barenakedladies

you have to do things in order.

first breaking strain, then heirapparent, then the numbers in joops corner.

wont work unless you do them in that order.

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Frosstbyte

Numbers in joops corner? What?

The hell you talking about? Where did I miss that one?

Charlatan

It definately worksi if you do it all in order. Interesting.

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fresnelly

After you've read the letters, be sure to leave Joop's Corner open. His image is very slowly being overtaken by some sort of abstract drawing. I'm not sure where this is going (if anywhere) but I'm hoping a subliminal message will appear.

As a note to those unwilling to go through the steps listed above, Spoiler: there is no direct spoiler info regarding the show. At least nothing that immediatly applies. On letter questions a Hanso Executive's academic history and true identity, and another implicates the Hanso org in a deadly virus outbreak near their research station in Africa.

Update: In addition to the drawing (scribbly lines) there is a silhouette of what looks like a huge bald man's head now appearing. This may take a couple of hours!

fresnelly

Here's the photo after about 45min. It's Friday. Screw work!

Charlatan

Sweet! Keep us updated.

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fresnelly

Okay, it's been about an hour and it hasn't progressed too much farther.

However, every 10 minutes or so, the image strobes with this:


I think it's the same silhouette, but reversed and upsidedown. Note the "ears"

I'm done work for the day, but I'll leave it running over the weekend.

Charlatan

See you tomorrow.

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inkriminator

i just got caught up with all the ep's.

i think the website stuff is largely mis-direction, i doubt you will be getting much useful information off of it.

did anyone notice that during the movie John and Echo saw in Pearl, it said that the members in the Swan believed their work was of the utmost importance, and them immeditaly stressed teh importance fo the work being done in the Pearl. There were also cameras inside the Pearl, so who is watching the Pearl folks?

what if it all turned out to be a reality show masquerading as a series....

Charlatan

I don't think the website is misinformation at all.

I think it is filling in the back story. It is pretty much irrelevant (i.e. you don't need to know about it to enjoy the show), but it is added enjoyment for those who love the convoluted nature of the show.

PS: I was watching an older episode of Stargate a couple days ago and the Chinese ambassador was played by the actor the stars in the orientation films. It was kind of weird.

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Frosstbyte

I thought I posted exactly what Charlatan did post. Finals have really made my brain dribble out of my ear. I can't wait for my first year of law school to be over. It's going to be so great.

Yeah, the website isn't misinformation, it's just extrinsic to the events actually occurring in the show. If you're interested in the mythology of the show, it's fun stuff to delve into. It's not required and it doesn't have a direct impact, but it puts some things in context.

Charlatan

I am predicting that they eventually kill off all of the characters except Hurley.

The last episode will be him, finally getting skinny, wandering the beaches alone muttering , dude, where's my peanut butter?

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robbdn

I'm doing a research project about immersive entertainment in television and film, to link up with some of the research I've already done with videogames. I don't know if any of you are familiar with The Beast, developed by Dreamworks and Microsoft, but as I was researching the Cloudmakers I discovered the following with an eerie reference to the recent Lost game's clues...

JJ Abrams has organized web games before, for Alias, and I'm wondering if his Lost game isn't designed to hook up in the grander scheme of things. I wonder if perhaps Abrams himself wasn't at one point a Cloudmaker. Anyhoo... just something to run with, if people want to get into solving the mystery of this game. If Abrams is sticking true to the Cloudmaker's mentality, then it means that the group of people on the bleeding edge of the Lost game will actually be able to influence the course of events in the Lost television show.

Afterthought: Do you guys think we should make another thread for the Lost game? It's kind of tangential to the show proper, but it would be fun to play it with other TFPers. There are also plenty of other sites for playing it, but... well, just a thought.

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fresnelly

Update on Joop's Corner: Not much to report...

So I got in this morning and it looked like the picture had reset itself back to normal. However, After a few moments it began shifting again with the same overlayed imagery, just faster now.

