felton

I just got a new dog. Found her walking along the road. Tried to find owner (no tags) to no avail. She is very bright. Has learned sit, laydown, and sort of learned stay. Housebroken.

Does anyone have good methods for training? I think she can be one of those really smart dogs that learn about anything. I have been using mainly treats to train her but I want to know how to really train her. Suggestions?

roadkill

Go to your local book store and get dog training for dummies, it has tons of tips... might even find a copy online somewhere.

Also you might want to look up "dog training" on www.google.com

Acetylene

I would NOt trust dog training information off the internet (ironically, I am GIVING you dog training information on the internet...)

Instead, here are some of the books I use/don't use:

Mother knows best...natural basis for training, using the dog's own reactions and pack relationships to communicate

The Monks of New Skete...kind of wishy-washy for most dogs, so don't use the training advice much. Instead, use their insights into the nature and intelligence of dogs, as it will help you understand her.

Dog training for Dummies is ok too, very common-sense and covers all the bases.

Tricks I Taught my Master is BAD. So is any other book that even MENTIONS the word "Pavlovian." Pavlovian training operates under the assumption that your dog is an unthinking machine that is only capable of learning through terror-induced trial-and-error.

You want to read everything you can get your hands on, though, and form your own opinions based on your dog. My own philosophy is based on the theory that dogs are natural pack animals and that, once you prove yourself as a leader, they will naturally want to follow you and please you. The trick, then, is to learn to speak fluent "dog" so you can communicate your wishes--and, of course, maintain your leadership.

You can, of course, ignore what I said above, but don't ignore this: CHOOSE ONE METHOD AND STICK WITH IT. If you are not consistent, your dog will not learn. Period.

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felton

Thanks Acetylene. A friend gave me some tapes on dog training that uses concept that you are leader and they follow. No terror induced punishment and no treats. This one sounds good. It basically teaches you how to walk on leash, then without leash, then it is ready for tricks etc. I will check into some of the ones you mentinoed as well.

Acetylene

That sounds very good. I especially like the "no treats" part since treat-trained dogs aften don't obey if you don't have a treat and that can be dangerous when crossing traffic etc.

Much luck!

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Journeyman

Wooooahhh. If there's a school of training that's called "Pavlovian," then that's that. But Pavlov's "Classical Conditioning" is simply a model for learning based on associating two events that occur close together in time. So a dog that pees on the floor getting immediately whapped with a newspaper IS Pavlov type teaching, so is a dog peeing in the backyard getting a tastey treat right away. There's certainly the fear-induced side of the coin, but that coin is not without the reward side.

I just... felt like defending Pavlov. I don't know why.

Acetylene

Pavlovian training works the other way around. The conditioning you're talking about teaches a dog about the consequences of its actions and is totally legitimate. Knowing what happens when you do X thing is practically the definition of learning.

What I'm talking about works backwards. To train a dog to sit using this technique, you say "Sit," then yank on the dog's choke chain. Then you say "sit" and yank on the chain. Pretty soon the dog figures out "Sit" means he's about to be choked and will panic every time you say it. Eventually, in the course of his panicking, he will happen to sit, and when he does, you DON'T yank the chain. The dog learns, "In order to avoid getting choked, I have to sit" and is based on the particular experiment where a dog in a harness was hooked up to a machine where he would receive an electric shock every time a bell went off, unless, in the course of thrashing around in terror, he raised his head and touched a metal plate to complete the circuit and prevent the shock. It is the exact opposite of the well-known "food bell" and fans of Pavlov try to pretend it didn't happen.

The problem with this should be obvious, but in case it isn't, I'll explain: Dogs are capable of guided learning and mimicking, and can be shown what to do. This training method neglects that fact and uses pain to force the animal to figure it out on his own. If we are capable of teaching a dog through guidance and rewards, but instead choose to teach using fear and pain, I'd say that makes us cruel, wouldn't you?

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bobw

Need to know approximately how old the dog is...

but, regardless, CONSISTENCY is the key !!!!!!

felton

I believe the dog is 1 to 1.5 years old, per my vet. So far, the training with leash has gone well. Started with walking in 50'x50' area using 15' leash. I walked directly from corner to corner pausing a minute or so at each. Dog has choke collar on. If she does not stay with me she gets a correction but does not associate with me since the leash is so long. She realizes she must catch up. Next step was distractions. Same leash. Walk directly toward distraction, once she starts to go for distraction I simply turn and go the other way. Again, she must come with me or get correction. She still does not associate the correction with me, only that she must catch up. It has worked very well. Next step I move to short leash...we'll see.

bigbad

Not really relevant to your topic, but have you tried putting signs up around where you found it? Because whenever I find a dog wandering all by itself I think of the people who are missing their pet and do as much as I can to find the owner, just as I would hope someone would do if they found my dog if he had ran away and lost his tags.

ARTelevision

Where's Peetster's good sound advice when we need it. He's helped me with our new dog. He should be around soon...

We are finding that positive reinforcement is just about the whole shootin' match. Hundreds of repetitions of "good girl" or "good boy" a day when they do the right thing are better than negative reinforcement when they don't, IMO.

Dogs just want to please us.

And you end up with a good solid friend the whole way along.

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xeem

Just a curious question : what breed is it? or is it a mongrel?