Almost Beaten To Death Over Pizza (video included) - Page 3 - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

dksuddeth · 03-01-2005, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janey

towards what end? imagine using your concealed weapon, you draw on the guy who may or may not notice in the frenzy. so youshoot. who do you hit? asshole bully or victim? even if you got Mr. Pig-ass, do you see the matter ended there? What do you think your day in court would do for you? manslaughter or assault, and a civil suit.

In addition, everybody is saying that the innaction shown was typical of similar situations by by-standers. It may be the shock of disbelief. But whatever, I doubt that carrying concealed weapons will be the answer unless you are a trained professional. I bet that by the time most people would think to draw their weapons, the same time would have passed as when (how many... zero?) people pulled out their cell phone to summon help.

if you are licensed, then you've been trained. In the episode thats posted, almost no prosecutor or grand jury is going to indict you based on self defense laws. and a civil suit? never happen.

Janey · 03-01-2005, 02:20 PM

If you are the third party in (i.e. one of the by-standers, who failed to pull out and arm their cell phones by the way), it's hardly a case for self defense. It's at best a good samaritan application... which may be on the gray side, open to interpretation, AND civil suits.

reiii · 03-01-2005, 02:37 PM

I would have stood there I think, my courage isnt impulsive enough to manifest in such a fast and spontaneous situation like that parlor. It might depend on my mood, but who isnt scared of violent 350 pound ex cons?

I do think I would have rushed to the guys aid once the dude left the restraunt....

raeanna74 · 03-01-2005, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dksuddeth

this should certainly make a very convincing argument for concealed handgun licenses, wouldn't you think?

Though I would love to pull a gun on a bozo like that I don't practice daily with it. I don't want to carry a weapon that can be used against me. Try learning how to use your hands as weapons. It doesn't take a lot of classes for that and practicing doesn't mean you have to go to a shooting range. For those who do carry though I appreciate that you're out there. It's not my choice of weapon.

dksuddeth · 03-01-2005, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janey

If you are the third party in (i.e. one of the by-standers, who failed to pull out and arm their cell phones by the way), it's hardly a case for self defense. It's at best a good samaritan application... which may be on the gray side, open to interpretation, AND civil suits.

In texas, its perfectly legal.

http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/statutes/pe.toc.htm

§ 9.32. DEADLY FORCE IN DEFENSE OF PERSON. (a) A
person is justified in using deadly force against another:
(1) if he would be justified in using force against the
other under Section 9.31;
(2) if a reasonable person in the actor's situation
would not have retreated; and
(3) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the
deadly force is immediately necessary:
(A) to protect himself against the other's use or
attempted use of unlawful deadly force; or
(B) to prevent the other's imminent commission of
aggravated kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual
assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery.
(b) The requirement imposed by Subsection (a)(2) does not
apply to an actor who uses force against a person who is at the time
of the use of force committing an offense of unlawful entry in the
habitation of the actor.

Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 883, ch. 399, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974.
Amended by Acts 1983, 68th Leg., p. 5316, ch. 977, § 5, eff.
Sept. 1, 1983; Acts 1993, 73rd Leg., ch. 900, § 1.01, eff. Sept.
1, 1994; Acts 1995, 74th Leg., ch. 235, § 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1995.

§ 9.33. DEFENSE OF THIRD PERSON. A person is justified
in using force or deadly force against another to protect a third
person if:
(1) under the circumstances as the actor reasonably
believes them to be, the actor would be justified under Section 9.31
or 9.32 in using force or deadly force to protect himself against
the unlawful force or unlawful deadly force he reasonably believes
to be threatening the third person he seeks to protect; and
(2) the actor reasonably believes that his
intervention is immediately necessary to protect the third person.

Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 883, ch. 399, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974.
Amended by Acts 1993, 73rd Leg., ch. 900, § 1.01, eff. Sept. 1,
1994.

§ 9.34. PROTECTION OF LIFE OR HEALTH. (a) A person is
justified in using force, but not deadly force, against another
when and to the degree he reasonably believes the force is
immediately necessary to prevent the other from committing suicide
or inflicting serious bodily injury to himself.
(b) A person is justified in using both force and deadly
force against another when and to the degree he reasonably believes
the force or deadly force is immediately necessary to preserve the
other's life in an emergency.

analog · 03-01-2005, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lebell

This REALLY isn't a thread jack, but stories like this are why I conceal carry.

Once I get my own, I will be doing likewise.

This story dropped humanity another 2 pegs for me today. Seems to happen more and more often.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janey

towards what end? imagine using your concealed weapon, you draw on the guy who may or may not notice in the frenzy. so youshoot. who do you hit? asshole bully or victim? even if you got Mr. Pig-ass, do you see the matter ended there? What do you think your day in court would do for you? manslaughter or assault, and a civil suit.

In addition, everybody is saying that the innaction shown was typical of similar situations by by-standers. It may be the shock of disbelief. But whatever, I doubt that carrying concealed weapons will be the answer unless you are a trained professional. I bet that by the time most people would think to draw their weapons, the same time would have passed as when (how many... zero?) people pulled out their cell phone to summon help.

Just like being totally pro-gun cannot possibly work in every instance, so can being adamently anti-gun. I assume that your lack of understanding for the type of training a licenced concealed carrier undergoes, and the penalties for the actions carried out in such a circumstance, stems from your disrespect for the carriers themselves and a personal predilection for stating your own opinion rather than learning and understanding the facts.

Cellphones fall short of immeditely disarming or quelling the actions of an enraged or mentally ill person with a destructive path. While you're on your oh-so-important, just-as-effective-as-a-gun cellphone, that guy may be beaten to death, left to bleed to death, or be otherwise permanently/irreversibly injured by the assailant. The police will finally arrive, just in time to scrape what's left of the poor guy off the floor, and take a statement from you, the person who stood there with the mighty power of wireless communications- 'Cuz, wow, you saved the day.

Also: It's sad to know that there are so many ways to put down a person (even that size- size doesn't matter) and that no one there even gave it a try. I'd have punched that fucker in the throat, let him hit the floor like the 2-ton piece of shit he obviously is.

Master_Shake · 03-01-2005, 04:53 PM

He's just a savage animal, huh?

Is it really so impossible to have seen yourself in that guy's position?

Consider you're an ex-con, so you can't get a real job anywhere. You're working for shit, and you see that fancy cell phone with a camera in it which you can't pass the credit check to get.

