politicophile

Here's my situation, generally. I am just finishing up my junior year of college and plan on attending law school after graduation. My GPA is currently 3.42, but it will be approximately 3.48 to 3.49 at the end of the semester. Thus, if I were to apply to law school this fall, I would have about a 3.48 on my transcript. I would, of course, not be able to include any graduation-related honors.

The second possibility is for me to take a year off before returning to school. My GPA at graduation will be somewhere between 3.56 and 3.62. This number being in excess of 3.50, I will receive my diploma Magna. By this point I'll also have graduated with honors in philosophy, having completed my thesis.

My goal is to attend a top U.S. law school. Generally speaking, I would like to break into the top 15 or so schools on most ranking systems, with Yale being my first choice.

Given my goal of attending an extremely competitive law school, taking a year off seems to be a no-brainer, as doing so would vastly improve my credentials and therefore my odds of being accepted.

So much for background. My question is this: what sort of job or activity should I do for my year off if my primary goal is to maximize my probability of getting into a top school? It would ideally be a unique enough experience to make the application committee take another look at my file. Since we're talking about a single year, I'm willing to entertain even exotic suggestions. What can I do that would make me look different from the other prospective law students?

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The peculiar evil of silencing the expression of an opinion is, that it is robbing the human race; posterity as well as the existing generation; those who dissent from the opinion, still more than those who hold it. If the opinion is right, they are deprived of the opportunity of exchanging error for truth: if wrong, they lose, what is almost as great a benefit, the clearer perception and livelier impression of truth, produced by its collision with error. ~John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

CaliLivChick

One question before suggestions... would it be possible to apply for the law schools you want now, and then if you don't get in to the ones you want, apply again in a year?

Okay, suggestions:
(practical)
- internship at a law firm
- I'm not sure what it takes, in terms of education, to be a paralegal, or give any sort of legal advice, but something if you have enough education at this point, then something like that
- Volunteering of some kind, preferably something that relates to what kind of law you want to practice. For example, if you want to do environmental law, volunteer for an environmental organization. Real estate law, volunteer/intern at a real estate office.

(exotic)
- Travel the world. My cousin and her boyfriend did that for a year, and had a great time.
- join the Peace Corps, or something like that, where you can go to a far away place and help people
- go skydiving, bungee jumping, or deep sea diving
- create or design something (not quite sure what, but something that interests you)
- If you had a year of your life to do whatever you want, what would you want to do?

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Don't trust anything that can bleed for a week and not die. Oh wait, that's me... nevermind... you can trust me.

politicophile

Great suggestion, but unfortunately this is not possible. The SOP for law schools is not to reconsider an application unless something really substantial has changed. Raising my GPA 0.1 and working for a year won't cut it. This is a bit odd because those same changes will definitely increase my initial chances of being accepted... I talked up and down with my pre-law advisor about this and she said I cannot apply twice to the same school if I get rejected the first time.

These are fine suggestions. Paralegal is certainly a possibility. I just feel like these sorts of opportunities won't do a lot to set me apart from other applicants: a lot of other people are going to be coming from similar backgrounds.

See, the Peace Corps suggestion is more along the lines of what I'm thinking, although perhaps not quite as cliche a post-college one-year experience as that one in particular. I want something that will make the admissions personell say "Wow, that is really interesting!"

Travelling the world, going skydiving, etc. are somewhat less work-oriented than what I have in mind, although I appreciate the broad array of suggestions.

Here are some ideas I've come up with tonight: I'd love to hear about similar opportunities, if you can think of any:

-Working to release wrongly convicted inmates
-Working on a referendum issue, such as increased protection against discrimination based on sexual orientation.
-Unusual paralegal work (don't really have anything specific in mind)
-Policy position in Washington DC
-etc.

__________________
The peculiar evil of silencing the expression of an opinion is, that it is robbing the human race; posterity as well as the existing generation; those who dissent from the opinion, still more than those who hold it. If the opinion is right, they are deprived of the opportunity of exchanging error for truth: if wrong, they lose, what is almost as great a benefit, the clearer perception and livelier impression of truth, produced by its collision with error. ~John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

CaliLivChick

This goes along the line of volunteering in a legal fashion, which would be practical, but because of what you're taking on, would set you in the exotic category (from this layman's point of view)

Would these be internship type things? Or perhaps legal assistant things? If you find a lawyer that's working on something like this, you could help them out with it (practical), but play up what you were actually working on to the schools (exotic).

