game.

Cimarron29414

I think you might have taken my post a little too seriously.

__________________
Gives a man a halo, does mead.

"Here lies The_Jazz: Killed by an ambitious, sparkly, pink butterfly."

ShaniFaye

I agree with Hektore... its honest and it lets you know where things stand with her

Cimarron, I only took the part in parentheses seriously

__________________
I want the diabetic plan that comes with rollover carbs. I dont like the unused one expiring at midnite!!

spindles

My wife and I have read this book:

Home - Five Love Languages

The author/s suggest that everyone has different mechanisms for feeling loved (gifts, physical touch, acts of service, quality time and words of affirmation). Your OP suggests she might be a 'gifts' kinda girl. This doesn't necessarily mean expensive items.

This book certainly changed the way I interact with my wife...

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who hid my keyboard's PANIC button?

MrFriendly

I agree with Hektor, putting in a lot of effort around the house can ease a lot of the tension, but I think something that will count a hell of a lot more is if she can see that you're putting in a lot of effort to better your situation.

Don't let her feel like you're just mooching off her, as she will, as much as she'll try not to, start to feel a lot of resentment. Really put in a solid effort to find new work and better your situation. Like others have said as well, let her know that you do appreciate the help she's given you, don't let her feel like she's been taken for granted.

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You are not a slave

Shauk

Wow, i'm surprised at the responses in this thread.

None of you seem to be addressing the long term with your suggestions. Even the OP glosses over the major issue with temporary fixes.


listen, I know little, but I know this. She wants you to man up, express independence, she doesn't want a live in house-sitter, you're encroaching on her independence as well. Maybe she's not ready to live with you yet either and she's just doing it because she's too nice to tell you to gtfo. The thing is, it's all building up under the surface, what you need to do, it stop with the misdirection and peace offerings, and fix the primary issue that you're not wanting to address. Detach yourself a bit from this relationship and give her some time with her independence again. She also might find that she has mixed feelings on her being suddenly more lonely in tradeoff for you being suddenly more manly. (or whatever word you want to describe achieving independence)

the easier said than done part is you, getting a job.
easier said than done doesn't mean you shouldn't work your ass off for it. You've got more at stake than a mere job. If you really care about your situation with her, you're going to man up and get some shit done for the big picture instead of wasting time trying to be her maid.

Toaster126

I highlighted what I was going to say to you. That and the fact that you are fighting millions of years of biology. Everyone can say they are so enlightened and independent and feminist and blahblahblah, but if you don't consider you are still fighting millions of years of biology you are kidding yourself.

I'm not saying she's some sort of gold-digger, nor should she be. I am saying that there is a reason that certain things happen with human relationships (like many women liking assholes), even if ultimately that is not what is good for us (many women would prefer not to like assholes, they just are attracted to many traits that assholes have that are predictors for success).

__________________
"The question isn't who is going to let me, it's who is going to stop me." (Ayn Rand)
"The truth is that our finest moments are most likely to occur when we are feeling deeply uncomfortable, unhappy, or unfulfilled. For it is only in such moments, propelled by our discomfort, that we are likely to step out of our ruts and start searching for different ways or truer answers." (M. Scott Peck)

ratbastid

"She's Upset Again" is the name of my Dresden Dolls cover band.

lurkette

That's my man

ratbastid, I'm surprised you didn't chime in and say "that was my wife 10 years ago."

I remember one time...I was feeling really stressed about work - traveling about once every 2 weeks, taking on more responsibility - and I was still dealing with a lot of anxiety. I was in Florida for a conference when a huge ice storm hit NC and our power went out. Ratbastid was home by himself, and it was a little miserable - sleeping by the fireplace, cooking on the grill. But he was supposed to be leaving for a trip for a weekend seminar the day I was coming home, and I just flipped out that he was still planning to go on the trip and leaving me home with all the pets and no electricity and my anxiety and missing him....basically I was a big baby, but I remember being beyond upset and saying "do you even WANT to be married?!" and it sounds like the same kind of questioning of commitment that you're getting from your girlfriend. I'm SO not defending my self-centeredness, but I felt like his concerns were more important than mine, that he wasn't taking care of me and my stress (which I know now are mine to take care of) and he was being a big child (pot/kettle/black).

