Peetster

I see nothing like this anywhere else, so I guess I'll put it here.

First a disclaimer. If you lose your shirt, it's not my fault. If you win a ton of money, it's also not my fault and I won't ask for any of it. So feel free to post your success/failure stories.

I'm lucky with dice. Let's start there. I can roll them at least 8 to 10 times without making point or crapping out. This strategy works for me. Frankly, in the long run, it doesn't matter whether I make point or crap out, I win more by making point, but still win when I crap out.

There are a lot of variations and odd bets, I'm going to cover the most basic strategy that works best for me.

Just before a new roll, called a "Come out roll", you can place money on the "Come Bar" or the "Don't Come Bar". The former means you think the shooter will win, the latter you think he will lose. I like to root for the shooter, so I *always* play "Come". Insert witty reference to a preference for Coming here.

If the shooter rolls a 7 or 11, you win. Roll over. If he rolls a 2, 3 or 12, you lose. Roll over.

More often, the shooter rolls a number that is not any of the above. That number becomes the "point". The goal is to roll that same number again before rolling a 7 or an 11.

So, we have a point, time to make better bets. You can put money on as many numbers as you want, and as long as the shooter doesn't roll craps, every time he rolls your number, you get paid what you bet. I like to pick two numbers, and I focus on the 6 and the 8. If one of those numbers is point, you can't bet it, so I'll move out to the 5 or the 9.

You can also put "odds" on your come bet, meaning you basically double your bet on the come line. Why? Because the odds bet pays better than 1:1. If you have a $5 come bet, and a $5 odds on the come bet, and you win, the first bet earns you $5, but the odds bet earns you $7.

The shooter rolls, and doesn't make point or crap out. Here's where it gets statistically interesting. You can lay odds on your number bets as well, and it's a ratio the stickman or pitboss will always help you with. The payback on the number odds is even better, and is recognized as the only truely 50/50 bet in a casino.

Now, the shooter rools a bunch of times, and doesn't make point or crap out. But every time they roll your number you get paid. The longer they roll, the more you get paid.

I think my record is 36 rolls.

Two more fun things if you are rolling well.

Yo: Before your come out roll, throw a dollar at the stickman and yell "Dollar Yo!" You are betting that on this roll, you will roll exactly an 11. It pays 14:1, but the true odds are 17:1, so it's only a good bet if you are really rolling well. I've won a dollar yo and let it ride, then won, turning $1 into $196 on two rolls.

Hardway: If the point is an even number, you can bet that it will be two of the same number. A hard six is two threes, a hard four is two twos. I usually throw a dollar on the hard way if the point is even, cause if you throw a 1-3 instead of a 2-2, you've won a ton of money and lost a dollar.

Finally, know when to walk away from the table. I've seen some very hot tables get very cold very fast. Scoop up your chips and walk away. Have a drink. Eat a meal. Recharge. Just don't keep throwing your money at them.

Ace_O_Spades

the most IMPORTANT thing to remember is that the odds of rolling any given number are EQUAL on any given throw

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Feh.

yatzr

I thought with 2 dice, the odds weren't equal. 2 and 12 only have one possibility each while 7 has six possibilities. Maybe I'm just missing the point of your comment.

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BigGov

He's saying you're as likely to get a 7 on one roll as you are the next. The number of 7's before or after doesn't matter.

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One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!"

Kadath

Part of me scoffs at the idea of being good at dice, but I've got a buddy who I would swear is able to roll a 6 on a die at will, so...
The image of a hurling a crumpled up dollar bill at a croupier screaming "DOLLAR YO!" was most amusing, though I know that's not what Peetster meant.

The only game I'll play in a club is blackjack -- it's the only game you can beat.

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it's quiet in here

choskins

I usually play Come Bets up to 3 numbers.
Sometimes, I will pull my bets after 5 or 6 rolls.
Sometimes, I play the Come line, play odds, and buy two numbers.

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"Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."
- Sigmund Freud

choskins

It just depends on how the table is playing.

I am heading back to Vegas at the end of August, so I will give an update on the winning.

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"Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."
- Sigmund Freud

BigGov

You can beat poker too.

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One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!"

CoachAlan

Even without using advanced mathematics, it's obvious that no betting system will win out in the long run. The reason is simple: no single bet on a craps table pays in favor of the player.

Your best bet is the odds on pass/don't (which pay true odds, no vig), but even those come with the stipulation that you have to have a front line bet. Even if you bet 10x odds, the house take is still 0.184%.