Your woman has been in a bad mood all day long and now she starts screaming that some guy is insulting her. You see this guy yelling at her, who may have been using racial slurs (which if you're a white guy, being called a cracker is not similar. Imagine if somebody was calling your wife a cunt. That's probably as close as you can get).

You wouldn't have stood up to somebody calling your wife a CUNT?

So he's pissed and he overreacts. Now he's going back to prison for four years. When he gets out, he's got zero chance at getting a real job in the future. What the hell else is he going to do?

bing bing · 03-01-2005, 04:56 PM

Like the people in the video, I probably wouldn't have done anything. I'm a pussy.

Coppertop · 03-01-2005, 04:57 PM

Yeah, that's an excellent way to solve life's problems. I couldn't imagine why people wouldn't hire this guy for a decent job. He's a winner for sure!

Xell101 · 03-01-2005, 05:55 PM

The sound of that man hitting the floor would express what words could not. It disgusts me that those people could just stand around so calmy, with such indifference. I've been beaten up once. With well over 40 people just watching, I had my sense of diffused responsibility kicked all the way out of my head, much in the same way as my ability to say I've never been repeatedly kicked in the ribs. Lucky for me I've got 298 lbs of muscle packed mass and the skills to back up such an attitude. I don't care what your excuse is, what he did isn't something you should not be allowed to do.

Mojo_PeiPei · 03-01-2005, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master_Shake

He's just a savage animal, huh?

Is it really so impossible to have seen yourself in that guy's position?

Consider you're an ex-con, so you can't get a real job anywhere. You're working for shit, and you see that fancy cell phone with a camera in it which you can't pass the credit check to get.

Your woman has been in a bad mood all day long and now she starts screaming that some guy is insulting her. You see this guy yelling at her, who may have been using racial slurs (which if you're a white guy, being called a cracker is not similar. Imagine if somebody was calling your wife a cunt. That's probably as close as you can get).

You wouldn't have stood up to somebody calling your wife a CUNT?

So he's pissed and he overreacts. Now he's going back to prison for four years. When he gets out, he's got zero chance at getting a real job in the future. What the hell else is he going to do?

You can't see me right now, but I'm playing the worlds smallest violin.

Boo-fucking-hoo. Don't be an apologist for these goons or their behavior. Everyone is responsible for their own actions, it's people and mentality's like yours that foster and sustain the victim mentality, it's not their fault they are criminals, get serious.

DDDDave · 03-01-2005, 06:06 PM

I see we haven't had any comments from anyone in Law Enforcement.

My wife has been a police officer for 15 years. She was a beat officer and worked her way up to Lieutentant. She has a bachelors and masters in Criminal Justice. We watched the video and discussed it.

Here is her take: Four years is a pretty stiff sentence for what is basically beating someone up. The strong sentence probably had more to do with his prior record. He could have been on probation. Just getting arrested on probation is a felony. All of that stuff leading up to the first punch is really immaterial. He said, she said. In Florida, threatening someone with the capacity to carry out the threat, is a misdemeanor. Punching someone, wherever, is a misdeameanor. Punching him again and again is a misdemeanor. Causing great bodily harm, which is defined as near life threatening injuries (which the guy did not have) is a felony. Usually the standard for GBH is disfigurement. He didn't have a weapon. He tried to lift the guy up to hit him, but he didn't stomp his face into the ground. People get in fights everyday and the guy that won doesn't usually get four years. I doesn't matter legally, but we didn't see it as a sucker punch either. He was facing him. If you're gonna get in someone's face you better be prepared for what might happen.

Re: a gun. If the guy who was getting beat up had a gun, would he have been justified in shooting the guy dead? By statute, he would have had to feel that he was going to die in order to be justified in killing someone. Obviously a jury would ultimately have to make the decision according to evidence presented but I could make a case that getting punched 5 or 6 times, when maybe you deserved it after insulting a guy, does not give you the right to shoot him. If you were one of the other customers, there is no way you could even be justified in pulling your gun in that situation.

I'll reserve the social commentary as to how our society deals with these guys but I am glad that I won't be seeing this guy in any pizza places for the next four years or so.

Cops learn how to diffuse situations like this too. I said 'what would you have done if you were there off duty?'. She said try to distract the guy. You have no legal standing in trying to break up the fight. You could get beat up just as easily. Maybe holler "Hey man, here come the cops!" . It really comes down to if you want to or not. It's not like the guy is your brother. He wasn't going to die, he was just getting his butt kicked.

flstf · 03-01-2005, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDDDave

It doesn't matter legally, but we didn't see it as a sucker punch either. He was facing him. If you're gonna get in someone's face you better be prepared for what might happen.

What I saw was the guy looking down at the floor or his cell phone and then getting sucker punched. Then when he staggered to the door he was hit from behind and dragged back in and beaten. The cell phone guy never lifted a finger to the other guy, how can you and especially a police officer call this a fight, it was a beating plain and simple.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDDDave

Cops learn how to diffuse situations like this too. I said 'what would you have done if you were there off duty?'. She said try to distract the guy. You have no legal standing in trying to break up the fight. You could get beat up just as easily. Maybe holler "Hey man, here come the cops!" . It really comes down to if you want to or not. It's not like the guy is your brother. He wasn't going to die, he was just getting his butt kicked.

I can't believe a police officer would not step in to prevent someone from getting severely beaten like this guy was. I have seen plenty of fights before and this was definately not a fight. Do you or your wife really think the cell phone guy was engaged in a fight?

jorgelito · 03-01-2005, 07:19 PM

This guy got beat up pretty badly and I think the requirements for "fearing for my life" is too subjective to be left to a jury. Shooting would definitely be justified and heroic even. The punishment is too light - we can't have people walking around beating each other up. Also, what makes people think he's not coming after you (meaning bystander or who knows) next? If he was crazy enough to attack someone who was posing no threat in the first place then who knows what he's capable of?

People need to be held accountable for their actions. We need to send a message that it is not ok to beat people up to a bloody pulp (concussion, broken eye socket) and get away with a misdemeanor and no consequences. This guy will do it again.

ziadel · 03-01-2005, 07:30 PM

yupp, another fine example of why I never leave the house (and why YOU should never leave the house) without three simple items:
Hankerchief
Pocket Knife
Firearm

heres NY's law's....
someone will have to tell me if I'd be arrested for shooting this guy...

