03-28-2005, 04:48 PM | #1 (permalink) | |
WARNING: FLAMMABLE
Location: Ask Acetylene
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Man goes on gas station rampage
Source: http://www.phillyburbs.com/pb-dyn/ne...05-468776.html
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So TFers I ask you, what do you think, good shoot? Is this how the Pizza place should have turned out?
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03-28-2005, 05:05 PM | #4 (permalink) |
Poo-tee-weet?
Location: The Woodlands, TX
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from what the article says it sounds like he was justified in defending himself in the way he did.
its too bad it had to come to that... but they attacked him, and he defended himself.
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03-28-2005, 05:42 PM | #5 (permalink) |
Jarhead
Location: Colorado
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Reminds me of the time I had to pull a knife on six goons that jumped me. Thankfully, I didn't have to use it because they backed down as soon as they saw it.
I'd say these guys got what they were looking for.
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If there exists anything mightier than destiny, then it is the courage to face destiny unflinchingly. -Geibel Despise not death, but welcome it, for nature wills it like all else. -Marcus Aurelius Come on, you sons of bitches! Do you want to live forever? -GySgt. Daniel J. "Dan" Daly |
03-28-2005, 06:03 PM | #6 (permalink) |
Loser
Location: manhattan
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Wait a sec?!? Guns are evil and the fact that normal, law abiding citizens carry them only provides criminals chance to overpower and take their weapon from them. This is a travesty! He should never have had that gun and defended himself! We don't even know whether or not the 17-20 drunk people who attacked him were properly breast fed or were denied that shiny red bicycle they wanted for Christmas when they were only 5 years old. The 17-20 drunk people were the VICTIMS! Especially the guy who got shot. I weep for his soul and am burning some incense and pulling a big fat bong tube in his honor. When will the American people stand up for the real victims!?!
......in my excitement I misread the numbers in the article. Not 17-20 attackers (ages). 6 attackers...... my bad. Last edited by RangerDick; 03-28-2005 at 06:12 PM.. |
03-28-2005, 06:27 PM | #7 (permalink) |
All important elusive independent swing voter...
Location: People's Republic of KKKalifornia
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It is incredible that the kids don't see themselves at fault:
Quote - Who brings a gun to Wawa? Um, who jumps and attacks "innocent" people? Kel, where does it say 'a disturbingly large percentage of Americans believe he should not be able to defend himself?' I'd be interested in seeing the numbers cause that's just messed up. Pizza man should of been armed. I for one, would not miss those two from society. |
03-28-2005, 06:32 PM | #8 (permalink) |
Please touch this.
Owner/Admin
Location: Manhattan
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Call me a gamer, but if you're gonna call something a rampage, I want at least 10 dead.
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03-28-2005, 07:38 PM | #10 (permalink) |
WARNING: FLAMMABLE
Location: Ask Acetylene
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Take a look at the number of criminal friendly/gun free zones, take a look at national legislation. 46+ states do not allow concealed carry without paying for a permit and waiting months on the off chance they issue it to you(as is the case for the majority of the population, which will be delayed or denied). Even more states don't allow open carry with or without a permit. Waiting periods which make handguns unavailable to those who need them NOW due to a clear and present threat. Openly hostile law enforcement officers in many states and cities who will stop you and search you if they see you carrying even in states where it is legal to carry openly.
NY, Chicago, Boston, Washington D.C., and any populated area in California all deny either ownership or right to carry or both. That is a huge chunk of the population that has chosen to deny itself and anyone unfortunate enough to live there the most expedient means of protection. I think it's pretty clear what the majority thinks of defensive handgun usage. It's a slight majority and it's is slowly shrinking for now, but it is still significant and disturbing. Politicians did not make these changes in a vacuum.
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"It better be funny" Last edited by kel; 03-28-2005 at 07:47 PM.. |
03-28-2005, 07:46 PM | #11 (permalink) |
Insane
Location: Republic of Panama
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99 times out of a hundred, they would all have been laughing in college monday about how they "totally kicked that dudes arse, man" - just this one time they picked on the wrong fucking hombre.
there is a life lesson in there somewhere for these jerks.
