lurkette

I've seen lots of talk about body image and such around the boards, and wanted to show that what's considered "beautiful" changes so much from age to age. "Beauty" is a social construct that's driven by a lot of factors, and to hold oneself to pretty arbirtrary and mutable standards is a little ridiculous. I hope you can look at these images and see a little of yourself somewhere, and recognize that all bodies are beautiful in their own way.

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lurkette

edited old dead links hanging browser

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"If ten million people believe a foolish thing, it is still a foolish thing."

- Anatole France

sexymama

A great reminder! I have a reubenesque figure, naturally and it has taken a lot of work to accept my body. I was expecially pleased when I saw a picture of my great great grandmother. She was a burlesque dancer and built just like me! She was very sexy in her days. I am sensual today and pleased to be who I am!

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collide

Sometimes I wonder how much of these were viewed as a form of art, and which were just symbols or objects of sex[uality]. It seems that the lines are continually blurred over time.

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JadziaDax

Just remember, Marilyn Monroe would be a plumper by today's standards (or at least by the horn dogs on this site).

collide

Ack. Blasphemy! No way that Marilyn Monroe is even close to a plumper.

Isn't this her in her Norma Jean stage?:


She definitely doesn't look heavy or skinny, but HEALTHY, and I think that's part of her appeal.

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annie1

well at least i fit in there somewhere. lol

Janie

Marilyn Monroe had one of the healthiest body images in Hollywood, and she was also one of the sexiest women there. Coincidence? I think not. She's infinitely more attractive than the modern-day Hollywood women who starve themselves into a bag of bones state.

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JadziaDax

Exactly the point, Janie. She was probably the sexiest women ever in all of Hollywood... and she was no Twiggy.

collide

I don't see anything wrong with being full bodied or slim. It's only in the extreme cases of obesity and anorexia that bothers me because neither physical states are healthy for the self in body or mind. Was Twiggy anorexic, or just genetically built that way? She just looks like an ordinary person who happens to be slim to me. I don't see any bones poking out of her flesh as is the case for anorexics. To get back on topic: I think physical beauty can be manifested in every form, which I think is the whole point of this thread. Some people may have a preference to one over the other, but all in all, the various female forms are perfect in its own way.

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"inhuman fiery goat worship" is an anagram for "information superhighway" -kingvolc

Double D

Really enjoyed the art & photos.
Titian, Rubens--always have loved their paintings 'cause I do see real women--me--in them.

And the Venus of Willendorf (at top) is a super-sized gal. Pretty cool!



Another feminine icon who happened to be a size "DD" .

awanderingsoul

I think I read somewhere that Marylin Monroe was a size 12 (or maybe a 14). The article compared her to one of today's icons of beauty, Pamela Anderson Lee, who is supposedly a size 2 (which I find hard to believe). I just thought that was interesting. BTW, personally I don't think that Pam Anderson with all of her modifications is an icon of beauty, but apparently there are many who think otherwise.

Double D

Marilyn was a size 12 by standards of sizing from 40 years ago. (At that time there was no size *zero.*)

My mom weighed 119 pounds and was also a size 12 back then.
I'm guessing the equivalent size today would be a size 8-10.

anti fishstick

hmmm i way 115 and i'm a size 4-6

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anti fishstick

i have a real problem with that brittany murphy chick. she looked a lot healthier when she was in films like clueless and girl interrupted and now she looks wayy too skinny. she hosted SNL and she looked anorexic or something.

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And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.
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angela146

First of all, the pictures of Marilyn Monroe shown here, and the "size 12" description are from the late forties and early fifties. In the early 1960's she looked more rubinesque (and IMHO a lot sexier).

Second, the "styles" may have changed but men don't care about styles. We women are more gullable on that point than men are. Most guys like curvy women. To test that hypothesis, I'm going to post a poll in the sexuality thread in a few minutes.

Take heart ladies and remember one simple thing: most fashion designers are either women or homosexual men. Hetero men don't get a vote.

Double D

What would really be cool is if we could accept ourselves--and other women as they are.

I think Brittany Murphy looks skeletal, but I don't want to let it bug me because who am to judge her?
I sure dislike it when someone judges me based on my body size.

I am appalled by surgical mutilation to achieve slimness, mostly because the procedures can go terribly wrong and the side-effects are life-long even when the surgery is a success. But I can't bash Roseanne or Carny for doing what they did.
And let's face it, these women (including Brittany) are making a living on their looks.

I think women need to try to accept themselves and try not to put each other down for how we look or what we do to achieve that look.

I'm not saying, settle for being unheathy. One can be physically fit and try to eat decently, but still not have what *society* would have us believe is the perfect body.

anti fishstick

i dont know.. i guess i'm just bugged because i thought she looked better and more healthy before, and she probably only dieted to fit the trends of hollywood and what media deems as attractive... and she IS in that business and receives a lot more attention now than ever so more power to her i guess..

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And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.
~Anais Nin

lurkette

Exactly! It's about time (and I think it's starting to happen) that women reclaim their own body image and start making their own rules. To hell with advertisers, fashion designers, movie/TV executives! Why should there be such a narrow standard of beauty? It's manipulative and unhealthy and I don't think we should put up with it for one more minute.

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"If ten million people believe a foolish thing, it is still a foolish thing."

