cjgallen

I have a 73 VW Beetle that has some serious cancer. It needs a couple quarter panels and the rear window section removed and replaced.

I know nothing about welding, but I'm a pro at soldering small electronics. Is soldering and welding similar?

I also need a welder. Someone on another forum recommended THIS ONE and has used it on his truck with good results. I dunno, it seems cheap (really cheap), but would this get the job done? Any other recommendations? We have a 230V plug in the garage, would it be worthwhile to get a more expensive welder?

Gas? No Gas? Tig? Mig? Arc? (what is tig/mig?)

limited

I'm no expert at welding, but I do know a tiny bit about it. The general theory behind it is to heat the metal up enough so that it melts into one piece. This is usually accomplished usinng an electic spark to heat the area up. A problem arises with heating metals so fast, because they will rust real fast. So a gas like nitrogen is used to to keep the oxygen away from the welding parts. It kind of envelops the feed wire while youre welding. TIG and MIG welding is titanium inert gas and metal inert gas(usually steel).
I don't have much experience with body work, or any specific type of welders, but I decided to contribute what I know. Hope it helps.

theguyondacouch

The only way to learn to weld is practice practice practice! TIG welding stands for tungsten inert gas welding by the way. If your going to be welding on a car, your best bet is to learn to mig or tig weld. Mig is probably more likely because it is signifigantly cheaper and easier to learn.

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shakran

yeah, titanium welding is somewhat more difficult, as the Russians found out when they tried to make their first titanium MiG

my best advice is to practice on something other than a car. When you can consistantly do a good weld that doesn't wreck the metal on either side of the weld, you can start in on the car.

homerhop

Buy a MIG welder.
It gives you the option of welding Stainless and Aluminium as well. It is a bit more practical than a TIG, just for everyday use.
Now the welder you are looking at has a flux-coated wire. It is not the easiest way to weld and tends to cause a lot of spatter.
Get a welder that uses gas to protect the weld pool instead. They are cheap enough.
If at all possible buy a welder that has a wire feed unit separate from the main welder. You will understand this every time the torch is not able to reach where you want and you have to keep moving the welder around the place, so the separate unit cuts out all that.
Now welding with the MIG is fairly simple.
You should be able to judge by the sound it makes on the wire setting. When welding and the wire sounds more of a buzz with a very bright glow the wire feed is probably to low. It should make more of a crackle noise when welding. If you mess about with the wire settings you will understand what I am trying to explain.
What I usually do is get a scrap piece and turn the wire up high, start welding and keep turning the wire down at the same time until it stops forcing your hand back. If the wire is too high it will not melt and will push the torch back.
If the metal is very thin keep the plant down to a low setting, if you find that it is melting away on you, keep spot welding letting each spot cool before you do the next one, don’t worry if it looks bad, it can always be sanded down. Also if it is a long weld on light materials, do a small bit and let it cool completely, otherwise it will warp with too much heat.
Hope this is some help to ya

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Bill O'Rights

Coming from someone that was in welding supply for 9 years, and was a welder for 3...do yourself a favor. If you plan on doing any amount of serious welding at all, stay away from the "Harbor Freight", "Tractor Supply" or the "Country General" cheap piece of crap machines. Not to mention, they do not stock consumable parts for the machines they sell, and neither is anyone else, for that matter. Pick either a Miller, Lincoln or a Hobart brand. Either one is very good, and I've sold hundreds. My personal preference is Hobart, but that's just me. I grew up with Hobart machines. Make sure you get one with a gas solenoid, regulator and hose. Sheilded gas welding is far preferably for the type of work that you plan on doing than flux core wire. Slag is not your friend. A good machine, one that you are going to be able to find consumable parts (contact tips, gas nozzles, diffusers, etc. all burn up by thier very nature and must be replaced periodically) for will run you around $700.00.

By the way TIG welding is Tungsten Inert Gas welding...not Titanium. Typically used for aluminum welding applications. What you want is MIG. Metal Inert Gas welding. For your car, you will want a 75%Argon 25%CO2 mix, for shielding gas. Straight CO2 is cheaper, and will work, but will spatter more, and not give as nice a finished product.

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BoomTruck

^^^What they said.

A 110 volt Lincoln does quite well for bodywork with .024 wire and Steelmix gas. I have used one of their 220 volt welders and was impressed as well.

If you need a welder to do heavy stuff as well, I recommend a Miller Millermatic 251. You can weld anything from sheet metal to heavy plate with one of those.

Flux Core is ok for some applications (I use it in mine for doing odds and ends away from the shop so I don't have to drag a bottle around), but bodywork is not one of them.

Start practicing on scrap chunks of 1/8" thick until you get a technique figured out. Sheet metal can be a pain in the butt to work with.