What I've described in my earlier posts appears to be as far as it goes: Some dense cobweb-like drawn lines, and the silhouette of a big bald man's head. To say that the images are open to speculation is an understatement.


I think a separate thread for the website(s) sounds like a good idea. I bet that the producers will keep us well occupied over the off season.

In fact I just found out the who the bald man is and I'm going to start the thread with my theory. Seriously!

inkriminator

i didn't say the non-tv things were mis-information, i said misdirection. what i meant was, much as a magician will use misdirection to point the audience's attention away from vital components, these site are doing the same thing. In this case it is satieting the need of hardcore enthusiasts to feel as if they are learning more about the plot and have a greater chance of unravelling the mystery than those who merely watch the tv show. I would be greatly surprised if this were the case, and truly believe that even if you laid the website bare to the bones, you still wouldn't be able to tell me why ...(fill in any plot question here)....

However, I do agree that the website does flesh out teh information more...lets say its the color to teh black and white painting that is the show.

fresnelly

Great episode tonight. Whatever the Others are doing, if Ms. Clue is any indication, they're hard core zealots.

Jove

We finally discover what happened to Michael when he went off in the jungle. So far, his analysis of the camp is correct, but we still do not know about their camp and reasons for taking walt.

Next week is the 2 hour finale and it should be fantastic with guns a blazin', people dying, fighting and one big intense action orgy.

Also, a commerical aired for the hanso foundation again, but this time a new website was displayed. Does anyone have this link because I thought of memorzing it, but it soon faded out of memory.

Moskie

well, Michael's analysis of the camp is probably completely incorrect.

With the discovery of the theatrical glue and costumes, along with Walt's hint that they are "pretending," it seems pretty clear there's more than meets the eye. I'm guessing that the whole camp is essentially a mock-up to make it look like they're defenseless, but in actuality they're a fully equipped... something.

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Fremen

Transformers! I knew it!

I feel so bad for Michael, but damnit, I want him to get coldcocked by the Jesus stick!

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Moskie

so i guess the real question is: is that new boat we saw really a decepticon??

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the_marq

hai dozo

www.letyourcompassguideyou.com

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Charlatan

Wow... great episode.

I agree that they are zealots for whatever they are doing; the websites seem to hint as that much as well.

I also agree that what we've seen at the camp is *not* what they really are... the makeup and Walt's hint are bang on.


Michael is one fucked up dude. I would hope they could bring him around but, he killed Analucia and Libby so I don't think there is any reforming him...

I predict he dies in the season finale. But he will die in a way that sort of redeems him...

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Ample

Completely agree Charlatan, great episode.

I dont think I could kill someone let alone two people, but if someone had one of my daughters I would do some vile things to get them back. When Michael was crying and Ms. Clue said, "just one other thing" and Michael said, "anything, I just want my boy." I could see being father, how I could relate to him.

I have to agree that he probably dies, but I bet Sayid follows them and opens a can of whoop ass.

Jim Kata

So....who here thinks the sailboat is the guy that was in the hatch. I can't remember his name, but the dude that saw jack at the stadium. If I remember correctly...he did mention sailing around the world at one point. Did i imagine that?

What say you TFPers?

Charlatan

I think the sailboat is the coolest twist so far... it was sort of out of left field for me.

It's certainly possible that Desmond is in the sailboat.


Who thinks the sailboat is just another test by the Others?

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ratbastid

(lurkette and I just caught up on the whole show from the pilot on over the last few weeks. We're ready to be weekly suckers just like the rest of the world now.)

Didn't Desmond say his sailboat was wrecked? Maybe he lied, and the button was all that a was keeping him there... But if so, why come back and save the castaways? He needs them to keep pushing the button. And why take a month to come back?

This episode did a lot to explain Michael's motivation over the last couple episodes. Sayid's right: he's compromised, but after #20, I suspected brainwashing. All that happened is garden-variety extortion.