- Anatole France

~springrain

*jumping on the wagon... reclaiming my body and making my own rules!*

... we are the sole writer, director and producer of our lives... *smile*... i can't tell you have happy i am to see and feel the support of women, from other women.
thanks again lurkette... awesome post.

suze888

I'm joining this so late, I just found this, so I'm sorry if I'm repeating, but don't you guys think Brittany Murphy looks terrible now? I really thought she was great in Clueless and Girl Interrupted, but now when I see her, I'm just thinking to myself, "She needs to be fed!" She is so talented but she looks horribly anorexic. And that's a terrible message to be sending to women and young girls everywhere.

veruca

a lot of actresses and singers who were reppin' the big girl's are losing weight..kelly clarkson, hillary duff, j-lo, beyonce, drew barrymore..there are other I can't think of ...they were larger and have each lost at least 20 lbs...j-lo's butt looks so small!!

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JustJess

What’s the Comcast request for a password that keeps coming up? What should I do with it? Do I need to put something in to see the pics??

On topic, I’m just as likely as the next person to comment on and judge public figures’ figures. It’s sort of impossible to avoid doing sometimes. Do I think it’s right? No, of course not, I don’t want anyone judging me! But on the other side, they are putting themselves out into that stereotypical limiting world… do you guys think there is something to the idea that they should be a little more aware that they made a choice and the cost of that choice may be fitting a particular image? I.e. the way you have to dress in a certain manner to be work-appropriate?

I’m not saying I *do* think that, but I find the concept interesting… but then again, I am certainly against propagating the idea that ‘they ask for it’. (‘it’ being all that judgement). And I hate the idea that body-images put out by Hollywood/advertisers/etc. affect how we feel about ourselves so much.

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astrahl

That's another issue. What is going on with women's sizes? 12? 0? WTF? How about we go metric and get rid of these arbitrary numbers. I'm getting pretty F'kin tired of being different sizes depending on the manufacturer and the price of the clothing. The more expensive the clothing, the lower the numbers. I learned THAT delightful tid-bit after working in a clothing shop.
Sheesh.

/end rant

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veruca

I absolutely HATE that all designers use a differant scale for sizes...it makes me crazy that no size is ever the same

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You starve and near exhaust me
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I move the stars for no one

SiN

the size thing is a pain in the ass for online ordering.

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jRuntlets

I own five pairs of jeans from the same brand all bought within a year and they're all the exact same style. I have sizes 5, 7,9, and 11. WTF!?

I agree that we should all be happy with who we are, no matter what our size or shape. I've always been told to pick one attribute that I like about myself and see that as my beauty. It's taken years to pick myself as a whole as the one attribute I like about myself. We're women, we're supposed to have curves, we're supposed to look different and we're supposed to be unique!

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bernadette

i like to buy mens' jeans, khakis, flannel pants & hoodies.
the sizes are more dependable. the pants are more comfortable (no camel toe issues!). & the prices are generally cheaper than womens'!

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Gilda

I wear mostly dresses and skirts to work, partly because I'm a confirmed, card carrying girly girl, but also partly becuse it's much easier finding a skirt or dress that fits than pants, which vary in size seemingly at random. Shopping for jeans is a nightmare. I've in the past been reduced to shopping in the little boys' section to get jeans that come anywhere close to fitting.

Oh, and here's more info on Marilyn's dress size.

JustJess

yeah... I've never bought little in anything!! I'm slightly amazon-ish. Slightly!
And Gilda - love the snopes use. I love that site.

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My heart knows me better than I know myself, so I'm gonna let it do all the talkin'.

Gilda

People tell me they envy my being able to wear anything because I'm tall and thin, but it really doesn't work out that way. There aren't many stores that carry a 2 tall, so I have to choose between women's sizes for the length, which then is way too baggy, or misses 2 (or sometimes 4), which is usually too short. This is why I usually prefer skirts. A dress or skirt that's three or four inches too short isn't really noticable like pants , and jeans are just a nightmare.

I'd kill for a bust and hips to be able to wear a 6--all the prettiest clothes seem to be available in that size, and there seems to be the biggest selection.

On the other hand, the "young men's" (ie, pubescent boys) section sometimes works really well for me when shopping for pants and sporty looking shirts, though it does seem to be decidedly sparse when it comes to dresses, and I really prefer the cut of women's slacks, when I can find them to fit.

amonkie

There always seems to be something everyone wants to fix.

My theory behind the attractiveness factor is that in a lot of the cases, people feel their self esteem increasing as the number on the scale goes down. If this is happening because of a lifestyle change to become healthier that is resulting in some pounds coming off, I think people rush to automatically associate the weight loss as the source of their improved confidence, and maybe not also considering that their body is feeling healthier because they are eating better and treating their bodies right.

The girls we see in Hollywood are going to find one day that when the scale stops, they're going to be just as empty as before if they weren't dropping the pounds for the right reason.

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Grasshopper Green

I wholeheartedly agree. The pants in my closet range from a 6 to a 10...why there can't be an industry standard is beyond me.

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Supple Cow

Am I the only one who still can't see the pictures?

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amonkie

Supple, Sin edited the post because of dropped links, so no more pictures.

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Calling from deep in the heart, from where the eyes can't see and the ears can't hear, from where the mountain trails end and only love can go... ~~~ Three Rivers Hare Krishna