longbough

I know I'm going to get a lot of folks who disagree. I expect a lot of hateful and passionate criticisms of my review but I stand my ground.

My review is late because I had to wait for it on DVD. Up until recently I deliberately avoided reviews and previews (as I do with all films I anticipate).

I expected so much from the film which is why I'm so disappointed.

First of all, I'm a fan of the superhero genre of films since I grew up reading them. Recently it seems there's been a renaissance of films where they're getting done right. For instance, Batman Begins was the film I had hoped Batman would have been ... among my friends and fans I was one of the minority of folks who hated the first Tim Burton Batman film. Since Batman Begins was released I now tell those same people ... "See? See? THIS is what I was expecting back then! And THIS is why the first film sucked!"

In contrast, the first two Superman films were really, really GOOD. So how could they possibly muck it up? Well, here's my two cents.

First of all here's what Superman Returns did right.
1.) The opening titles exploding on screen with the original musical score. What a brilliant choice!
2.) Kevin Spacey - damn he's good. I just wish they gave him more to do.
3.) Excellent action sequences - especially the rescue of the space shuttle.

... that's it ...

Now the bad.
1.) With the exception of Kevin Spacey - every part was miscast. Superman, unlike some of the Marvel characters (e.g. Spiderman, Blade, Daredevil ... ), is an epic character in an epic story. The acting has to be bigger than life - Christopher Reeve understood that. Margot Kidder (Lois Lane) knew that. Jackie Cooper (Perry White) knew that.

Brandon Routh must've been cast for his looks only ... (and he looks a lot like Chris Reeve - but in a much, much better way) Don't get me wrong - he LOOKS absolutely perfect for the role ... I couldn't imagine they'd find someone who fit the role so well.

But the poor fella can't act worth a hill of beans. It's like he has no idea who he is and is just following rote stage directions. It's Routh's poor performance that makes me realize how much character Chris Reeve brought to the role in the 1978 Superman. Routh just can't bring grandeur to Superman. As an actor he's just not mature ... and it shows.

Kate Bosworth as Lois Lane. I really like this actress ... but what the heck did she do to Lois Lane? Margot Kidder had spirit, independence and a comic sense. Furthermore she knew the film's grand scale required overstatement in her role. Bosworth is basically ... a damsel in distress. She has plenty of opportunity to break through, even with simple gestures, but she blows every opportunity to play the role as if she were a secondary character in some random formula disaster film - i.e. she has absolutely no personality.

Parker Posey, the wry indie actress ... why oh why did they cast her in a dumb-floozie role??? It pains me to see her this way. Even in Blade Trinity she made her vampire character into an unapologetic bitchy trailer-trash villain ... and fun to watch. In this film she has nothing to say, do or contribute. I'll bet the paycheck was pretty large....

Kevin Spacey (Lex Luthor) - great in every scene he's in. Casting him was spot-on. The only problem is the script. At least give him the freedom to improvise. Translated from the script he comes across as a watered-down impersonation of Gene Hackman (Lex Luthor in 1978). Even a lot of the jokes are rehashed from the 1978 film (yeah ... they're supposed to reference the earlier film but this script doesn't do much more than that) Spacey should have been able to give Hackman's Luthor a run for his money ... maybe they probably didn't have much of a preproduction in the acting department.

Frank Langella (Perry White) - also just going through the motions. Jackie Cooper brought more to the role. Just look at the two roles side by side and you'll see.

2.) The story. The surface plot (i.e. villain has plot to run the world) is nothing we haven't seen before. Even the methods aren't that great. The action is special-effects and CG with the requisite scale. Please, please, please show us something we've never seen before. I can't easily communicate my expectation ... only that this film had no surprises at all in the basic plot.