Quote:

S 35.15 Justification; use of physical force in defense of a person.
1. A person may, subject to the provisions of subdivision two, use
physical force upon another person when and to the extent he reasonably
believes such to be necessary to defend himself or a third person from
what he reasonably believes to be the use or imminent use of unlawful
physical force by such other person, unless:
(a) The latter`s conduct was provoked by the actor himself with intent
to cause physical injury to another person; or
(b) The actor was the initial aggressor; except that in such case his
use of physical force is nevertheless justifiable if he has withdrawn
from the encounter and effectively communicated such withdrawal to such
other person but the latter persists in continuing the incident by the
use or threatened imminent use of unlawful physical force; or
(c) The physical force involved is the product of a combat by
agreement not specifically authorized by law.
2. A person may not use deadly physical force upon another person
under circumstances specified in subdivision one unless:
(a) He reasonably believes that such other person is using or about to
use deadly physical force. Even in such case, however, the actor may not
use deadly physical force if he knows that he can with complete safety
as to himself and others avoid the necessity of so doing by retreating;
except that he is under no duty to retreat if he is:
(i) in his dwelling and not the initial aggressor; or
(ii) a police officer or peace officer or a person assisting a police
officer or a peace officer at the latter`s direction, acting pursuant to
section 35.30; or
(b) He reasonably believes that such other person is committing or
attempting to commit a kidnapping, forcible rape, forcible criminal
sexual act or robbery; or
(c) He reasonably believes that such other person is committing or
attempting to commit a burglary, and the circumstances are such that the
use of deadly physical force is authorized by subdivision three of
section 35.20.

but for the record, I would have shot this guy and expected to be lavished with praise for doing it.

and DDDDave, you wife has no legal standing to try to break up the fight when she's off duty? does her department require her to carry her weapon when shes off duty? All the LEO's I know (although I will admit to not knowing any in Florida) are required to have a peice with them at all times because they are expected to act as peace officers, at all times. If they don't require her to carry a weapon when shes off-duty, then I'll agree and say yeah, ok, theres no legal standing there, but if she is required to have a weapon with her at all times, then I'm calling shenanigans....

this absolutely sickens me.

Mojo_PeiPei · 03-01-2005, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flstf

What I saw was the guy looking down at the floor or his cell phone and then getting sucker punched. Then when he staggered to the door he was hit from behind and dragged back in and beaten. The cell phone guy never lifted a finger to the other guy, how can you and especially a police officer call this a fight, it was a beating plain and simple.

Exactly, this was no where near the lines of simple battery as there was not a hint of mutual combat between the two parties, it was the thugster stealing on him plain and simple.

cj2112 · 03-01-2005, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janey

towards what end? imagine using your concealed weapon, you draw on the guy who may or may not notice in the frenzy. so youshoot. who do you hit? asshole bully or victim? even if you got Mr. Pig-ass, do you see the matter ended there? What do you think your day in court would do for you? manslaughter or assault, and a civil suit.

In addition, everybody is saying that the innaction shown was typical of similar situations by by-standers. It may be the shock of disbelief. But whatever, I doubt that carrying concealed weapons will be the answer unless you are a trained professional. I bet that by the time most people would think to draw their weapons, the same time would have passed as when (how many... zero?) people pulled out their cell phone to summon help.

The law is very clear on when it is ok to shoot, or at least here in Oregon it is. The law basically states that it is ok to shoot when a reasonable person would be in fear for his life or that of another person. I train w/ my handgun no less than 6 hours/ month, I am not going to fire at someone unless I am positive of my target, and what lies behind it. Will the matter end there? Probably not....however I will not be charged with a crime because I'm not just going to shoot at the attacker, I'm going order him to stop and inform him that I am armed, and that I am scared (which i would be). If at that point he chooses to continue his assault, or worse makes a move towards me, I then would fire my weapon striking him at my precise point of aim. This probably will not stop him immediately, and I anticipate probably having to fire 3-6 shots to stop him. After the threat to life is removed I would immediately call for help for both the victim and the attacker. Will I be sued? Probably. will I lose the suit? Possibly, but not terribly likely. I don't care for the implication that somebody legally carrying a concealed weapon (having gone through the required training and background checks) would not choose their shot carefully, or jeopardize their own freedom by participating in a criminal act (assault or manslaughter), when in fact the exact opposite is the case.

Fremen · 03-01-2005, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rdr4evr

No problem, let's give it just one more shot though. If this doesn't work, then it is definately your end

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/pizzaparlorbrawl.html

Thanks again, Rdr4evr. It's working fine now.

DDDDave · 03-01-2005, 09:00 PM

You guys need to go back and watch the video again. Then take an hour and watch it again. Try to put it in context. The guy no doubt said something racially derogative to the woman. She was pissed. Duuhh. She gets all up in the guys face and he and her are yelling at each other. When her boyfriend shows up he gets real sheepish. Uh, where's my phone? Uh. Uh. He was now in the middle of a confrontation with two pissed people whom he pissed off. What is he doing looking down at the ground or at his phone? If he was so fearing for his life why didn't he walk or run away? Could he not at any point have tried to leave? Did he put his hands up and say 'Sorry man, I didn't mean it' Looked to me like he knew what was going to happen. I counted 6 punches. Agreed, a couple were doozies. No one else in that room was fearing for their lives. No one walked or ran away or even screamed. The store manager even gets the guys attention and tells him to leave. The big guy didn't punch him or make any move towards anyone else.

All of the statutes that have been quoted put some onus on the affected person to try to get away, except if you are in your own home. Watch the video again, if you were the guy in the red shirt and pulled a gun from your waistband and shot him dead, do you honestly think that would be considered justifiable homicide? Do you know all the facts - maybe these two had a running fued - maybe they had fought before - maybe they guy who got beat up was an ex-con too- you don't know - but hey, you don't care and it doesn't matter, he's dead. You would not be a hero. You would be going to jail. The states attorney would press charges. You would stand trial. There would be people on the jury like me who would try to see both sides.

Don't get me wrong. I am certainly not defending anybodies actions here. How can you defend somebody beating someone else up. Ever see cops break up a fight between two guys with no weapons? They usually let them fight until somebody goes down on the ground and it isn't a fight anymore. It's a cruel world. It is something that the average person does not see often and is repulsed. Police officers see stuff like this all the time. They are much better judges of how things start, how they escalate and how they end than the average joe. That doesn't make them heroes either.

