A little phone call from the principal
 

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There's a LOT more I want to know about this case. For starters, I'd like to know who's telling the truth in regard to how equitably straights and gays are treated in regard to PDAs. Secondly, I'd like to know a little more about the alleged "outing." I assume the mother would ask the reason for a suspension; if the principal said, "Because your daughter is engaging in PDAs with Trang Nguyen," that's simply a factual accounting of the reason. If their displays were indeed public, I disagree that she was "outed."

Sounds like a money grab to me, but I'm sure I'll hear from people who think otherwise.

^Not from me. I have no sympathy for people who break rules repeatedly and then play the minority card. It's very simple: if you're getting in trouble for it, expect to get in trouble if you do it again.

Just to give a unique point of view, if 2 girls were kissing when I was in high school, I would have been distracted to say the least. Maybe the faculty was trying to maintain a good learning environment, or at least one free of such distractions; in other words, maybe they were trying to do their jobs. But, then again, who are they to tell a couple of 16 year olds who are still developing their sexual identities what is detrimental to the educational process???

outing can be about intention.

it seems like the principle acted like he thought this was a secret he could reveal, to another's disadvantage.

that's an outing.

this school is in OC...i can't imagine that there aren't other couples hooking up with out getting this kind of attentionn poured on them.

They're not arguing the infraction, they're arguing the way it's being handled, and the ridiculous penalties being put on them- penalties they feel far outweigh anything a hetero couple would get. That's a glaring inequality, if it's true. It has nothing to do with the infraction- it has to do with whether or not the "rules" are being used to punish them, but if they're being overlooked and unapplied to the hetero couples.

I have never, ever heard of a straight couple getting suspended- let alone multiple suspensions- or going anywhere near as far as getting transferred to other schools. I have seen hetero couples get caught fucking in the bathroom and get one day of in-school suspension, or a written warning. That, I have seen several times, actually. My high school had a large common area for between classes and at lunches, and I never saw any of the dozens of hugging and smooching couples get anything more than a passing glance. There is no way my school in Florida was more progressive 7, 8 or 9 years ago than an OC, California high school is today. Hugging and kissing (note that if they were "making out", the principal would most certainly have painted the picture that way) does not lead to multiple suspensions and beyond. I have an extremely hard time buying that he's anywhere near as hard-nosed towards the straight couples. If he was, he'd be able to easily cite several examples. From all this, I gather no such examples exist.

"They're not arguing the infraction, they're arguing the way it's being handled, and the ridiculous penalties being put on them- penalties they feel far outweigh anything a hetero couple would get. That's a glaring inequality, if it's true."

Not at all. If a male and female were repeatedly told to cool their PDAs at the school, even after being penalized (suspended) several times because of it, and still continued, I think they would get the same treatment. No foul here.

However, I will go further: You don't have to treat everyone the same, because they are not the same. If a female dashed across the gym topless, this would be grounds for suspension. If a male did it, it would not. If a male wore lipstick and makeup to school it appropriate to demand that this be stopped, while I assume many females do just that. This is not because he does not have the right to be different, it’s because he does not have the right to be distracting while at school.
In a similar way to individuals being treated differently, couples may be treated differently if their behavior has different effects. I suspect that there is a rule against any PDA of any kind at the school. However, high school being what it is, that rule is difficult to enforce completely so they only go after obvious or disruptive incidents. These students got "dinged" for both.
Once the students got dinged once for being disruptive together, they had more attention paid to them. They chose to repeatedly defy the rules and got into hot water repeatedly.
Assuming the article has the facts correct and there are no important omissions, I think the school did the correct thing.

I applaud this young lady. When I was in high school (and dating a boy), I held hands and kissed (on the cheek) my best girl friend. It was in no way sexual, and yet, I was teased constantly by several people. I was always called lesbian, dyke, etc. It didn't really bother me, until one boy who was in the majority of my classes WOULD NOT stop harassing me. When I finally mustered the courage up to talk to the dean about how the boy kept calling me a lesbian and dyke during class, the dean just asked: Well, are you? (WTF?!)

Anyway, I understand how this girl is feeling discriminated against. I was never harassed or called "hetero" or "straight" when I was kissing my boyfriend (in a much more sexual manner than when I kissed my girl friend), but it's alright to harass someone if they peck someone of the same sex?