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03-28-2005, 07:58 PM | #13 (permalink) | |
Unbelievable
Location: Grants Pass OR
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03-28-2005, 10:38 PM | #14 (permalink) |
Tilted
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i can't really express an opinion on weither or not he was justified.. theres to many variables.. how did the fight start for example. was he able to defend himself without the use of excessive force?
did he try to diffuse the situation at all? if he antagonized these kids before the fight at all then i wouldn't say the use of deadly force was justified.. was there any reason for this guy to be fearing for his life? i mean its a group of drunken teenagers as for the dumb comments from the kids after the incident.. assume everybody has a gun, that way when you start shit with somebody, you won't be suprised when they shoot your stupid ass. what i find odd about this.. is that the rest of the kids decided to stick around AFTER two of them got shot. i wonder what happend between the time of the shooting, and the time the police got there. |
03-28-2005, 11:43 PM | #15 (permalink) | |
Psycho
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
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it sounds like he (a sober individual) was attacked by 6 guys looking for trouble. they just ended up finding the WRONG guy. as for those who cant find the use of such extreme force....if a police officer was put in the same position of being attacked by 6 drunken individuals, he'd probably do the same thing. when drunks go out looking to beat the shit out of someone, generally they BEAT THE SHIT OUT OF SOMEONE. they dont just punch and kick, they fucking beat you do a bloody pulp.....unless you can defend yourself with a weapon. oh yeah.....and if I'M at a gas station at 2 in the morning and six drunk fuckers try to start shit with me, I'D be fucking fearing for my life. and if I had a gun and was attacked by 6 drunks, in a gas station, I'D make sure they knew that I had a gun. Last edited by asudevil83; 03-28-2005 at 11:45 PM.. |
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03-28-2005, 11:59 PM | #16 (permalink) |
*edited for content*
Location: Austin, TX
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I occasionally travel to the north las vegas area to do some freelance work down there. When I do travel there, I will carry my fully licensed pistol which I do have a concealed carry permit for. It is a bad area, and I have witnessed shootings in that area.
If 6 people jump me, and start beating on me in a gas station, I will pull my gun, and proceed to defend myself. At the point where they are running, or laying on the ground is when I will consider myself safe enough to stop firing. I'm not really a violent person, but 6 people attacking me for no reason is a threat to your life, and your completely justified in defending yourself.
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03-29-2005, 02:16 AM | #17 (permalink) |
Kiss of Death
Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow
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Let's look at this in sequence.
6 drunk teenagers. Get kicked out of hotel for being rowdie. Go across street to gas station. A fight just happens to insue. The facts not being out there for us ATM, I think it is probably safe to assume that the lone gunman here did not start the fight. He was sober, strapped, and pumping gas... enter a bunch of stupid kids who are tanked, just got 86'd from their lodging, and probably have their drunk balls on (feeling tough, looking for a fight). I saying if this is the case then good riddance, I'm glad he pulled his piece and opened fire. You are both insane and stupid if you don't think he is justified in doing so. 6 drunk teens walk up to you and pick a fight/start beating on you, you have no idea what the fuck is going to happen to you, not to mention, the odds are heavily stacked against you. Also Thalakos I can tell you what happened after the shootings, before the cops got in there, the kids got sobered up damn quick after they realized they fucked with the wrong person.
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03-29-2005, 02:24 AM | #18 (permalink) |
Guest
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I dont like guns.. I live in England which is not yet like America for gun carrying. Hopefully it never will be. But if you live in a country where its legal to carry a gun for your protection and it seems he had a legal permit for it ..then this seems to be the perfect point for why you would carry one.
He seems to have used it for what it was intended , to protect himself . So he should be dealt with leniantly in my opinion. |
03-29-2005, 06:29 AM | #19 (permalink) |
Tilted
Location: NJ, USA
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Sad as it is to say I'd rather it be them them not me not going home after the altercation. I would rather have to explain to my kids why I did what I did rather then my wife having to explain why I am in the hospital or dead. That being said, I don't carry a gun but I do my best not to find myself in situations where something like this may happen. I can't remember the last time I just had to go to a convienence store at 2:00am.
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03-29-2005, 08:20 AM | #20 (permalink) | |
Smithers, release the hounds
Location: Guatemala, Guatemala
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03-29-2005, 09:52 AM | #21 (permalink) | |
Psycho
Location: Ontario, Canada
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and you dont need a gun to defend yourself. |
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03-29-2005, 10:00 AM | #22 (permalink) | |
Cracking the Whip
Location: Sexymama's arms...
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And maybe the facts are exactly that: the guy was innocent and 6 guys picked a fight with him. In that case, how was the guy supposed to defend himself? By saying, "Please please don't beat me up"? Or would it have been better if he had let them put him in the hospital? But let's just assume for ONE minute he WAS calling them out. One guy, not drunk, not part of a group, calling out SIX DRUNK guys who are raising hell. If so, you seem to be saying that it was ok for SIX DRUNK guys to start kicking the shit out of ONE guy and that he DESERVED it. Now THAT'S crazy.