If she was in uniform, I doubt there would have been a fight then and there. If she was off duty- who knows what would have been done.. Anybody who says they know what they would have done is just spouting off, you just don't know till you're there.

BTW, no, she is not required to carry her gun on her person at all times.

flstf · 03-01-2005, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDDDave

You guys need to go back and watch the video again. Then take an hour and watch it again. Try to put it in context. The guy no doubt said something racially derogative to the woman. She was pissed. Duuhh. She gets all up in the guys face and he and her are yelling at each other. When her boyfriend shows up he gets real sheepish. Uh, where's my phone? Uh. Uh. He was now in the middle of a confrontation with two pissed people whom he pissed off. What is he doing looking down at the ground or at his phone? If he was so fearing for his life why didn't he walk or run away? Could he not at any point have tried to leave? Did he put his hands up and say 'Sorry man, I didn't mean it' Looked to me like he knew what was going to happen. I counted 6 punches. Agreed, a couple were doozies. No one else in that room was fearing for their lives. No one walked or ran away or even screamed. The store manager even gets the guys attention and tells him to leave. The big guy didn't punch him or make any move towards anyone else.

The cell phone guy gave an interview on the news tonight. He said he told his wife talking on the cell phone who was waiting in the car that it looks like he will be a little longer because a woman in camouflage just got in front of the line. This was apparently what made her flip out. He made no racial remarks. At the trial of the attacker the mad woman claimed he made racial remarks but witnesses and the tape proved otherwise. He said that he thought the boyfriend was pulling the mad woman away in order to calm her down and he thought that was the end of it. Then he was sucker punched and doesn't remember much else until he saw the video.

Seer666 · 03-01-2005, 10:44 PM

Yet more proof that all it takes is one bullet to make the world a better place. Stupid hoods like that should be shot and removed from the gene pool. I'm temped to add her to the list just for starting the whole mess.

SitizenVZ · 03-01-2005, 11:08 PM

What is wrong with that woman? She's as much responsible as the guy she called in. What happened to her, that's what I want to know.

Mojo_PeiPei · 03-01-2005, 11:10 PM

She'll probably end up getting a few months in jail on a few counts of assault, though the heifer deserves more.

ziadel · 03-01-2005, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDDDave

Anybody who says they know what they would have done is just spouting off, you just don't know till you're there.

your prolly right about that for most people...
mebbe its even true for me, but I practice diligently with my weapon, my presentation is a reflex at this point.... but your right, until you're there you really dont know what will happen....

as for everyone else not fearing for their lives, I would be afraid, if I was there for the whole thing, because the cell phone guy did'nt do anything that warranted getting beat like that, so as he was getting beat I would be wondering who that guy would go after next, and I'd be worried it would be me because he doesn't need a reason, and this appears to be racially motivated on his part (they commented, right? correct me if I am wrong please) so DDDDave, how do you figure I would'nt fear for my life or at least my well being?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDDDave

He was now in the middle of a confrontation with two pissed people whom he pissed off. What is he doing looking down at the ground or at his phone? If he was so fearing for his life why didn't he walk or run away?

Looking down at the phone? do you happen to have a cat and a dog, I do, my cat beats the crap out of the dog, and he (the dog) is afraid of her (the cat), so when the cat struts up to him, he doesn't look at her, because to animals eye-contact is a sort of challenge, its the same things with us humans, looking someone right in the eyes can be interpreted as aggression.
as for running away, hes in a tiny ass pizza parlor, the guy was right outside the door and I dunno about you, but if I smell trouble the LAST thing I wanna do is turn my back to it, thats a good way to get slammed in the back of the head....

flstf · 03-02-2005, 12:56 AM

It looks like releasing the video to the news media has caused the Akron prosecutors to take back their plea agreement and go for more jail time for the mad woman.

Beacon Journal
Woman says she's served her jail time
Accused pizza shop agitator says trial shouldn't follow plea bargain
By Phil Trexler
Beacon Journal staff writer

The Akron woman who prosecutors say triggered an ugly videotaped beating at a downtown pizza shop says she is sorry but doesn't deserve any more jail time.

Prestina Sims, 31, met with reporters Friday, a week after a judge released the videotape that helped to convict her boyfriend of felonious assault and propel local debate on social conduct.

In the tape, Sims is seen entering DaVinci's Pizza on South Main Street last July. She soon confronts a customer who complained she was cutting to the front of the line. Sims spat on a store manager who tried to throw her out and then pointed to the customer and ordered her boyfriend, Mark Jones of Akron, to ``take care of this white mother (expletive).''

Jones, who is 6-foot-4 and weighs 320 pounds, pummeled the customer, Joseph Scarpino, 28, drilling him with seven unanswered blows to the head as a lobby full of customers looked on in shock.

Scarpino, 6-foot-2 and 220 pounds, suffered a broken nose, a chipped tooth and a concussion. Jones, 35, was sentenced to four years in prison after his conviction last week in Summit County Common Pleas Court.

Sims, a mother of five, told reporters she is sorry about the incident and wishes the case would go away. She denied making the racist remark about Scarpino, although her words are clearly captured on the videotape.

She also said she felt the matter was put behind her last August when she agreed to a plea bargain with Akron city prosecutors. Sims agreed to serve six months in jail after pleading guilty to misdemeanor assault, disorderly conduct and criminal trespassing.

In October, however, county prosecutors brought a felonious assault indictment against her. She is scheduled for trial March 14 and faces two to eight years in prison, if convicted.

Prosecutors are expected to argue that in essence, Sims used Jones as a deadly weapon in order to cause serious physical harm to Scarpino.

``I would like to apologize... to Joseph. I didn't expect that to happen,'' she said. ``Every day I think about this incident. It hurts me and I know it affected (Scarpino).''

Scarpino could not be reached for comment.

Sims' attorney, Walter Madison of Akron, would not allow her to comment on what is seen in the videotaped beating.

Madison filed a motion Thursday asking Judge Brenda Burnham Unruh to dismiss Sims' case, citing the previous plea and claiming the new charges violate double jeopardy protections.

A similar motion filed by Sims' former attorney was denied Feb. 2, when Unruh agreed with prosecutors and ruled the plea deal with city attorneys does not prevent county prosecutors from bringing felony charges.

Madison said if the county officials were acting in good faith, they would have commuted Sims' sentence when the indictment was first brought, months before she finished serving six months in jail.