3.) The love story. OK we all knew the kid was HIS from the start, right? ... right?
OK, so let me get this straight. Superman disappears unexpectedly for a length of time and returns to find Lois Lane with a fiancee and kid. Superman is emotionally stunned about this and we're all supposed to feel sorry for him? Come on! This guy comes and goes as he pleases leaving the woman raising his kid for him without assistance, advice or consideration ... that makes him an irresponsible asshole. My GOD she's the mother to his kid and he still can't tell her who he is. The final insult is that Lois Lane is OK with that! It doesn't matter if you're saving the world ... at least tell her SOMETHING like, oh, "Lois, I know it isn't easy being with me ... duty calls ... but know that I love you ..."

Call me old fashioned, but a REAL man supports his child and it's mom. I don't care how powerful he is - on that count alone, Superman ain't no real man. This movie turns him into a garden-variety pig.

I can go on and on about smaller issues - like Luthor's distracting Superman by setting up a car with failing brakes running rampant in the city ... I mean, out of all the wars, murders, hurricanes, gangland crimes etc in the world he calculates that Superman's would choose to stop one runaway vehicle.

... but I'll just leave you with these main points.

Q: How can you miss when you combine a superhero icon and one of the better superhero film directors (Bryan Singer who did the first two X-Men films)?
A: Superman Returns



--------- OK. Go ahead and lay into me 'cause I know a lot of folks will disagree ---------

__________________
"I do believe that, where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence. Thus when my eldest son asked me what he should have done, had he been present when I was almost fatally assaulted in 1908, whether he should have run away and seen me killed or whether he should have used his physical force which he could and wanted to use, and defended me, I told him that it was his duty to defend me even by using violence." - Mahatma Ghandi

Lasereth

Actually, I agree with you 100%. I hated this movie and almost walked out of it about 75% through but I didn't want to be rude. After watching movies like Batman Begins and Spiderman 2 and Hellboy, you have PROOF that comic book/superhero movies can be done the right way, and Superman Returns is the perfect example of how to do it the wrong way. Sure, the movie excelled as a moving comic book, but as a movie, it failed miserably. And yes, we're in the minority here, because everyone else seemed to like it. I just don't see how anyone can say this movie is good after Batman Begins or Spiderman 2. The movies are so astronomically different in terms of quality, production, acting, script, and emotion that saying Superman Returns is anything above "average" is pretty much going too far.

*EDIT*

PS: I don't know what happened to Singer. All I know is him not doing X-Men 3 ruined that movie, and now him doing Superman Returns has pretty much ruined any respect I had for him as a moviemaker, even after the incredibly awesome X-Men 2.

*EDIT EDIT**

Hey, it was better than Fantastic Four at least. Ha ha.

__________________
"A Darwinian attacks his theory, seeking to find flaws. An ID believer defends his theory, seeking to conceal flaws." -Roger Ebert

longbough

You give me hope that I'm not just going insane.

Amen about X-Men 3.
When I heard Singer wasn't involved with it I cringed. When I saw X-Men 3 it was every bit as miserable as I had feared. It was a waste of talent and money... Yet, I do know a lot of folks who actually liked it.

And FF was FOS.

__________________
"I do believe that, where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence. Thus when my eldest son asked me what he should have done, had he been present when I was almost fatally assaulted in 1908, whether he should have run away and seen me killed or whether he should have used his physical force which he could and wanted to use, and defended me, I told him that it was his duty to defend me even by using violence." - Mahatma Ghandi

Daval

I just saw the movie last night as well and found myself getting a bit bored. It was ok, and the airplane / space shuttle scene really had me excited as I thought this was setting the tone for the rest of the movie, but it all just kinda went downhill there for me.

It was ok, but I'm glad I waited for it to come out on DVD. I'm not eagerly awaiting a sequel either. If its gonna be anything like this, I'll wait for the DVD.

__________________
"It is impossible to obtain a conviction for sodomy from an English jury. Half of them don't believe that it can physically be done, and the other half are doing it."
Winston Churchill

Redjake

This movie sucked donkey dick.