What kind of law do you want to go into? That may help guide your decision.

__________________
Don't trust anything that can bleed for a week and not die. Oh wait, that's me... nevermind... you can trust me.

Zeraph

You can't apply to the same school twice...what about applying to a less prestigeous school first as back up? Then take the minimum amount of coursework until you can try applying to the better one and if you get in transfer them. That might even get you in easier because you would have demonstrated you can already do some of the coursework.

Elphaba

Didn't Jorgelito get an internship with one of the think tanks in Washington DC? That might be the good impression you want on your curricula vitae. Good luck, Adam.

maleficent

Depending on what you want to do... and since you mentioned working with releasing wrongly convicted criminals check with The New England Innocence Project and see if they are looking for interns or volunteers.

another suggestion I would have, woudl require relocation on your part, but the Southern Poverty Law Center, but generally their interns are second year law students, in fact, I'm sure you'll find that most internship positions will need for you to be in law school, and not just thinking about it.

What about spending a 5th year in college, to raise your GPA.

Also, how'd you do on your LSATs? they carry a lot of weight with the top tier law schools.

This site allows you to plug in your lsat score, and your gpa and gives you the schools you can get into...

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maleficent

Paralegalism is a different career, that often requires the paralegal to have a certificate from a paralegal program.. Yes some paralegals go on to law school, but it's not always that stepping stone.. My father's paralegals do a lot of work for his firm, and bill at a pretty high hourly rate (a lot cheaper than a lawyer does) but it's a career choice for them... not somethign to do in hopes of getting into a better law school.

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asaris

I think Politico's suggestions are right on. I just wanted to add that with your GPA, even with a very good LSAT, you might well not be able to get into a top law school. My GPA was better than yours and I had a very high LSAT score, and the best law school I got into was Cornell. If you want more specific advice, feel free to send me a PM.

__________________
"Die Deutschen meinen, daß die Kraft sich in Härte und Grausamkeit offenbaren müsse, sie unterwerfen sich dann gerne und mit Bewunderung:[...]. Daß es Kraft giebt in der Milde und Stille, das glauben sie nicht leicht."

"The Germans believe that power must reveal itself in hardness and cruelty and then submit themselves gladly and with admiration[...]. They do not believe readily that there is power in meekness and calm."

-- Friedrich Nietzsche

jorgelito

Hmmm...I think your LSAT score is more important than GPA plus other "intangibles" like internship, hard life etc. The LSAT score is considered more bcause of grade inflation at schools like Stanford.

So, 4.0 at Stanford but a low LSAT score of 168 would probably only get you into a 2nd tier school.

A 3.5 at a lesser known or less prestigious school such as Duke and a 175+ on the LSAT plus loads of extracurricular activity, will increase your chances by a lot. An internship at a law firm or JusticeCoprs etc will also help a lot.

Wow, Elphaba, I can't believe you remebered that I was gone for a quarter in DC. Thanks!

Elphaba

I had hoped that you would share the experience. It's not too late, you know.

politicophile

Lots of good advice here. Thank you all for contributing.

Asaris, I know that my GPA is nothing to write home about, but it puts me above the 25th percentile at schools like BC, BU, Cornell, Duke, Georgetown, George Washington, NYU, etc. Aiming to beat the bottom quarter isn't much, I know, but I'm hoping that a high LSAT score might counter my less impressive GPA.

I'm taking the exam on the 12th of June, so I'll have a better idea then. I took the Kaplan prep course and scored between 170 and 176. If I can repeat the 176, I might be in business at the top schools.

Back to the issue at hand...

New England Innocence Project sounds like an interesting possibility. The whole DC think tank thing is definitely on the table, as well. I also have connections with a certain U.S. Senator and might be able to swing a policy position in her office. But as great as these opportunities sound, they just don't strike me as distinctive enough to really catch someone's eye. I'll keep thinking, but please let me know if you come up with anything else!

