brandon11983

Test over Big Poppa Pump did surprise me, although it shouldn't have. Just like the WWE to make Stacy be her own undoing. Orton over HBK is no shocker at all. Just like the Legend Killer to get the big win with the aid of Grampa Flair.

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Well behaved women rarely make history.

trench

Jericho jobbed again, go figure.

holtmate

Well, at least Jericho can now be back in the title hunt against Goldberg...and he wrestled a damn good match, IMO. He even did his old flex pin - I haven't seen him do that in a while.

__________________
"Give her your coat"
"Why me?"
"Because you're perfect."
"You have a point there."

rockzilla

After a long broken-computer related hiatus, I'm back, and I caught Unforgiven last night at a fairly loud movie theatre (my second favorite way to watch a PPV, in a bar is #1), here are a few thoughts :

Rob Conway's head bouncing off the table looked almost as nasty as when it happened to Spike Dudley. I'm guessing now the Dudleyz will go on to feud with Mark Henry and Rodney Mack, which will be just as boring as La Resistance.
I figured Test was going to win, it's the only way to keep this ridiculous, overstretched fued going. My friend and I were laughing at the absurdity of losing a wrestling match being some kind of legally binding contract for Steiner's soul.
I knew Shane was going to lose to Kane, but I knew he was going to do something crazy. His dive off the set sparked a 'Holy Shit' chant in the theatre, as did swinging the camera into Kane's face.
The JR/King vs. Coach/Snow match was made infinitely longer and more painful to watch due to the fact that there was no commentary, so everyone just yelled at the screen or went to the bathroom.
HHH/Goldberg was better than I expected 'cause it was about half as long as I thought it would be.
If I had to pick a match of the night it would be RVD/Jericho/Christian, but even that wasn't very good. Like holtmate said, I hope that since Jericho lost, it means he'll be working with Goldberg, although my guess is that HHH'll take his title back in a couple of months.

Vilkata

WWE would of made a HUGE mistake to not put Orton over in this match. It would of meant that the last couple of months of him gimmick were all for nothing. I think the way they did the finish was good. It let Orton keep his heat because he beat HBK, which elevates his status. HBK didn't come out looking like a loser since he technically beat Orton at one point during the match.

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DownwardSpiral

I think Michaels shouls have won, personally, I just wanna see Orton lose, I hate that moron. But you're right it was a good business move having him win but I can hope, eh?

__________________
"So Keep on Pretending.
Our Heavens Worth the Waiting.
Keep on Pretending.
It's Alright."

-- H.I.M., "Pretending"

Vilkata

I'm sure they will have Michaels get his revenge sooner or later. Probably another match halfway between now and Survivor Series.

Of course, from what I hear HHH is gonna be out for awhile to heal injuries, marry Steph, and take his honeymoon so Orton could very well be pushed as a dominant heel in the next few weeks. I guess we'll just see what happens.

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DownwardSpiral

What is everyones thoughts on SmackDown? I like the idea of 'Taker getting a title shot, and I thought the Tajiri/Mysterio match was great.

__________________
"So Keep on Pretending.
Our Heavens Worth the Waiting.
Keep on Pretending.
It's Alright."

-- H.I.M., "Pretending"

Mr. Spacemonkey

Damn, i missed it the other night. I heard the Tajiri/Mysterio match was pretty kick ass though.

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Vilkata

The Tajiri-Mysterio match was awesome.I was shocked Tajiri won though.

Looks like at the next PPV we are gonna have:

Undertaker Vs Lesnar - confirmed
Vince Vs Steph - confirmed
Angle Vs Cena - not confirmed
Guerrero Vs Big Show - not confirmed

Now while I'm not really to excited about another Lesnar Vs Taker feud(we had this last year at the same exact time) I'm sure they will make it play out to have Lesnar look like even more of a monster. The possible Cena Vs Angle feud looks like it could be great. Two great workers who can put on amazing matches. It'll definitly be great to watch. The Guerrero-Show match could be possibly good. Just depends on how their respective styles blend in the ring.

Now, for the love of god, what did we do to deserve a Vince Vs Steph match? The only thing the WWE could do stupider then this is make it the MAIN EVENT. Let's hope that doesn't happen.

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brandon11983

A very good point. WWE storylines have been severely lacking lately. And this whole Vince vs. Steph thing is not helping.

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Well behaved women rarely make history.