I'm very, very surprised at how many people liked this movie. Perhaps a blindfold has been put over many of the members' eyes - a blindfold of feeling 'obligated' to enjoy the movie. this movie just didn't work.

ok first. no character development. AT ALL. NONE. you don't even fucking know the characters at the end of the movie. I kept thinking that Lois was Jean Grey because of Cyclops. I didn't even know Superman by the end. He was still a stranger. I didn't care when he almost died. at all.


the pacing. this movie seemed like it was Lord of the Rings 4! It seemed like 3 hours long. I was WAITING for it to be over.

the movie never did anything to capture my interest. they just jumped right in and superman didn't do anything out of the ordinary. boring. lex luthor with another generic "wouldn't actually work in real life" plot. seriously, does he think the governments of the world would just step aside and let him sell his new land that crystalized out of nothing? oh sure lex, here's 8 trillion dollars. no. he's more intelligent than that.

the generic "come in contact with kryptonite, get beat up, overcome your obstacle, save the day" plot. ugh.


the screenplay. the dialogue didn't work at certain parts and the movie seemed to jump around unnecessarily.

the score. I like the superman score but get something new. and don't use fucking marlon brando clips. it made it seem like a remake even though it wasn't. see batman begins for more information. no danny elfman = good.

most of the shit in the movie was just there to show graphix. big daily planet ball falling = graphics. minigun = graphics. shooting his eye = graphics. leaping through cornfields = graphics. why have flashbacks if you aren't going to explain his youth? because it was in the first movie? then why did you show it at all? because you got the graphics. oh gosh the graphix are so good.


the acting was pretty decent. spacy as lex luthor worked but his character was useless.


I was waiting for a good 45 minutes for something cool to happen in the movie and nothing ever happened. the plane scene was pretty cool, but no emotion was conveyed. I just don't see how Singer could go from one of the best comic movies ever made (X2) to this shit. I think back to Nightcrawler teleporting through the White House, Jean Grey saving the whole Xmen from the dam, and Wolverine pwning Striker and all that and I just think of emotion and a great movie. This movie sucked. Big disappointment. And what was the point of the kid??? Nothing!!!! At least go indepth! Don't just talk about him for 3 minutes and then BAM the movie is over!

this movie was just boring. I wanted it to be over within the first 20 minutes. it's fucking SUPERMAN. how can you make superman boring? see this movie. the only scene that captured my interest was the plane scene, like I said. landing in the ball field was reminiscent of the comics.

the actors don't even seem like they are having a good time. neither does Singer. I wonder if anyone actually wanted to make the movie. the action scenes seem forced, as if they had to be put in to make audiences happy.



my main complaint is that the movie was just BORING. that wonderful feeling you get when you watch great superhero flicks wasn't there.

__________________
Off the record, on the q.t., and very hush-hush.

Lady Sage

From what little tidbits of the film I have seen in department stores, I was disappointed.

IMHO, Christopher Reeves is the one the only superman. No one will ever convince me of anything different. What a waste of a movie! I never intend to see the remake.

__________________
If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Minds are like parachutes, they function best when open.
It`s Easier to Change a Condom Than a Diaper
Yes, the rumors are true... I actually AM a Witch.

guthmund

I couldn't possibly agree more.

If you care to read further, here's my opinion:

The bad:
The kid storyline was stupid and predictable. My 10-year old nephew, who is incredibly bright, just not all that observant, leaned over to me in the theater as soon as the kid appeared in frame and said, "You know, that's Superman's kid."

And finally, Spacey was great, but the big, bad threat to the world was kind of stupid. Not that it wasn't unique...just stupid.

The mediocre:
I think Singer felt obligated to touch on the backstory a bit since, after all, it's the ol' farm in Smallville that he comes back to. I totally disagree with that notion--I think he should have just avoided it altogether and assumed the audience already knew--, but I can understand why he did it.

The plane saving/bullet incident/big ass planet thing falling could have been handled waaaay better. Remember Spider-Man? Hero comes on the scene does a whole bunch of shit in between shots of related newspaper headlines?
A bit campy, but done very well. What was needed was a montage of Superman getting back into the rhythm of things...well, a better montage of Superman getting back into the rhythm of things.

The good:
Spacey. That is all. Nothing more needs to be said. Even the ridiculous scene with the trains was absolutely brilliant and so very Luthor...well, Hackman's Luthor anyway.