``What we have here is a person who had accepted responsibility now finding herself facing punishment a second time,'' Madison said. ``What I'm doing now, I'm asking the court to dismiss it because of constitutional issues that the state has acted in bad faith. We believe a case brought with an evil eye should not see its day in court. Ultimately, a deal is a deal.''

The tape has been played repeatedly on local and national TV, but Sims said she has not watched it. She said she can't change public opinion that blames her for the attack.

``I'm living this day by day. I do wish it would go away. I wish I could have my life back,'' she said. ``It's a scary feeling that my freedom is still in jeopardy.''

Rdr4evr · 03-02-2005, 01:16 AM

I feel sorry for their five children who have to be raised by these two lunatics. Talk about irresponsible selfish immature fools. They should permanently have their children taken away from them and given to a caring and responsible family who wouldn't jeopardize and traumatize them and their well-being.

So are hate charges going to be applied as well ("take care of this white mother fucker'')? If not, which I'm sure will be the case, it shows the double standard and how ass backwards the system actually is.

"I would like to apologize... to Joseph. I didn't expect that to happen,'' she said. "Every day I think about this incident. It hurts me and I know it affected (Scarpino).''

Oh, I feel just awful for her! She must be suffering severe anxiety with that on her conscience. Sorry bitch, you should have thought about that before you and your neanderthal boyfriend decided to beat someone senseless.

I hope she serves the maximum penalty possible; they are a hazard to society and shouldn’t be given sympathetic consideration.

whocarz · 03-02-2005, 03:11 AM

DDDDave, I have to thank you for further reinforcing for me that I shouldn't turn to the police for protection. Your statements and the Supreme Court ruling have ensured that a loaded rifle sits next to my bed when I sleep. If I were in that situation, and I were carrying, I would have shot that guy if he didn't stop after I told him. They can take their laws and shove them up their collective ass.

And I have to say, you and your wife's assesment of the video scares me. You just assume the guy said some racist remarks. Then you think he could have "retreated" out a crowded and cluttered store when the only likely escape route was blocked off by a three hundred pound guy who was shortly punching him in the head. The guy TRIED to escape, but got dragged back and beaten down some more. Have you ever been punched in the head? It is pretty fucking disorienting, I have to say. If you get punched hard enough, and you aren't expecting it, which this guy didn't seem to be, you won't be able to do anything as complicated as running away. Maybe stagger around a little then fall down.

There was no fight, all I saw was battery. The guy never even attempted to fight, he just got his head punched. Once he was on the ground, the big guy should have walked away. But he kept up his assault. Could you, at that moment, say you knew that he wouldn't continue the beating until the other man was dead? No, you can't. To me that would be a perfectly good reason to produce a weapon and tell that ape to stop. Anyway, you believe what you want.

DDDDave · 03-02-2005, 06:04 AM

I'm just posing another side to the story.

Everyone here has said 'Throw those fuckers in jail for the rest of their lives'. I am saying that is just not realistic, and not appropriate. How many others have said ' Shoot him dead on the spot' Really? I am glad none of you have guns.

The crime he committed was an assault. It was an ugly incident, no doubt. Question for all of you gun toters out there. You see a fight in the parking lot of your local Wal-Mart. Two yahoos are going at it and one guy is getting beat down. Do you pull out your gun and shoot dead the guy who is winning the fight? Why not? Who is right, who is wrong. What are they fighting about. What business is it of yours. Do you pull your gun and say 'Stop it or I'll shoot'. Yeah, right. That shit is for the movies. You do not pull your gun to threaten someone, you pull your gun to use it. The law everywhere in this country is your life must be in immediate danger to justify using deadly force. Want to keep a rifle on your nightstand, fine. Say a 20 y.o. black kid rings your doorbell at midnight and asks to use the phone. You open the door and the kid says give me all your money. Can you shoot him dead? No. Why didn't you just shut the door? Why did you open the door in the first place? Was your life in immediate danger. That is the standard that must be met. Most people are not aware of that and thankfully most of us will never be placed in that situation.

Ask any cop how often they pull their gun. Most will say they never have. Their life or someone else's must be in immediate danger. Two guys fighting in a pizza parlor does not fit that criteria.

Yes, I have gotten punched in the head. It is completely disorienting and it is difficult if not impossible to stand back up and fight. I am not arguing that. You're 'eyes' comment is appropriate too. If you are going to get up in the chicks face and argue with her you better be prepared to look her boyfriend in the eye when he arrives. If I think he might hit me, I'm not going to look away and give him the chance to blind side me. The guy was 28, 6'2 225. Not some scrawny little kid or feeble old man. Why didn't he just fall to the ground and stay there? He just kind of bends over and continues to get hit. Whatever happened to falling to the ground and covering up? I am not defending anyone's actions here. It's all monday morning quarterbacking now.

I think it leads to a very passionate discussion and makes everyone consider things that they deem unpleasant. But passionate discussion and considering different opinions is good for everyone

IC3 · 03-02-2005, 06:39 AM

This thread's got alot of attention. Thier's no doubt that this dude got sucker punched, He was lookin down at his cell, But if i had a big ass dude standing infront of me..Last thing i would be doing is looking down...Sorry, But when your being confronted and you look down..That's not a wise move.

Some of you think 4 years is not enough for this? I think 4 years is alittle much, People get thier asses beat everyday..Yes, even the same way this guy did. If everybody who kicked some ass got a sentence like this, I don't think we could build enough prisons to hold them.

It's wierd how the victim took the time to get in the womans face and then when the guy pulled her back and stepped up to the victim, He took his attention off of the big guy..Like i said, If i had somebody like that step to me that was obviously pissed..My full attention would be on any little movement his shoulders made.

It was a bad situation, If i was there i wouldn't do anything either unless i had something to smack the guy with.

I also noticed he only punched him when he was standing, when he fell to the ground he tried to get him back up then dropped him back to the floor..Believe it or not, That may have been something looked at in the court room.

I agree with dddave that the 4 year sentence most likely had to do with his past criminal record..If this guy had a clean record..I highly doubt he would have gotten any time..Or very minimal.

canuckguy · 03-02-2005, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master_Shake

You wouldn't have stood up to somebody calling your wife a CUNT?