Vilkata

Yes all it does is hold back more talent. In place of the Vince Vs Steph match we could have a Matt Hardy match, a Shannon Moore match, heck any of the talent that deserves a spot on the card. Not this trash. At least Raw has the actually talented McMahon, Shane. He may not be the best wrestler, but he doesn't hog the camera and he can take some sick bumps.

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DownwardSpiral

I hope at No Mercy Tajiri and Mysterio go for match # 3

__________________
"So Keep on Pretending.
Our Heavens Worth the Waiting.
Keep on Pretending.
It's Alright."

-- H.I.M., "Pretending"

JohnnyRock

I think they could have just ended the trouble with the World Wildlife Fund and changed toteh MWF--McMahon Wrestling Federation...Too MANY McMahon's...That is why it's been more than a year since I spent $$ for a PPV!!!!

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DownwardSpiral

I just got done watching RAW and I must say the RVD vs. Christian Ladder match was great! I loved that match personally. The best match i've seen on RAW in ages. I'm also happy that J.R and Lawler are back commentating. Coach and Snow weren't too great if I don't say so myself.

__________________
"So Keep on Pretending.
Our Heavens Worth the Waiting.
Keep on Pretending.
It's Alright."

-- H.I.M., "Pretending"

Prophecy

that ladder match was awesome and it had some sick bumps...
the one where Christian pulled RVD into to the ladder (springboard or monkey flip?) from the mat was the one of the sickest bumps I've seen on a non ppv WWE broadcast, it looked like RVD didn't his hands up in time to block the ladder...

Not to mention when RVD did the Senton over the top rope to hit Christian and the ladder on the outside. I'm surprised RVD is still walking after some the stuff that guy does.

__________________
La Disciplina È La Mia Spada,
La Fede È Il Mio Schermo,
Non salti Ciecamente In Incertezza,
E Potete Raccogliere Le Ricompense.

Vilkata

Just finished watching the ladder match, which unfortunately is all I got to see of Raw . Great match, wished they would of had more time but being a TV broadcast I understand the little amount of time they had. Loved the match though. I was sure they were gonna have Christian go over RVD, but WWE fooled me. Good job


Now, off to go read the Raw results

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Maveric

before the ladder match, did you see the camera crew screw up christian's entrance as he was walking to the ring... he was walking (more like struting) down the hallway and passes a beaten up lita and trish, gives them a big smile and thumbs up and says "LADIES " and struts off... then the camera crew tells him to walk back down the hallway and try it again so he turns around and heads back. it was funny listening to king and jr trying to recover...

ladder match was awesome. as much as i think christian's character is stale and boring he is without a doubt one of the "kings of ladder matches". i liked him best when he was with edge and they were pulling "shinannigans" on the other wrestlers...

RVD needs to take it to the next level... what's holding him back? he needs to either start taking initiative or something else...

i know the wrestlers don't have much say on the storylines but from all the "behind the scenes" stories i have ever seen or heard it was when wrestlers either broke out of character, did something not planned, improvised, etc., etc. that the best most memorable moments in wrestling happened.

IMHO, i seriously think WWE should be more improvised and the wrestlers should have alot more control over their characters/ personas...

did anyone else see Shawn micheals blade himself ?

sometimes i hate being a smark

Ganguro

I havent had cable T.v. in over a year, and this was my first raw since really 2001. It was pretty good. I like Christian and he is a great midcard talent. I say midcard because him and Rob just dont have what it takes to hold the strap convincingly for long. I dont think Goldberg does either, but he's over with fans..and you have to feed his ego or he'll walk. I could have lived w/o the "heel anouncers" and that match, but it was fairly quick and mildly entertainng as well. I think it was interested that the announcers were supposed to be heels, but chastized Steiner for hitting Stacey. Come on guys, which side of the fence are you on?


Anywho.. overall.. it was a good show..

Prophecy

Its all shades of grey my friend its all shades of grey.
And I thought it was Test that hit Stacey...

__________________
La Disciplina È La Mia Spada,
La Fede È Il Mio Schermo,
Non salti Ciecamente In Incertezza,
E Potete Raccogliere Le Ricompense.

JimmyTheHutt

The problem with RVD is he is SUCH a high risk player that I can imagine the management does not want him in a top spot, just to lose him to injury. The only person they ever let get away with suff like that is Mick Foley, and I don't think they want to do it again. RVD is super impressive, but you just know he is going to get hurt pretty bad someday. The WWE is pretty loathe to have that happen if he is say...the WWE champ.