Routh was pretty good too, but his Superman needed to be larger than life not awkward and uncomfortable. Superman is Superman. There should be no uncertainty, no awkwardness, no bumbling. He should be confidence personified. Clark Kent should be clumsy because Superman is a stranger in a strange land when he delves into the human world. He's trying to pass himself off as human; he should be awkward and hesitant. It's what made Reeve a good Superman. It wasn't his acting; it was his larger than life portrayal of the Superman side of things. He stood up straighter, he held his head high, he talked loud and with surety (is that even a word?) of purpose. He was wearing a tight, bright-blue body suit and a cape, for chrissakes, he should have been laughed off the screen, but he wasn't.

To end this painfully long post, I would like to say that I take solace in the fact that Singer has stated that he's learned from this experience and that the sequel is going to be much better. I thought the original X-Men was mediocre as well, but I liked X2 a lot. I hope the same can be said for the Superman movies.

__________________
No signature. None. Seriously.

Moskie

I was admittedly very forgiving to this movie. I pretty much agree with every criticism pointed out here... yet I found myself enjoying it more than you guys did.

I think one thing I kept in mind was how possible it was for this movie to be even worse. Nick Cage and McG anyone? I was ecstatic this movie was at least competent, and that it might lead to a great franchise.

As for Routh: am I the only one that thought his Clark Kent as perfect? I felt he evoked Reeve in that role. I thought his Superman left something to be desired, but not his Kent.

Kate Bosworth was definitely miscast. She played Lois as a victim. And if there's anything that Lois Lane is NOT, it's a victim. (I wonder if Parker Posey would have been better in this role... hm..)

And I guess I was an idiot, but I didn't see the kid being Superman's. They had me fooled.

The special effects were the best aspect of the film. I was amazed how much we, as an audience, didn't have to work to suspend our disbelief. We honestly thought we were watching a man fly through the air and catch an airplane. I was left with the impression that the tagline "You'll believe a man can fly" belonged on this movie, and not the original.

i agree. good point.

__________________
Greetings and salutations.

longbough

Some of the film's proponents mention the allusions made relating Superman to a "Christ" figure...

... there's nothing clever or original about that idea ... they forget that it was also done in the 1978 film ... but with more subtlety.

__________________
"I do believe that, where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence. Thus when my eldest son asked me what he should have done, had he been present when I was almost fatally assaulted in 1908, whether he should have run away and seen me killed or whether he should have used his physical force which he could and wanted to use, and defended me, I told him that it was his duty to defend me even by using violence." - Mahatma Ghandi

Willravel

I came in to the movie theater very skeptical. I am a huge fan of the first two Doner Superman movies, and I hated the X-Men movies. I watched it a few times to make sure I got the whole scope and every detail.

I loved it. It was perfectly in the spirit of the first few Superman films (the best) in almost every way.

The directing was strikingly similar to the first films, in some parts I could have sworn I was watching the original with a Lucas-esque CGI update. The perspectives on each scene were handled very, very well...something that was missing almost completely from X-Men, and that was only rare in X-Men 2. The only real complaints I had about the directing would be Clark walking around his house in the beginning. Somehow it seemed somewhat articifial and forced, as if it wasn't given the same amount of focus and concentration that the rest of the movie enjoyed.

The score was surprising. When I heard that John Williams would not be approached to do the music (because of the monster budget being stretched too thin), I was a little more than worried. What is Superman without John Williams sweeping Superman themes? Well, it actually had them. John Ottoman managed to do a really good job arranging the various themes from previous films, along with a few of his own tunes. He made a few small changes that I wouldn't have made (he changed the opening theme...why?), but it was really, really good. Ottoman is up there with Zimmer and Horner in my mind now.