Sorry to pull just this sentence but to answer it no i would not. If I was to say be walking into a store, and a guy was walking out the door at the same time, and he and my wife happened to run into each other and he calls my wife a cunt. I might say something to the guy, like just a simple fuck off, and kept walking, but I would not have stood up to him. I assume by standing up to him you mean get up in his face and escalate the issue.
When i hit adulthood I quickly came to realize that there are consequences for my actions. If i get all up in the dudes face and we end up slugging it out, it proofs what? my wife is not a cunt? i am a man for defending her "honor" from a total stranger we'll never see again?
No it would prove I am probably just as retarded as the guy shouting the insult, and i might be going to jail, possibly losing my job and my lovely home....having my kids ask "were's daddy". I don't think I could be married to a woman who would want me to defend her good name in his fashion. And who is that senstive. Seems very 4th grade to me.
I get more pleasure knowing that i am ahead, than seeing a scoreboard reflect it.

remember, "sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me"

dksuddeth · 03-02-2005, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master_Shake

He's just a savage animal, huh?

Is it really so impossible to have seen yourself in that guy's position?

Consider you're an ex-con, so you can't get a real job anywhere. You're working for shit, and you see that fancy cell phone with a camera in it which you can't pass the credit check to get.

Your woman has been in a bad mood all day long and now she starts screaming that some guy is insulting her. You see this guy yelling at her, who may have been using racial slurs (which if you're a white guy, being called a cracker is not similar. Imagine if somebody was calling your wife a cunt. That's probably as close as you can get).

You wouldn't have stood up to somebody calling your wife a CUNT?

So he's pissed and he overreacts. Now he's going back to prison for four years. When he gets out, he's got zero chance at getting a real job in the future. What the hell else is he going to do?

You can't possibly be serious with this, can you?

Mojo_PeiPei · 03-02-2005, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IC3

This thread's got alot of attention. Thier's no doubt that this dude got sucker punched, He was lookin down at his cell, But if i had a big ass dude standing infront of me..Last thing i would be doing is looking down...Sorry, But when your being confronted and you look down..That's not a wise move.

Some of you think 4 years is not enough for this? I think 4 years is alittle much, People get thier asses beat everyday..Yes, even the same way this guy did. If everybody who kicked some ass got a sentence like this, I don't think we could build enough prisons to hold them.

It's wierd how the victim took the time to get in the womans face and then when the guy pulled her back and stepped up to the victim, He took his attention off of the big guy..Like i said, If i had somebody like that step to me that was obviously pissed..My full attention would be on any little movement his shoulders made.

It was a bad situation, If i was there i wouldn't do anything either unless i had something to smack the guy with.

I also noticed he only punched him when he was standing, when he fell to the ground he tried to get him back up then dropped him back to the floor..Believe it or not, That may have been something looked at in the court room.

I agree with dddave that the 4 year sentence most likely had to do with his past criminal record..If this guy had a clean record..I highly doubt he would have gotten any time..Or very minimal.

You doubt he would've gotten time? Notice how he got convicted of "felonious assault" and not misdamenor battery or something weak like that. The white guy might've been stupid for not better helping his own situation, but he did nothing to provoke those animals, and legally speaking calling someone a racial slur isn't adaquate grounds for provocation. The guy would have for sure done time in jail, not just because of his past record, I think the fact that there was a videotape helped a lot in sentencing, wish it could've done more.

dksuddeth · 03-02-2005, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDDDave

If you're gonna get in someone's face you better be prepared for what might happen.

Re: a gun. If the guy who was getting beat up had a gun, would he have been justified in shooting the guy dead? By statute, he would have had to feel that he was going to die in order to be justified in killing someone. Obviously a jury would ultimately have to make the decision according to evidence presented but I could make a case that getting punched 5 or 6 times, when maybe you deserved it after insulting a guy, does not give you the right to shoot him. If you were one of the other customers, there is no way you could even be justified in pulling your gun in that situation.

I'll reserve the social commentary as to how our society deals with these guys but I am glad that I won't be seeing this guy in any pizza places for the next four years or so.

Cops learn how to diffuse situations like this too. I said 'what would you have done if you were there off duty?'. She said try to distract the guy. You have no legal standing in trying to break up the fight. You could get beat up just as easily. Maybe holler "Hey man, here come the cops!" . It really comes down to if you want to or not. It's not like the guy is your brother. He wasn't going to die, he was just getting his butt kicked.

feeling whether or not your life, physical safety, or great bodily harm is strictly in the eye of the beholder. Were it me, after the second punch, the moron would have to worry about plugging holes in his body. I don't care what kind of verbal insults get thrown around, its absolutely no reason to beat ANYONE to a bloody pulp.

dksuddeth · 03-02-2005, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDDDave

I'm just posing another side to the story.

Everyone here has said 'Throw those fuckers in jail for the rest of their lives'. I am saying that is just not realistic, and not appropriate. How many others have said ' Shoot him dead on the spot' Really? I am glad none of you have guns.

The crime he committed was an assault. It was an ugly incident, no doubt. Question for all of you gun toters out there. You see a fight in the parking lot of your local Wal-Mart. Two yahoos are going at it and one guy is getting beat down. Do you pull out your gun and shoot dead the guy who is winning the fight? Why not? Who is right, who is wrong. What are they fighting about. What business is it of yours. Do you pull your gun and say 'Stop it or I'll shoot'. Yeah, right. That shit is for the movies. You do not pull your gun to threaten someone, you pull your gun to use it. The law everywhere in this country is your life must be in immediate danger to justify using deadly force. Want to keep a rifle on your nightstand, fine. Say a 20 y.o. black kid rings your doorbell at midnight and asks to use the phone. You open the door and the kid says give me all your money. Can you shoot him dead? No. Why didn't you just shut the door? Why did you open the door in the first place? Was your life in immediate danger. That is the standard that must be met. Most people are not aware of that and thankfully most of us will never be placed in that situation.

In the hypothetical situation you are asking about, if MY life is not in immediate danger and I can stand far enough away that if I need to shoot him I can, yes, you pull your weapon and tell the guy to back off. If the guy thats winning is still pounding the guy thats on the ground, major damage, even death, can happen. THATS what you're stopping. If the guy refuses to stop then you shoot him. IF you're good enough, you shoot him in the ass. If you're not, by statute you would be justified in saving what you would consider an impending death.

Dostoevsky · 03-02-2005, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincentt

I hope he wins in cival suits... he should go after the pizza place too... how long did they wait to call the police?