Veritas en Lux!
Jimmy The Hutt

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"This isn't a nightmare, its real. Nightmare's end."
-ShadowDancer

Prophecy

Good point, When RVD did that Five Star off of the ladder to the ladder below (when Christian moved out of the way) it looked like it hurt like a hell of a lot...

__________________
La Disciplina È La Mia Spada,
La Fede È Il Mio Schermo,
Non salti Ciecamente In Incertezza,
E Potete Raccogliere Le Ricompense.

meanSpleen

A few quick notes:

1) The Christian/RVD match was the match of the month. Terrific spots, some actual pain, and a hella good match. Sad that Christian isn't INTERcontinental CHAMP. I'm one of his peeps. T_T sniff sniff

2) I guessed in my Unforgiven guessing that the duo of Snow and Coach would last 2 weeks on RAW. I was right. Now pay up.

3) Dear god... Steiners evil... Oh wait, he still sucks. Lets put him in a Championship match with Goldberg. That would surely bring up the ratings. :P

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JohnnyRock

Gotta agree with the props for the ladder match...some great spots!!! the women's stuff is being handled really well [and they are putting on some of the top matches and promos, too].

I'm already sick of the King and his Puppies again!!

Mark Henry and Goldber...zzzzzzzz

Jericho is RAW!!! He and Austin are consistantly the most entertaining every week.

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BigGov

RVD has already taken it above, and beyond almost anything you can think of, any major move you can think that has happened in the WWE, RVD has probably done in the past, and most of them onto concrete, stretchers, or other extremely unforgiving surfaces. The WWE is the only thing holding him back. Remember Juvi in WCW? He had a tryout for the WWE. The WWE tells him, "Slow down your wrestling and only do one or two highspots, because our fans can't catch up and don't like too many high spots." Juvi said screw them, and pulled out everything he had, high spots, luche libre, everything. Never offered a contract afterwards because he went against the WWE management. I strongly doubt he will ever get a contract in the WWE because of that instance. You know Tommy Dreamer right? Dreamer has pulled at least as many high spots as RVD. Ever seen him do anything big in the WWE?

For a WWE fan, maybe. If you watched ECW, you remembered the matches, not the improv political bullshit around it. I remember the first Van Terminator, I remember Rhino and the Sandman going at it, I remember RVD and Sabu, and RVD against Sabu. THAT was entertainment.

What? Are you insane? Vince give up creative power, and put it squarely out of his control? I can list a whole bunch of jack-ass sayings like "Satan will build a snowman before that happens" but I'll just answer you straight. That will never, EVER, happen with Vince alive and in charge. And that is without even bringing up all the logistical problems. Why would someone go for the European title if they can go on their own for the world title?

It was more fun watching Steve Corino. It became more of a joke than anything. "He cut himself open already? It's not even 3 minutes into the match!"

Daval

I've kinda lost touch with this thread and not followed it for a while.

I watch Raw for the most part, Smackdown just isnt convenient for me so more often than not I either miss is completely or see only bits and pieces

When did Bradshaw get the style change, I didnt recognize him at all! I quite like the new look, makes him look much younger and much bigger in my opinion.

__________________
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Winston Churchill

JohnnyRock

Bradshaw came back with the now look a few weeks, or maybe a month ago...

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Not only do I not know the answer...I don't even know what the question is!!!

meanSpleen

What Johnny said.

He was on the injured list, so he took some time off to write another book. He also got a haircut and started to work out. You notice that his man boobs aren't as floppy anymore?

I'm just waiting for the APA to have a GOOD fued with a team. Not La Ouisistance or the Dudleyz. Its been played to death with those teams. I wouldn't mind seeing the APA not backing the Mack. Get Teddy Long mixed up in there somehow...

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JohnnyRock

that would work...love the APA but no gimmick can work forever without a GOOD fued...

__________________
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DownwardSpiral

Well Spleen, you'd have to move Mack and Henry to Smackdown or APA to RAW for thoise tow teams to feud.

__________________
"So Keep on Pretending.
Our Heavens Worth the Waiting.
Keep on Pretending.
It's Alright."

-- H.I.M., "Pretending"

meanSpleen

Or we can have a new show!