Acting seems to be everyone's gripe, so I'll go down the line. Spacey as Lex: fan-f**king-tastic. He is obviously one of the best actors of our time and was more than a match for obvious comparisons for Gene Hackman's Luthor. "WRONG!" is a classic line that will go down for decades. Routh as Superman: how would you feel if you had just come back to a world, and more importantly the woman you love, to find that they resent you? Even the most brazen, brave, superhero type would be daunted by that. I think that Routh played the hurt in Superman better than Reeve did back when Lois died back in Superman: the Movie. When Routh was watching Lois and Cyclops talking in the house about him, he wasn't just being an odd peeping tom, he was very vulnerable - a side of Superman that's rare. Not only that, but the "it's the safest way to travel" line was delivered perfectly. I think that Routh was perfect for the role. Routh as Kent: HOLY PERFECT, BATMAN!! Routh played a better Kent than Toby McGuire played a Peter Parker, and that made me happy because I was really worried about that. Routh gave the role exactly what it needed. Bosworth as Lois Lane: Probably the worst cast in the movie, but still really striking. I think there is a problem casting someone my age as the parent of a 4 year old boy and as a long-time journalist. I think she did her best, like her dialogue with Lex Luthor or her discusson with Cyclops. I look forward to seeing her in the next movie, as she will be older. Langella as Perry White: this was probably the best casting in the movie. I loved Frank Langella in Good Night and Good Luck, and he really is a fantastic actor. I loved watching him say, "Great Caeser's ghost". Sam Huntington as Jimmy: overactor!!! He was hilareous, seriously hilareous, but I think the Jimmy Olsen role should show some signs of maturing considering that this kid must be at least in his early 20s (drinking beer). Cyclops as Richard White: hmmmm. James Marsdon is a really good actor, as was proven in Second Noah (I can just hear people going, "THAT'S WHERE I REMEMBER HIM FROM!!" while reading this). His character is destined to be dumped, and it feels like he knows even at the beginning of the movie. Is that because he had suspicians before the movie started? Maybe, but it's distracting. Parker Posey as Kitty: why? Parker Posey is waaay too good an actress to play this role. This type of roll is better suited for a simple, one dimentional actress like Drew Barrymore or Jessica Biel. Parker Posey overacted the part and was distracting. She was so funny on Boston Legal.

Storyline seems to be another thing people zero in on. I do have a few thoughts. The idea that Superman left for 4 years to find Krypton was very usefull as a device to bridge from the old movies and excuse his absence...but it was uncharacteristic for the character. The "I was too afraid to say goodbye because I thought you'd make me stay" thing seemed too weak for such a super character. Not only that, but it screwed with one of the few solid story points, putting Superman's orgins into question. It distracted me from the movie. Lex getting off scott free because Superman was gone was hilareous, and worked really well. Lois shagging Cyclops was absolutely breathtaking, and confused the crap out of this comic book fan, but it worked. Superman's love child is an interesting point, and could open up a lot of possibilities in the future, but it also ties Superman down to at least one story line for the next few movies. I'd rather have an open ended ending to a Superman movie. Kryptonite planet? Could come back. Kal Penn dead? That made me want to cry.

I'm looking foward to the next film.

amonkie

I just saw this for the first time this week ... and I kept getting distracted by the superficiality of Superman's face/hair.


It kept reminding me of the Rubber band guy in Fantastic four - Just made me go eww every time he was superman.

I saw this movie mainly because of Spacey - But I was pleasantly surprised at being able to believe Clark Kent. The beginning scene of the birthday cake/picture frame area really played the gamut of emotions, and got me interested to see how Routh does in future movies now that he is more familiar with playing this character.

__________________
Calling from deep in the heart, from where the eyes can't see and the ears can't hear, from where the mountain trails end and only love can go... ~~~ Three Rivers Hare Krishna

Lasereth

I think I'm the only person that thought that Kevin Spacey was given a horrible script in the movie. His acting was "ok," but the character was nothing more than Kevin Spacey yelling a lot. LL could have been much worse, but with MINOR script changes he could have been 10x better.

__________________
"A Darwinian attacks his theory, seeking to find flaws. An ID believer defends his theory, seeking to conceal flaws." -Roger Ebert

Mr. Spacemonkey

I'm awakening from six months without posting to say that I agree. The movie wasn't good. There were many things that bugged me about the movie that I won't go into because I don't have the patience. Instead I'd just like to point out that the fact that Superman killed more people than an evil villian like Lex Luthor may have impacted my opinion. I mean, that's just funny.