And FatFreeGoodness, are homosexuals supposed to HIDE their love for each other? No, I don't think so. If people get all upset over two girls/guys kissing, then that's their fault. About your argument of girls and boys showing their chests- at my old high school, if any boy was seen with their shirt off at school, he would immediately be asked to put it back on or go to the office to wear a nasty PE shirt. Same with girls who showed too much cleavage.

I disagree, if you don't want to be 'outed' you don't out yourself to your school and NOT expect it to get back to your parents.

And if your friend tells you that he thought Tyra Banks was hot, you'd tell his wife over drinks?

Outing can be about intention.

Perhaps it speaks well of my wife and my friends wives but such would never be an issue.

I see your point but I just don't think it bears any weight.

On a side note, having gone to a catholic high school, I can say that they would not tolerate it from a heterosexual couple either, and I do not recall a single PDA in or around the school.

didn't think it would convince you...or really think about if it was personally applicable. but information that might not matter one way or another can be used maliciously if it's told with bad intent. try to embarass someone with something, it doesn't really matter what their feelings about that information...you still gave it a try, right?

to the side note...if enforcement really was that uniform in this situation...there wouldn't be an issue.

nice sig line, btw.

First of all, my post was not about the penalties for the infraction being the same- it was about whether or not penalties are even being handed out the same. My whole point was that, while the penalties obviously exist, I am in extreme doubt that any such penalties are being put on the "straight" couples- as in, straight couples are not being punished for doing the same thing. It was the center of my entire post.

Why is it a distraction, or any more of a distraction if one part of the student body does it already? It's not like if someone strapped a dildo to their forehead... so the decision rests on whether or not sexual orientation carries into the "distraction" factor, and whether or not sexual orientation is a protected right of minors in a public school. Regardless, like I said, the only thing that realyl matters here is whether or not the "straight" couples' infractions are being penalized equally.

You say that the couple was "dinged" for being obvious and disruptive. I say it's only more "obvious" than a straight couple if you're a bigot towards gays, and only more "disruptive" if you believe that all the kids attending the school are also bigots- it should only matter that you are more visually enthralled by it if you're a bigot. In other words, if you weren't against it, it wouldn't matter that it sticks out a little more for YOU.

If i'm out somewhere, gay couples don't visually jump out at me like they're in a spotlight or glowing, and their "PDA"s don't strike me any differently than a straight couple's would. I can't imagine any argument that gay/lesbian PDA's are more distracting that isn't just someone

I'm assuming the school has anti-PDA rules for everyone, like most school districts nowadays, but is being more viligant enforcing them for the ladies kissing. I think the principal should have involved the parent(s) earlier, when the suspensions were first being handed out and they weren't working. The parent invite seems like a cheap attempt to shock the parent.

I'm with the toaster.

There's little doubt in my mind that they have PDA rules, nor that they're sinlging out these two girls for their displays. I know we had rules like that where I went to school, and it wasn't unusual to see girls being very clingy with the guys, but I don't think I ever remember anything more than a verbal warning in passing.

On the other hand, Principal Wolf must be covering up for his own repressed homosexuality. Bear with me just a second. There are two teenaged girls--Asian teenaged girls--who are engaged in PDA's. And he objects to this. This is not typical straight male behavior.

Gilda

Hehe, how true :D

You've hit on the solution. He should have proved his heterosexuality by asking them to join him in a threesome, or at least suggested that they let him watch them in action. :D

I still maintain that it's not an "outing" unless one of the girls discussed her orientation with a counselor or other school official in what she assumed was a confidential situation. How do you report to a parent that their child was engaging in prohibited PDAs WITHOUT mentioning who the other party was?

I regularly made out with my hs girlfriend. I don't know of any school who made hugging against the rules. Maybe kissing, as it can get pretty serious, but hugging? I call discrimination. Is there a video tape of the girls? :lol:

I'm surprised he didn't.

At my high school we had PDA rules, and everyone signed a form at the beginning of the school year saying that they would abide by the rules in the school handbook or else face disciplinary action (parents also had to sign the form).

I don't think anyone should have to watch other students make out in the hall, regardless of sexual orientation. I think that perhaps what happened is that these ladies' punishment was more noticeable simply because of the situation.

As for this girl being irritated that she was outed by her principal--as a minor she has no right to expect confidentiality in the principal's office unless her principal has agreed to keep it confidential--and that really only applies to situations such as sexual abuse, not sexual orientation. Also, given that she was making out with her girlfriend in the hallway--she's not exactly fully in the closet. Her parents could have probably just as easily found out from a peer or teacher as the principal.