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DelayedReaction

Welding is the process of using heat to fuse two materials together. It's different from soldering or brazing in that the two materials involve are physically bonded and alloyed together, forming an extremely strong bond. Welds require clean bonding between two surfaces; oxygen and dirt prevent that from occuring. Some form of flux or inert gas is typically used to keep the oxygen away from the weld, with argon being the most popular form of inert gas.

When you weld, you're basically evacuating an area of oxygen and then heating it to the point where the metals melt together. When you're done the end result should be a clean seam where there once was an edge.

TIG = Tungsten Inert Gas. This is a pretty sweet form of welding that uses a plasma to heat up the metal while the target area is bathed in argon. It allows for some extremely clean welds, and is essential for aluminum welding.

MIG = Metallic Inert Gas. This is the typical welding setup you see on most systems; it's cheap, effective, and easy to learn. A wire electrode creates the heat while being sacrificed.

My advice would be to decide just how much you truly want to do this. A quality welding setup is not going to be cheap, and shitty welds get people killed. Unless you plan on making this more than a one-time thing, I would suggest getting a professional welder to do the job.

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locoloco

While I can't add any specific welding advice, I just wanted to remind you to PROTECT THOSE EYES !!!!!.

Just a friendly reminder

ziadel

from what I understand oxy-acetylene welding was used a LONG time ago to replace panels on cars.... and oxy-acetylene would prolly be the absolute cheapest welding set-up (assuming you rent the cylinders)

the downside is that oxy-acetylene welding heats up what you are welding a lot, so you may end up getting bodywork that warps...


but if you want to learn how to weld, start with oxy-acetylene, learn how to manipulate the puddle (or weld-pool) and then move on to something else...

that is of course if you wanna be a good welder
IMO if you start off with mig you won't be doing yourself any favors in the long run...

merkerguitars

Yeah you could braze the panels together...but using a MIG welder would produce way nicer results...Like BillO'Rights said stay away from el cheapo welders. You definately get what you pay for with a welder. I've used many Hobart wire feed machines and for TIG welding (which i'm learning to do right now) I'm using a huge Millermatic machine. Since your a beginner you might want to pick up a bunch of scrap sheet metal and practice welding them together. Also when you order replacement panels make sure you know how they overlap and what to cut out. Your welding might not be the greatest for visible body work but if you can do a decent job you'll do just fine welding floorboards in. Welding is all practice...the more you do it...the better you get...

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ziadel

For the record I would advise against brazing the panels together....

Brazing doesnt fuse metal together the same way that welding does, basically with brazing your dripping molten metal onto red hot base metal and capillary action makes it stick, theres more to it but I am being brief. Basically if you grind down the braze the way you would a weld it won't hold together anymore.... the plus is it doesnt put as much heat into the base metal so there is much less a chance of warping...


If you have the equipment to braze then you have it to oxy-acetylene weld, I'd go with the weld





p.s. flux coated rod causes metal fume fever due to the zinc in the flux.... if you do braze do so only in a very well ventilated area while wearing a respirator...

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Deckard

This thread has been particularly useful to me as I'm learning to weld as well (for both marine and automotive stuff). I've employed a marine engineer to engineer an aluminium boat I've drawn up a concept design for and it sounds like I'll have to get someone else to do the hard welding work (which is annoying because it'll put the cost of my project through the roof).

I have to ask, however, (if there are any Aussies about) are the brands listed above availiable in australia. I'm looking for a welder that prefferably does NOT use phase 3 power. Fair enough I should be looking at TIG welding which should make this irrelevant, but I need to start somewhere.

homerhop

Deckard
If you are doing alot welding and dont want to use 3phase it might be worth your while in investing in an inverter welder.
These are a light portable power unit that will let you weld with either rod or tig.Well worth investing in.

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cuervo

As for learning to weld, look at your local technical college.

ziadel

whoa whoa whoa, we're tig'in aluminum now?


thats a whole new ball of wax, formal instruction would be very helpful indeed.


heres a little info on it...


http://www.lincolnelectric.com/knowl...nt/tigalum.asp



heres something on mig welding aluminum (I would'nt recommend it, but its good to know how )
http://www.lincolnelectric.com/knowl...compactmig.asp

another on migging aluminum:
http://www.millerwelds.com/education...articles10.php


heres a little thing on choosing a tig welder:
http://www.millerwelds.com/education...articles13.php


this covers what amperages you will need depending on the thickness of what you are welding:
http://www.millerwelds.com/education...articles43.php



above all, when you do pick out a welding machine, make sure its blue (Miller welding machines are all blue) they make the best stuff....


and always remember grasshopper, you are one with the puddle.

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DelayedReaction

Proper brazing is actually stronger than most forms of welding. If I recall correctly, the bond strength is something on the order of 90ksi or so.

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