This just pisses me off.

I'm thinking the perp doesn't have too many assets for the victim to go after. What do you think? His best bet at being compensated is going after the pizza place, which, depending on whether its response to the crime is viewed as justifiable, may or may not be on the hook financially.

ziadel · 03-02-2005, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDDDave

How many others have said ' Shoot him dead on the spot' Really? I am glad none of you have guns.

The crime he committed was an assault. It was an ugly incident, no doubt. Question for all of you gun toters out there. You see a fight in the parking lot of your local Wal-Mart. Two yahoos are going at it and one guy is getting beat down. Do you pull out your gun and shoot dead the guy who is winning the fight? Why not? Who is right, who is wrong. What are they fighting about. What business is it of yours. Do you pull your gun and say 'Stop it or I'll shoot'. Yeah, right. That shit is for the movies. You do not pull your gun to threaten someone, you pull your gun to use it. The law everywhere in this country is your life must be in immediate danger to justify using deadly force.

First off, I said shoot him and I have a gun. I have many guns. I always have a gun on my person. See my public profile.

As for the deadly force thing, laws vary GREATLY from state to state. In Texas it's legal to shoot someone for kicking your dog (mebbe thats a stretch, but the point is in Texas it's legal to use deadly force to defend your property.) From what I have gathered (and I'm certainly no lawyer) from NY law is you can use deadly force to defend another person from harm. It's all really up to circumstances and ultimately up to the grand jury, from what I have been told ALL deadly force self defense scenarios go before a grand jury...

analog · 03-02-2005, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master_Shake

*snip*
You wouldn't have stood up to somebody calling your wife a CUNT?
*snip*

1. Boo-fucking-hoo for him. We all make choices in our lives. He made his in the past, that's why he spent time in jail. He made his on that day, and again it only proves his psychological imbalances and incompatibility with society.
2. There is a giant difference between "standing up to" and "going fucking insane and beating the living shit out of" someone.

drakers · 03-02-2005, 01:16 PM

That video is really disturbing to watch, how the hell are you supposed to defend yourself when the guy is 2 1/2 times bigger than you. I can tell why he didn't even try to hit the guy back, besides the fact he was probably almost unconsious after the first blow, because the guy would have probably kicked his ass even more.

kel · 03-02-2005, 01:19 PM

....................

Blackthorn · 03-02-2005, 01:32 PM

My first thought was I don't know how many times I call people out for being overtly rude -- line cutting and such. I'm not in bad shape for my age but even at that -- that guy was HUGE and totally not present when cell-man makes his comment. Ouuuuch....are you supposed to just let rudeness go unchecked? After all the freeway shootings I rarely flip someone off anymore for being a goombah behind the wheel. You just never know how unbalanced someone really is....very sad.

03-01-2005, 02:37 PM	#83 (permalink)
reiii unstuck in time Location: Nashville/D.C.	I would have stood there I think, my courage isnt impulsive enough to manifest in such a fast and spontaneous situation like that parlor. It might depend on my mood, but who isnt scared of violent 350 pound ex cons? I do think I would have rushed to the guys aid once the dude left the restraunt.... __________________ "Jombe? The chocolate icing" -hedonism bot

03-01-2005, 04:53 PM	#87 (permalink)
Master_Shake Addict Location: Pennsylvania, USA	He's just a savage animal, huh? Is it really so impossible to have seen yourself in that guy's position? Consider you're an ex-con, so you can't get a real job anywhere. You're working for shit, and you see that fancy cell phone with a camera in it which you can't pass the credit check to get. Your woman has been in a bad mood all day long and now she starts screaming that some guy is insulting her. You see this guy yelling at her, who may have been using racial slurs (which if you're a white guy, being called a cracker is not similar. Imagine if somebody was calling your wife a cunt. That's probably as close as you can get). You wouldn't have stood up to somebody calling your wife a CUNT? So he's pissed and he overreacts. Now he's going back to prison for four years. When he gets out, he's got zero chance at getting a real job in the future. What the hell else is he going to do? __________________ ------------- You know something, I don't think the sun even... exists... in this place. 'Cause I've been up for hours, and hours, and hours, and the night never ends here.

03-01-2005, 05:55 PM	#90 (permalink)
Xell101 Junkie	The sound of that man hitting the floor would express what words could not. It disgusts me that those people could just stand around so calmy, with such indifference. I've been beaten up once. With well over 40 people just watching, I had my sense of diffused responsibility kicked all the way out of my head, much in the same way as my ability to say I've never been repeatedly kicked in the ribs. Lucky for me I've got 298 lbs of muscle packed mass and the skills to back up such an attitude. I don't care what your excuse is, what he did isn't something you should not be allowed to do. Last edited by Xell101; 03-01-2005 at 06:13 PM..

03-01-2005, 06:06 PM	#92 (permalink)
DDDDave Addict Location: Sarasota	I see we haven't had any comments from anyone in Law Enforcement. My wife has been a police officer for 15 years. She was a beat officer and worked her way up to Lieutentant. She has a bachelors and masters in Criminal Justice. We watched the video and discussed it. Here is her take: Four years is a pretty stiff sentence for what is basically beating someone up. The strong sentence probably had more to do with his prior record. He could have been on probation. Just getting arrested on probation is a felony. All of that stuff leading up to the first punch is really immaterial. He said, she said. In Florida, threatening someone with the capacity to carry out the threat, is a misdemeanor. Punching someone, wherever, is a misdeameanor. Punching him again and again is a misdemeanor. Causing great bodily harm, which is defined as near life threatening injuries (which the guy did not have) is a felony. Usually the standard for GBH is disfigurement. He didn't have a weapon. He tried to lift the guy up to hit him, but he didn't stomp his face into the ground. People get in fights everyday and the guy that won doesn't usually get four years. I doesn't matter legally, but we didn't see it as a sucker punch either. He was facing him. If you're gonna get in someone's face you better be prepared for what might happen. Re: a gun. If the guy who was getting beat up had a gun, would he have been justified in shooting the guy dead? By statute, he would have had to feel that he was going to die in order to be justified in killing someone. Obviously a jury would ultimately have to make the decision according to evidence presented but I could make a case that getting punched 5 or 6 times, when maybe you deserved it after insulting a guy, does not give you the right to shoot him. If you were one of the other customers, there is no way you could even be justified in pulling your gun in that situation. I'll reserve the social commentary as to how our society deals with these guys but I am glad that I won't be seeing this guy in any pizza places for the next four years or so. Cops learn how to diffuse situations like this too. I said 'what would you have done if you were there off duty?'. She said try to distract the guy. You have no legal standing in trying to break up the fight. You could get beat up just as easily. Maybe holler "Hey man, here come the cops!" . It really comes down to if you want to or not. It's not like the guy is your brother. He wasn't going to die, he was just getting his butt kicked. __________________ I am just a simple man trying to make my way in the universe... "Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you have imagined." - Thoreau "Nothing great was ever accomplished without enthusiasm" - Emerson