With that said, I'm not a fan of Superman. So my opinion isn't quite fair but I will say I did expect it to be a better movie.

__________________
"I hope that when the world comes to an end, I can breathe a sigh of relief, because there will be so much to look forward to." -- Donnie Darko

Willravel

Huh? Superman killed someone?

Mr. Spacemonkey

Yes, he did. Watch the movie again. Three guys from Lex's posse (I believe it was three). After Lex should have succeeded in murdering Superman. You'll know what part I'm talking about.

__________________
"I hope that when the world comes to an end, I can breathe a sigh of relief, because there will be so much to look forward to." -- Donnie Darko

Willravel

This is the way I see it: Superman was trying to save the lives of millions (Lex: BILLIONS!) of people by removing this growing threat of an island. His intent was to save people, but he amy have been neglegent. The question is: was he criminally neglegent? I don't think so. By putting in to motion a plan for world domination by using technology that they couldn't understand, they put themselves in harms way. Imagine that Lex and his crew were arsonists and that Superman was a firefighter. If those house collapses while the fire is being put out, crushing the arsonists, then it's hardly the fire brigade's fault.

Meinwhile, Lex may very well have been responsible for people being injured or killed because of the emp/shockwave caused by the use of Kryptonian technology.

In the case of Superman v. Luthor, the state finds in favor of Superman and Lex is required to pay damages in the amount of 500 million dollars, the estimated cost of the damage done to Metropolis, and up to 25 years of jail time.

Moskie

What did you guys think of Supes spying in on Lois' family? It was a very awkward moment for me. It seemed like a glaringly unethical thing for him to do. It's one thing to use your super-hearing to listen in on something across the room, but it's a whole other ball game to lurk in the shadows and look in on a family conversation. It crossed a line for me. Superman is above stalking.

__________________
Greetings and salutations.

Willravel

I have to agree with this. Yes, we were supposed to see how much Lois and Cyclops hurt Superman, but not so much that he became a stereotypical jelous ex, following them around, confronting Lois to try and win her back, and generally acting kinda sleezy.

highthief

I thought the movie was OK, but not as good as some of the more recent Batman/Spidey/X-Men films. Better than Daredevil, FF and Hulk, though.

__________________
Si vis pacem parabellum.

Mr. Spacemonkey

Right. So ... Superman killed three people. I'm not about to argue whether it was justified or not (or even intentional). I'm simply pointing out that I found it funny.

__________________
"I hope that when the world comes to an end, I can breathe a sigh of relief, because there will be so much to look forward to." -- Donnie Darko

Willravel

Okey dokey.

longbough

So what you're saying is that you believe lethal force is sometimes essential in the protection of innocent lives!



RKBA all the way!

(I couldn't resist that cheap shot, will)

I can't forget that Superman is also a deadbeat dad.

__________________
"I do believe that, where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence. Thus when my eldest son asked me what he should have done, had he been present when I was almost fatally assaulted in 1908, whether he should have run away and seen me killed or whether he should have used his physical force which he could and wanted to use, and defended me, I told him that it was his duty to defend me even by using violence." - Mahatma Ghandi

Willravel

Ouch...my pride....
Love 'em and leave 'em. Super.

cujojack

horrible movie

Redjake

Bryan Singer has publically said that he learned a lesson from this movie and promises to make the second one much better. When the director admits the movie sucked, you know it sucks!

__________________
Off the record, on the q.t., and very hush-hush.

Lwang9276

lol to above post.. umm i thought the movie in the beginning was alright and like everyone said the shuttle save was intense. But then the movie seemed to drag and when they introduced the kid as Superman's son, I was like wow, this just ruined the movie. Its like ok, so hes not owned by kryptonite and he has powers (seems to be normal besides strength tho) so whats the next Superman? Father and Son fight crime together to become the top duo in DC universe... line for the movie "This Summer Batman and Robin take the backseat to Superman and Son" lol... but yea I thought Kate Bosworth was totally wrong for the role and the only character I felt bad for was James Marsden. He saves his family and they think its Superman and then Lois is all like I am going back for Superman. I dont know I jsut felt he got jipped.