Also, what about this vaccine? Shooting a load of it was the first thing we saw Desmond do in the Season 2 opener. Is it really a vaccine? Is it some sort of Dharma Initiative Mind Control Juice?

Incidentally, I read yesterday that in the coming season they're not going to do reruns and clip shows. Like with 24, every episode will be a new one--and during the winter rerun period, Lost will go off the air.

Charlatan

We also saw them give Claire the vaccine in the episode where she flashes back to when they abducted her. They gave her the vaccine to keep the baby safe. It's one of the reasons she went back to the medical hatch.

If we are to follow the suggestions on the websites, it seems there was an outbreak of some sort.

Personally I think it is either some sort of "mind control" thing or just another test (like the buttons) to keep people doing things so they can be studied while doing them. I doubt it is a vaccine or the survivors would be showing signs by now (I say this because Desmond seems genuinely surprised that they aren't sick yet).


As for the hiatus vs. reruns... I think we are going to see more of this sort of thing in the future. Either shows will run in the fall and again in the spring with a hiatus rather than a spate of reruns OR they will run in their entirety much in the way that "24" or the reality shows do.


By the way, welcome to the club Ratbastid and Lurkette!

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inkriminator

Am I the only who thought Miss Cleo when I heard Miss Clue?

Michael asked Miss Cleo what he should tell them and Miss Cleo sayd, "Make up a story, it doesn't matter, they'll be so angry they'll believe anything" or something to that effect. It seems as if the other's KNEW that Michael would have to kill and blame it on Henry.

I'd expect Sayid to die int he finale, it just seems like if he was going to be important he would have played a more important role in the development so far.

Finally, does it irk anyone else how secretive everyone is? They do all these crazy things, (new hatch, medical complex, meet the Others) and either don't tell anyone or only a relative few...this is really starting to bother me because if I were on a a deserted island with black ghosts and OTHERS and hatches and buttons i'd sure as hell try and figure out what was going on...great series though.

ratbastid

Yes, that's what Ethan said. That, of course, followed by several weeks of drugged complacency under Ethan's loving care. I'm not convinced there's any infection to be vaccinated against. Although, of course, there is whatever Rousseau's team came down with.

You think that's all the button is? For sure, the orientation tape at the Dharma observation post seemed to imply that. I'll tell you this, though: on this island, I'm tending to trust Echo's dreams more than almost anything else. Echo's dream says the button is Important Work.

Thanks!

ratbastid

Henry's commentary on that from the armory was brilliant. "Boy, you guys really have trust issues..."

Seriously, though, it started innocently enough--Jack kept the existence of the briefcase full of guns a secret because it might get out of hand if people knew about them (he was thinking mainly of Sawyer, I think, but he also didn't much trust Kate at the time). Then Locke kept the hatch a secret, because he didn't know what he was dealing with and wanted to know more before he told anybody. Then they justified keeping secrets because they didn't want to cause a scare or get people's hopes up...

One way or another, there's this "in the loop" thing. It's been referred to a few times. Remember Arszt? The exploding science teacher? He had a great rant about how "there are over 40 of us! How come you eight or twelve are so important?" Hurley bugged Jack about it just recently too--"You know, if you kept me in the loop about this sort of stuff, I could be way more helpful." "There's no loop." "Oh, there's a loop."

opus123

I think the Others are the "good people" on the island and the main characters are bad. That is why they are so secretive. What kind of good person breaks into a bank to steal a small airplane ? What kind of good person kills or maims people for your wife's mafia dad ? What kind of good person lies to an australian outback outfit ?

But hey, no one would watch a tv show about good people.

Jonathan

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ratbastid

Ooh, ooh.... And how do The Others know Sawyer's real name? Only Locke (and presumably Hurley) know that!