__________________
The peculiar evil of silencing the expression of an opinion is, that it is robbing the human race; posterity as well as the existing generation; those who dissent from the opinion, still more than those who hold it. If the opinion is right, they are deprived of the opportunity of exchanging error for truth: if wrong, they lose, what is almost as great a benefit, the clearer perception and livelier impression of truth, produced by its collision with error. ~John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

Elphaba

Senator Collins may have good advice and possible connections that would lead you in a positive direction. Snowe may be a good source as well. Use you contacts, Adam.

maleficent

20 years ago, when I applied to law school - and I had the same mind set that i wanted to go to a top tier law school (and this was also advice given to me by lawyers) I had a 168 on the LSAT's, a 3.7 GPA from a pretty good school witha double major in Math and Finance, reccommendations coming out the ying yang, internships every year I was in school... I didn't get in to my top 4 choices... it was a different time then and a lot more competitive then (the job market sucked so people were staying in school)... but the LSAT is extremely important, not only is the GPA important but the classes you took to get that GPA and WHERE you went to school also factors in.

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Rodney

Sign on as a paralegal with some kind of _movement_ that offers (or needs) legal assistance -- like a tenant's rights organization, a conservation group that's fighting court battles to protect some particular piece of the environment, and so on. The more underfunded the organization, the more responsibility you'll be given and the more impressive your portfolio (if potential law students have such things) will be.

I'd go with some kind of grassroots group, largely because they're less well funded on the whole, and thus you'll be given more to do -- all the work you can eat :-). You'd also get political experience at the ground level, which will be very valuable to you if you intend politics to be part of your future.

asaris

politico --

Like I said, my GPA was slightly higher than yours, and I got a 176 on the LSAT. I also have two MAs, though this might have hurt more than it helped. Each candidate is unique, of course, and I certainly don't mean to discourage you from applying to top 10 schools. But you should also apply to some schools in the top 25 or 30. Although I'm very happy here at WashU, I wish I had applied to more schools in between Cornell and Wash U. It probably would have given me more choices. And bear in mind that going to a school ranked lower means that you'll get more money in scholarships and that you'll probably be ranked higher in the class. Whether you want to do that depends somewhat on what you hope to do when you're done.

__________________
"Die Deutschen meinen, daß die Kraft sich in Härte und Grausamkeit offenbaren müsse, sie unterwerfen sich dann gerne und mit Bewunderung:[...]. Daß es Kraft giebt in der Milde und Stille, das glauben sie nicht leicht."

"The Germans believe that power must reveal itself in hardness and cruelty and then submit themselves gladly and with admiration[...]. They do not believe readily that there is power in meekness and calm."

-- Friedrich Nietzsche

Zar

Something of a derail here, but humor me if you will. I also will be applying to law schools in the coming year, and asaris saying
made me think. What exactly are the consequences of attending a law school which is less highly ranked than others? I mean, assuming you graduate, you will end up with your J.D. no matter where you go. I assume that extremely prestigious law firms will be more apt to look at you if you've graduated from Yale rather than Podunk Law School. Even so, you can still be a lawyer and make a fairly good living. Is there anything I'm overlooking here other than perhaps being passed over by elite law firms?

asaris

Well, most law firms are going to be more willing to look at you if you come from Yale. One difference is going to be where your school is well known. Because we have a crap Career Services Office, it's hard to get a job on one of the coasts. But that's okay, because I want to work in the midwest. Because I want to do government work, having a scholarship is more important to me. If you're going to be making $100,000 when you graduate, it's less important to have a scholarship. But that advice wasn't meant to be "Worry if you can't get into Yale"; it's more guided at the question "Which law school, among those you got into, do you want to go to?"

__________________
"Die Deutschen meinen, daß die Kraft sich in Härte und Grausamkeit offenbaren müsse, sie unterwerfen sich dann gerne und mit Bewunderung:[...]. Daß es Kraft giebt in der Milde und Stille, das glauben sie nicht leicht."

"The Germans believe that power must reveal itself in hardness and cruelty and then submit themselves gladly and with admiration[...]. They do not believe readily that there is power in meekness and calm."

-- Friedrich Nietzsche