We'll take all the talent from Velocity and Heat, and scramble them together in a hybrid show! We can have the best of all the great unused talent, and all the guys who just aren't that good! Then, we can have new titles, new outfits, and new announcers... *sigh*

Yeah, well, about the brand differences. Umm.. Move. Yeah. APA belong on RAW anyway.

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trench

Not that anyone asked but here's my thoughts for the lacking RAW tag division. Pair Tommy Dreamer with Kanyon. One is teh Innovator of Violence the other is the Innovator of Offense. Make them an extremely heel tag team. I mean Kevin Sullivan 80's Florida NWA heel. (Boy is that an obscure reference) And then maybe people will care about the RAW tag titles again.

Prophecy

Is Kanyon and Dreamer still under contract with the WWE anyway?

__________________
La Disciplina È La Mia Spada,
La Fede È Il Mio Schermo,
Non salti Ciecamente In Incertezza,
E Potete Raccogliere Le Ricompense.

jhericurl21

Steiner reminds me of Cotton from King of the Hill,maybe its the way he talks....... or the way his head looks

meanSpleen

Kanyon is still with WWE. They are working on a "new" character for him. In reality, its just his old one that they are reviving. Look for him sometime between now and next year (yeah, thats real obvious) to hopefully make an impact on RAW or Smackdown. Hopefully RAW.

Tommy Dreamer is also with the WWE still. He has a severely sucky role with the company, as they don't see anything in him. I think he will be teaming with Stevie Richards (another great talent with no future in the WWE), to work Tag Matches.

=====

EDIT:

So I'm watching RAW right now, staring at Lita, when it hits me. Or it hit Kane. I don't know. But was it just me, or was the crowd chanting "Bullshit" after the crash?

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Prophecy

I didn't hear the crowd, but the wreck looked serious, of course I tuned in late and didn't see the actual head on crash, just the aftermath.

And after the end of RAW does anyone foresee Shawn Michaels having a bigger part to play in the Bounty on Goldberg's Head plot?

It’s kind of sad but I had more fun watching the Y2J & Christian vs. RVD & Lance Storm match than any other of the show tonight, even the Goldberg match wasn't that grand, it was nice to see Mark Henry knock Goldberg around a bit though.

And is it just me or does Maven seem un-natural in his in ring character? The "Yea!! Get up!!" after every dropkick seems a bit much.

__________________
La Disciplina È La Mia Spada,
La Fede È Il Mio Schermo,
Non salti Ciecamente In Incertezza,
E Potete Raccogliere Le Ricompense.

meanSpleen

I decided not to watch the end of RAW, simply because Goldberg sucks, Mark Henry is extremely boring, and I knew that Shawn Michaels would get involved somehow. I'll probably find a re-cap tomorrow on one of the sites I read, so I can figure it from there.

On the topic of Maven: He's gotten better. I think he's up to 7 different moves now. Almost as much as Mark Jindrak has. (4 variations of a drop kick, and 4 variations of a "pick them up over your head and drop them" kinda move. )

The main problem with Maven, besides his lack of moves, is that he has no character. Basically, its the same guy we saw on Tough Enough. Look at Nidia, look at Jackie, look at Nowinski, look at Shaniqua (linda). They all have characters. While SHaniqua's is... bad, she does her best with it, and it is turning out pretty good. Why the hell she isn't on RAW going for the title is beyond me.

Maven, on the other hand, just has no where to grow. In the past (2-3 years) he hasn't DONE anything. He's fought his share of matches, televised and untelevised, but please... we need some work. It's nice that they are bunching him with the "young guns" (Jindrak and Lance Cade). Thats a start.

note: yes. I said Lance Cade.

And lets just say that teaming with Trish Stratus isn't exactly the best way to get up in the world. Everyone is going to cheer for her, and she'll be the dominant member in the team. Even if it is mixed.

Spleens tips for Maven's character:
1) Get one.

Thats it.

(LANCE FREAKING CADE DAMMIT)

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Vilkata

All I gotta say about Raw is:


FINALLY! LANCE STORM HAS WON A MATCH AGAINST HIGH RANKED TALENT!!!


*tears*

I'm so happy

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Blu2e354

I watched heat a while back and their was some chinese guy named johnny chang(or something) he was a badass did anybody else see him

Maveric

Maven, Jindrak, and Lance Cade. Where's Vince Russo and his New Blood Angle when you need him?