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03-29-2005, 10:07 AM | #23 (permalink) | |
Kiss of Death
Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow
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To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition. |
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03-29-2005, 10:13 AM | #24 (permalink) | |
Junk
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He was charged and convicted of 3 counts of aggravated assault causing bodily damage and placed on 5 years probation. He may have had the charges dropped if he showed "remorse" for his actions, but since he was the one attacked, he didn't buy into that silly notion. He told the judge if he didn't defend himself he might have ended up dead. In the end the judge treated the young offenders with kiddy gloves and sent them home with their parents to suburbia. I asked my friend that if he had a gun when they attacked him, would he have used it. He said without a doubt. And I'd have done the same. And if not a gun,...a baseball bat, stick, lead pipe anything for survival. But if that weren't available to me and I were beaten and lived,...I go back and even the score, one way or the other. Not very Canadian of me eh?
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03-29-2005, 10:24 AM | #25 (permalink) | |
Psycho
Location: Ontario, Canada
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if there was 6 people trying to fight him, how did he get 5 rounds off... I mean, 1 shot, gun should have been taken or they ran.. and even if they ran he shot 2 of them not one.. I still don't know how innocent this guy is |
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03-29-2005, 10:27 AM | #26 (permalink) |
Kiss of Death
Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow
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I'm getting the vibe that you are presuming he is the guilty one, which he could very well be, but if I had to pick between 6 rowdie drunk moron kids who had just gotten kicked out of their motel and a guy filling up his tank at 2am, I would probably side with one guy.
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To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition. |
03-29-2005, 10:34 AM | #27 (permalink) | |
Psycho
Location: Ontario, Canada
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I mean if they ran after the first shot... and the guy just kept shotting at them... how innocent is he? |
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03-29-2005, 10:38 AM | #28 (permalink) |
Kiss of Death
Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow
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In a case of self defense you are allowed to defend yourself until you determine you are no longer in great physical danger. I don't know what kind of gun he was shooting, but chances are if 6 kids are swarming and beating on you, it wouldn't be that tough to get off six shots, the shit goes down really fast. Hell I bet the kids didn't even react until after he fired 2 or 3 shots.
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To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition. |
03-29-2005, 11:08 AM | #30 (permalink) | |
AHH! Custom Title!!
Location: The twisted warpings of my brain.
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Have you ever fired a gun? Or been presented with a situation that you overreacted to? With the amount of adrenaline that's inherent to an encounter like this with a semi-automatic pistol 5 rounds would quite literally require less than 1 second to discharge. I worry that in a situation like this the people doing the attacking are going to be favored because of an abnormal sympathy felt for the man protecting himself because he had a gun. As it's been said, if he hadn't been able to defend himself with force the most likely result of this encounter would have been him ending up in the hospital or worse, and then this thread would have been our moral outrage at the six teenagers and how could they possibly do this to another person?! Instead we're now questioning whether this mans actions were justified and turning him into the bad guy in a situation that he had very little control over. Oh yeah, and read it again, the kids didn't run away, even after shooting the 2 of them they were so drunk and aggressive that they stayed at the scene!
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03-29-2005, 11:08 AM | #31 (permalink) |
Banned
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Teen Found Guilty In Slurpee Killing
18-Year-Old Beaten To Death Outside Convenience Store POSTED: 3:13 pm EST March 25, 2005 UPDATED: 6:46 pm EST March 25, 2005 UPPER MARLBORO, Md. -- A jury has found a teenager accused of killing an 18-year-old man over a girl and a Slurpee guilty. FeedRoom Teen Convicted In Slurpee Murder In a Prince George's County courtroom Friday, 16-year-old Emmanuel McClain, of Suitland, was convicted on four counts in the beating death of 18-year-old Michael Bassett. Police and prosecutors said McClain beat Bassett outside a convenience store on Silver Hill Road in Suitland last May after Basset offered to buy a Slurpee for a girl standing nearby. Bassett was left for dead near a busy roadway and was hit by oncoming traffic. He died from injures sustained at the scene. State's Attorney Glenn Ivey said justice has been done and closure can now come to the Bassett family. McClain faces at least 65 years in jail when he's sentenced on May 12. Two other teenagers are also facing charged in the case. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Maybe he knew about this poor kid that got jumped outside a convenience store last year and was killed. There were also around 5 or 6 people involved in that too. This occured in my region. Plus, there have been many instances where someone is knocked to the ground, someone else kicks him, and then there is a severed spinal cord or dain bramage or death. Group beatings often turn out very bad, and this guy may have had no idea of what he was getting into that night. Until there is more information, I would have to side with the shooter. Shoot a few more assholes and maybe people will leave you alone when you are trying to just go about your business. |
03-29-2005, 12:03 PM | #32 (permalink) |
Rawr!