Anyhow, it might be that she sees herself working long hours at a job she hates and coming home to someone with no concerns and no responsibilities. It may not be a fair assessment - I don't know whether you pick up the slack at home or not, whether you actively do things to help her feel less stressed and more like she has a partner than a roommate or a child. She may be being unfair, but she may just be responding to what she sees as your unwillingness to be the kind of committed partner she wants and needs.

And I might totally be projecting based on my own experience. But as others have said, it couldn't hurt to ask! She might not even know what she really wants, but you'll never find out guessing from across the room.

__________________
"If ten million people believe a foolish thing, it is still a foolish thing."

- Anatole France

Eilonwy

I've been this girl... ex had a job, then he didn't & was living off me. Whoever up there said she might feel like she's being used could very well be right... that's how I felt. It's hard to say what exactly she means by feeling unsecure without knowing more details, but living with someone who even seems to be okay living off of you when you work hard for your income and are yourself not happy at work is a wretched feeling. I ended up feeling nothing but resentment toward him and we broke up years ago. Granted, he was an ass and we had other problems. If this is the only problem between you two, the fix seems easy to me... get a job... I know it's not easy to do these days, but as long as you put effort into a search, that should help.

amalek

We've spoken at length about my living situation at her place and she even invited me to live with her. She cleared out closet space, etc. I believe that issue has been thoroughly taken care of. I didn't want to originally, but she assured me that she wanted me around and liked having me around for when she gets home from work as a shoulder to lean on, etc. That was all going well. I'm still looking for work and I still do things here and there when I can. I tutor part-time in the evening which always gives her at least a couple hours of complete freedom - no work, no worries, no me, no nothing but her and whatever she feels like doing.

She just seems to feel like we don't have a connection or that she's completely isolated. She says she has felt this before and doesn't want to feel it anymore. I always make sure to clean up a bit before she gets home - do the dishes, make the bed, have some candles lit, have the Phils game on for her to watch when she gets in (she loves the Phils), vacuum once a week, straighten up the couches so it doesn't look like a mess, etc etc. Yet she feels like I'm not there for her. I get mixed signals. She tells me all these things (to which I have no good response) and then holds my hand and tells me everything will be fine once we get to California. I think she hates the area and needs a vacation.

I don't know. I'm so incredibly confused and hurt by all of this.

Hektore

Ask her to be more precise than 'you're not there for me'. Specific, concrete examples would help everyone (including yourself) to understand what she means by that, because as it stands 'you're not there for me' is just a meaningless phrase.

Words of wisdom: When/if you ask her to define the contexts in which she feels abandoned do not attempt to defend yourself. If you do, it's the same as telling her that her feelings are invalid or incorrect (which you may feel they are) and will not help your relationship.

__________________
The advantage law is the best law in rugby, because it lets you ignore all the others for the good of the game.

amalek

I have asked for the contexts in which she feels abandoned and she says she "doesn't know" -- she says it's been happening since the beginning. I've been nothing but constructive about the whole thing; I always open the discussion, I always try to talk with her until we come to something, and it's always better after the fact. This is the longest she's been upset with me in a long time.

She says "if I feel like I can't come to you when I'm having problems, then this isn't going to work"

what the hell do I do? how do I open up and make her feel warm and welcome? my way of doing it doesn't seem to be working.

Shauk

I still say move out, or at least make a serious appearance of moving out, if she really wants you to stay, she'll either understand that you can't handle her complaining about the situation she created, and suck it up, or you'll move out, both regain your independence, and she'll be attracted to that again.

She just sounds like a case of the "not ready to settle but really likes you" girl.

Toaster126

If this is true, then I think she is done with the relationship and either can't admit it to herself yet, or is afraid of dealing with those consequences. If she has problems with the relationship, but you are the one that is bringing up possible solutions, and she is the one who is complaining but can't say why, then you have your answer already and aren't listening.

__________________
"The question isn't who is going to let me, it's who is going to stop me." (Ayn Rand)
"The truth is that our finest moments are most likely to occur when we are feeling deeply uncomfortable, unhappy, or unfulfilled. For it is only in such moments, propelled by our discomfort, that we are likely to step out of our ruts and start searching for different ways or truer answers." (M. Scott Peck)