The other bets you mention have even worse house takes. Yo, for example, has a house take of 11.11%. There's no way you can win over the long term making bets in which the house has the advantage (which is every single bet on a craps table).

By the way, I got most of my information from http://wizardofodds.com/games/

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Kadath

In poker you are playing other players, in blackjack you are only playing the house. Further, you can beat blackjack with pure math. But I do grant that poker is more than luck as well.

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it's quiet in here

choskins

Baccarat has the best odds overall. But they make it so unapproachable, no one wants to play it.

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"Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."
- Sigmund Freud

omid

Hold 'em poker. Most fun casino game ever.

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Kick butt buzz-cut dickheads who didn't like what I said.
The good times are killing me.
Jaws clenching tight we talked all night, oh but what the hell did we say?
The good times are killing me.

mirevolver

The fisrt thing you should know about approaching craps is the probability of each outcome of the dice. There's a simple table for that.



Now looking at the come out roll, if you bet "Pass line," your odds of winning on the come out roll (7 or 11) are 8/36 (8 winning outcomes out of 36 possible outcomes). And your chances to lose on the come out roll (2, 3 or 12) are 4/36 (4 losing outcomes out of 36 possible). And your chances of establishing a point are 24/36.

If you choose to bet on the "Don't Pass," your odds of winning on the come out roll (2 or 3) are 3/36. Your odds of losing on the come out roll (7 or 11) are 8/36. You also have a 1/36 chance of pushing (12) on the come out roll (12 is the house's number, that's how they skew the odds in their favor). And that leaves a 24/36 of establishing a point.

Once a point is established (4,5,6,8,9,10), you need to hit that point without rolling a 7 if you bet "Pass Line." This puts the odds in favor with the house as the likelyhood of rolling a 7 is 6/36 which is greater than the odds of any other outcome on the dice.

However if you are betting "Don't Pass." Then the odds are in your favor with the point because you are betting on a 7 being rolled before the point is rolled again.

My advice is, bet "Don't pass" and hope for a point to be established (odds are in favor of that during the come out roll). And don't cheer too loudly because the other people at the table tend to get irritated when the "Don't pass" better is cheering.

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Pokerprincess

Thats BS.......you are playing with the other players against the house..........just one bad player will screw the whole table.

And thats from experience as a player and as a blackjack dealer.
If you believe any system will make you money overall, you're dreaming or have your head up your ass

mirevolver

Yeah like that guy on the end that has 16 and hits with the dealer showing a 6, gets a face card. Then the dealer reveals he has 16, hits and gets a 5.

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Aside from my great plans to become the future dictator of the moon, I have little interest in political discussions.

Pokerprincess

Exactly, and there are more people like that playing than not...........everyone thinks they are psychic when it comes to playing balackjack

corybmcfly

Bad players don't make a difference in the long run. You only remember the times you got screwed when a bad player made a bad move. For every time the idiot on 3rd hits on 16 and takes a bust card giving the dealer a 5, there is the other time the idiot hits on 16 and pulls his own 5 and giving the dealer a bust.

50% of bad moves screw you over. The other 50% save you. I'm not justifying bad play, I'm just saying a bad player wont affect my bank roll over the long run....only his own.

Stompy

While no game at the casino is made for players to win all the time, craps are your best odds.

That's why if you're gonna gamble, just stick w/ the craps. Otherwise, you're just tossing your money on randomness. Especially slots.. I don't know how people can stand to sit there and dump hundreds of dollars into slots. Might as well just burn that money!

Blackjack is good, but different casinos use different amounts of decks and it really screws the game up so you can't make a strategy.

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mirevolver

Yes, Craps has the best odds on the surface provided that you only bet Pass/Don't Pass. But in the long run, the house will come out on top. As a Vegas craps dealer once explained to me, "This is the house's game and just like any other game in the casino, it is made to beat you."

Now, if you can count cards, you can change the blackjack odds to a -1.5% for the house. Which means that in the long run, the house loses. That's why if they think you're counting cards, they'll kick you out.

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Aside from my great plans to become the future dictator of the moon, I have little interest in political discussions.

CoachAlan

Stompy, I play dollar slots because the house edge on those is about 5%. Sometimes less. That's puts the house edge in the realm of the table games, better than roulette, not quite as good as craps.

But in craps, one throw of the dice won't make me Nevada's Newest Millionaire. That's why people play slots. Most sessions will be losing sessions, but the chance for a big win is greater relative to the amount bet.

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"If I cannot smoke cigars in heaven, I shall not go!"
- Mark Twain