Location: Edmontania
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6 older drunk teenagers is plenty for a mob mentality. I've seen it in clubs- a guy will dance withthe wrong girl and 6 or 7 guys will beat him to the floor and then starting shitkicking. The only reason it stops is because of the bouncers.
I think this guy was scared. Surrounded by six guys provoking then beating him up, for no other reason than being in the wrong place at the wrong time. If I had a gun on me in that situation I would certainly use it.
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03-29-2005, 01:31 PM | #33 (permalink) | ||
Insane
Location: bangor pa
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Now as for all of the facturs that could be. IF!!!! if he was jumped and attacked and he DID NOT CALL them out ( which i doubt he did) then he had every reason to open fire.
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03-29-2005, 02:03 PM | #34 (permalink) | ||
Psycho
Location: cali
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victim suffered from a gunshot that entered just below the sternum and exited right below the right shoulder blade. because of the angle of entry and exit, it seems 1 of 3 things happened here. 1) man shoots kid while kid was on the floor 2) man holds gun like he was a cowboy gunslinger, at his waist, shooting up -or- 3) man was jumped, taken to the ground, hunched over, pulled out gun and shot the teen from a lower vantage point well, seeing as there were six of them, had he tripped one, or even took one to the ground, the other 5 were there to continue kicking the living shit out of him. and since he wasn't in an old western gun duel with the teen who got shot, i'm gonna go with option #3. he probably was on the ground, shot one. the other victim took a bullet to the abdomen. and since a gun's recoil causes the gun to tip upwards, i'm wanting to believe that the shot to the abdomen was 1 of the first shots. probably from a lower vantage point as well since people don't shoot from the waist. it seems to me, now i want to stress the word seems, that he probably shot both the kids from the ground before the kids realized, 'shit! he's got a gun'. they sobered up real quick, the man got up off the ground and went to call for help. at this point, the kid who yelled something to the effect of 'you shot us' accompanied him either cuz he was still too drunk, or he felt the situation was no longer as violent. i think the shooting was justified. i would do the same. seeing how the man went to the attendant to call for help, and the other kid was there, showed me he wasn't the one on a violent rampage, wanting to shoot kids, else he would have at least shot the other kid with him and made a run for it.
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03-29-2005, 06:39 PM | #36 (permalink) | |
Insane
Location: bangor pa
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if he gets charged i hope i get jury duty...just so i can let him off for self defence
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03-30-2005, 10:10 PM | #37 (permalink) |
Warrior Smith
Location: missouri
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yeah, definately keep us posted on this case- I want to see how it turns out- seems to me he should go free and clear, and the kids should be charged....
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03-30-2005, 11:02 PM | #38 (permalink) |
Junkie
Location: Louisiana
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hell i still think here in louisiana and just north in arkansas we have the biggest gun toters in the country with the exception of maybe texas and michigan.
everyone ive ever met down here owns at least 4 guns of various types and knows how to strip clean and fire each one. sorry but the dude could have gotten off work, forgot to tank up for the next day or what not. night before easter.. everything will be closed he took off to fill up so he'd have the gas for sunday... a bunch of rowdy teens wander up.. he notices them but keeps to himself. they say something to him and he ignores them. they start to push the issue, then someone gets brave, slaps thier nads in a vice and takes the plunge. now you have the group mentality. everyone in the pool. dude draws the gun and the pucker factor is high. *blat* only thing i saw missing was this: they were too drunk and scared to pull it together to say he came at the group and they were trying to fight him off and hold him and he then pulled a gun. had they been a bunch of jerks sober and a fight you bet your arse they would have done something like that.. thier word agaist his. but this route.. confirmed kicked out of a motel, drunk and disorderaly conduct.. bah they got what was commin to them. sorry but down here you dont fight one person you end up fighting them and all thier friends.
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03-30-2005, 11:08 PM | #39 (permalink) |
Kiss of Death
Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow
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I would assume there would be tape too, gas stations trying to prevent people from pumping and leaving. Wish some more news would come out on the matter.
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gas, man, rampage, station |
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