Jove

At the end of the last episode, Locke walks the other way while they are having the funeral. I wonder where he is going?

the_marq

Well if we are working under the assumption that the Others had something to do with making Flt 815 crash; then you can assume that they have access to the flight manifest.

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Charlatan

I am working under the assumption that the The Others had everything to do with the flight "crashing" on the island.

As for who is good and who is evil... I still hold that the survivors are good people who have done bad things. Part of what is being sought out by the Others is whether or not they can be redeemed (this is supported by Henry's words to Locke and Analucia just before he escaped that Locke was one of the good ones while Analucia was not).

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robbdn

Well, Michael is definitely one of the bad ones now. And it's not that he was willing to kill to save his child... I see that as a morally justifiable act, given propagation of the species, however... it's the fact that he was willing to play the fool so easily by killing people in the service of the Others, who he has no reason to trust, and betray his friends who he can trust and who want to help him get his son back. That makes him a bad, bad man.

I loved Sayid's line, "his actions are not those of a man who is telling the truth." Is the truth a redeeming factor? Sayid does bad things all the time, but he always does them in the name of Truth... so where does that leave him?

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Frosstbyte

So, uh, anyone been able to do anything interesting/useful with the compass? That thing's got me pretty stumped. Whatever trick it is you're suppoed to find, I'm not finding. Any help ro clues to be had?

Charlatan

I was wondering about the compass we see Michael using... if there is the kind of electromagnetic activity on the island that we think there is (enough to pull Eko's crucifix away from his chest) then how would a compass work? It should be spinning or at best, pointing in the wrong direction.

Interesting take Robbdn... I too noticed that line by Sayeed by thought it was more a reference to his ability to determine truth through torture. A good torturer need to recognize truth vs. lie to be able to do his job well.

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mrklixx

Frossbyte, if you are talking about the http://www.letyourcompassguideyou.com/ compass :

Spoiler: Hover your mouse down and right from the "E", suddenly a bunch of coordinates will be revealed. Click on the 108 and a little window that resembles the hatch console will pop up and ask if you are one of the good ones. Type "y" and you will be taken to a very real looking index page. Most of the directories will get you a "forbidden" message, but there are a couple that are "open", one that leads to the Hanso website, one that leads to a email with a secret message, and another that leads to a bunch of documents about a deal with Chrysler and the Hanso foundation. Frankly at this point I lost (no pun intended) interest, because I have no interest in knocking myself out deciphering clues about a TV show, reminds me too much of homework back in the day. So there may be more buried within that I missed.

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inkriminator

So long as the magnetic fields were consistent, one could still use a compass to guide you, but you would simply have to realize that a North reading on your compass relates to some other direction.

I agree with this, I think it is merely being used to advance the plot and give the survivors a chance against the Others plot.


I don't mean to threadjack, but you really think its morally acceptable to kill someone simply if that means that your genes get passed along? that is very disturbing...

The others do seem pretty benevelong. For example when Michael spit in Zeke's face, event hough Zeke could have beat the livign hell out him, he told michael that he was probably justified but not to do it again, i'm pretty sure the "others" if not all good, are at least well-intentioned.

I don't think however, that this means that teh survivors are bad. Son, for example, didn't do anything wrong (unless she snookered with the Japanese Lex Luthor, but I don't think that happened) or Locke or Kate or Jack or Michael or Hurley, i don't think any of those people, and they are all pretty major characters have done anything that is 100% clearly wrong...there is a gray area with Kate, and the others didn't really do anything wrong at all.

Anyways, I think Michael should have used his position to gain more information when he was at the camp. he should have withheld information and done quid pro quo to get some more info, and then done the same thing in order to get the release of his son. I'm looking forward to next thursday (so i can watch it online) but my bold my prediction is that one of the Others (hopefully Alex, we need an infusion of hotties now that Shannon's gone) defects and joins the survivors. This would allow plot advancement where she can share all the information she knows, but wouldn't give everything away because she's young, and not one of he original others.