ShaniFaye

I finally watched this last nite under much duress lol I had NO desire to see it.

Kevin Spacey perfect for what he had to work with, his part could have been SO much more though and he could have handled it brilliantly.

Lois character sucked, she's waaaaay to weak now, Lois wasnt weak

There were two instances that gave me chills and made my hair stand up on my neck....both were when Superman said "Goodnight Lois" I swear it sounded just like Chris Reeves, so much so I honestly thought they dubbed in that line from the original movie....it was creepy

I have a question.....Im confused as to when he was supposed to have left? Would it have been after the 2nd movie? Because if so, she should have no memory of having slept with superman/clark because he wiped her memory at the end, so how does she know that this kid is his?

__________________
I want the diabetic plan that comes with rollover carbs. I dont like the unused one expiring at midnite!!

Willravel

Kal El left soon after the events of Superman 2, negating Superman 3 and 4. I *think* we're supposed to believe that she's not 100% sure until Jason gets his powers.

ShaniFaye

but she told superman in the hospital that jason was his son

__________________
I want the diabetic plan that comes with rollover carbs. I dont like the unused one expiring at midnite!!

Willravel

Jason got his powers on the yacht. The hospital scene was after that.

They could have made it a lot clearer, but I *think* that's what we're supposed to think.

Even though her memory was wiped, she probably felt soar, too.

ShaniFaye

so you're saying she realized on the boat that Jason was SM's?

__________________
I want the diabetic plan that comes with rollover carbs. I dont like the unused one expiring at midnite!!

Willravel

My interpretation was that she was always suspicious that Jason's father was Superman, but she wasn't certain until Jason used the piano to squish Brutus. Is it sad I know that character's name?

Lasereth

Yes.

__________________
"A Darwinian attacks his theory, seeking to find flaws. An ID believer defends his theory, seeking to conceal flaws." -Roger Ebert

shakran

I also agree that the movie sucked. And they need to find a new weakness for Superman, or else acknowledge that he's a moron. He was nearly killed in previous movies. Each time he was nearly killed, it was done with kryptonite. Yet in Returns, he stumbles right into another kryptonite trap. Exactly how stupid are they trying to tell us Superman is?

meanSpleen

Superman does have another weakness - MAGIC!!! He is weak to magic! It just does not get played with very often.

__________________
Like TFP? Donate To Keep It Alive!!

longbough

Funny.

Magic fools my dog, too.

I guess Superman is a dunce after all.

__________________
"I do believe that, where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence. Thus when my eldest son asked me what he should have done, had he been present when I was almost fatally assaulted in 1908, whether he should have run away and seen me killed or whether he should have used his physical force which he could and wanted to use, and defended me, I told him that it was his duty to defend me even by using violence." - Mahatma Ghandi

Drider_it

what i dont understand is this... with all the villians they COULD do now a days .. why dont they? Lex is cool and all but i'd like to see braniac or something else for once.

on another note.. he gets back and dosent realize she was pregnant before he left? is that right.. dont know.. so my love of the movie is ruined cuz of a now-a-days love triangle.. sigh I don't watch soaps why do it to the movie?

__________________
It means only one thing, and everything: Cut. Once committed to fight, Cut. Everything else is secondary. Cut. That is your duty, your purpose, your hunger. There is no rule more important, no commitment that overrides that one. Cut. The lines are a portrayal of the dance. Cut from the void, not from bewilderment. Cut the enemy as quickly and directly as possible. Cut with certainty. Cut decisively, resoultely. Cut into his strength. Flow through the gaps in his guard. Cut him. Cut him down utterly. Don't allow him a breath. Crush him. Cut him without mercy to the depth of his spirit. It is the balance to life: death. It is the dance with death. It is the law a war wizard lives by, or he dies.