03-01-2005, 09:00 PM	#99 (permalink)
DDDDave Addict Location: Sarasota	You guys need to go back and watch the video again. Then take an hour and watch it again. Try to put it in context. The guy no doubt said something racially derogative to the woman. She was pissed. Duuhh. She gets all up in the guys face and he and her are yelling at each other. When her boyfriend shows up he gets real sheepish. Uh, where's my phone? Uh. Uh. He was now in the middle of a confrontation with two pissed people whom he pissed off. What is he doing looking down at the ground or at his phone? If he was so fearing for his life why didn't he walk or run away? Could he not at any point have tried to leave? Did he put his hands up and say 'Sorry man, I didn't mean it' Looked to me like he knew what was going to happen. I counted 6 punches. Agreed, a couple were doozies. No one else in that room was fearing for their lives. No one walked or ran away or even screamed. The store manager even gets the guys attention and tells him to leave. The big guy didn't punch him or make any move towards anyone else. All of the statutes that have been quoted put some onus on the affected person to try to get away, except if you are in your own home. Watch the video again, if you were the guy in the red shirt and pulled a gun from your waistband and shot him dead, do you honestly think that would be considered justifiable homicide? Do you know all the facts - maybe these two had a running fued - maybe they had fought before - maybe they guy who got beat up was an ex-con too- you don't know - but hey, you don't care and it doesn't matter, he's dead. You would not be a hero. You would be going to jail. The states attorney would press charges. You would stand trial. There would be people on the jury like me who would try to see both sides. Don't get me wrong. I am certainly not defending anybodies actions here. How can you defend somebody beating someone else up. Ever see cops break up a fight between two guys with no weapons? They usually let them fight until somebody goes down on the ground and it isn't a fight anymore. It's a cruel world. It is something that the average person does not see often and is repulsed. Police officers see stuff like this all the time. They are much better judges of how things start, how they escalate and how they end than the average joe. That doesn't make them heroes either. If she was in uniform, I doubt there would have been a fight then and there. If she was off duty- who knows what would have been done.. Anybody who says they know what they would have done is just spouting off, you just don't know till you're there. BTW, no, she is not required to carry her gun on her person at all times. __________________ I am just a simple man trying to make my way in the universe... "Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you have imagined." - Thoreau "Nothing great was ever accomplished without enthusiasm" - Emerson

03-01-2005, 02:20 PM	#82 (permalink)
Janey Junkie Location: Toronto	If you are the third party in (i.e. one of the by-standers, who failed to pull out and arm their cell phones by the way), it's hardly a case for self defense. It's at best a good samaritan application... which may be on the gray side, open to interpretation, AND civil suits.

03-01-2005, 04:56 PM	#88 (permalink)
bing bing Addict Location: Melbourne, Australia	Like the people in the video, I probably wouldn't have done anything. I'm a pussy.

03-01-2005, 04:57 PM	#89 (permalink)
Coppertop Getting Medieval on your ass Location: 13th century Europe	Yeah, that's an excellent way to solve life's problems. I couldn't imagine why people wouldn't hire this guy for a decent job. He's a winner for sure!

03-01-2005, 07:19 PM	#94 (permalink)
jorgelito All important elusive independent swing voter... Location: People's Republic of KKKalifornia	This guy got beat up pretty badly and I think the requirements for "fearing for my life" is too subjective to be left to a jury. Shooting would definitely be justified and heroic even. The punishment is too light - we can't have people walking around beating each other up. Also, what makes people think he's not coming after you (meaning bystander or who knows) next? If he was crazy enough to attack someone who was posing no threat in the first place then who knows what he's capable of? People need to be held accountable for their actions. We need to send a message that it is not ok to beat people up to a bloody pulp (concussion, broken eye socket) and get away with a misdemeanor and no consequences. This guy will do it again.

03-01-2005, 10:44 PM	#101 (permalink)
Seer666 Oh dear God he breeded Location: Arizona	Yet more proof that all it takes is one bullet to make the world a better place. Stupid hoods like that should be shot and removed from the gene pool. I'm temped to add her to the list just for starting the whole mess. __________________ Bad spellers of the world untie!!! I am the one you warned me of I seem to have misplaced the bullet with your name on it, but I have a whole box addressed to occupant.

03-01-2005, 11:08 PM	#102 (permalink)
SitizenVZ Tilted	What is wrong with that woman? She's as much responsible as the guy she called in. What happened to her, that's what I want to know.

03-01-2005, 11:10 PM	#103 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	She'll probably end up getting a few months in jail on a few counts of assault, though the heifer deserves more. __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition.

03-02-2005, 12:56 AM	#105 (permalink)
flstf Easy Rider Location: Moscow on the Ohio	It looks like releasing the video to the news media has caused the Akron prosecutors to take back their plea agreement and go for more jail time for the mad woman. Beacon Journal Woman says she's served her jail time Accused pizza shop agitator says trial shouldn't follow plea bargain By Phil Trexler Beacon Journal staff writer The Akron woman who prosecutors say triggered an ugly videotaped beating at a downtown pizza shop says she is sorry but doesn't deserve any more jail time. Prestina Sims, 31, met with reporters Friday, a week after a judge released the videotape that helped to convict her boyfriend of felonious assault and propel local debate on social conduct. In the tape, Sims is seen entering DaVinci's Pizza on South Main Street last July. She soon confronts a customer who complained she was cutting to the front of the line. Sims spat on a store manager who tried to throw her out and then pointed to the customer and ordered her boyfriend, Mark Jones of Akron, to ``take care of this white mother (expletive).'' Jones, who is 6-foot-4 and weighs 320 pounds, pummeled the customer, Joseph Scarpino, 28, drilling him with seven unanswered blows to the head as a lobby full of customers looked on in shock. Scarpino, 6-foot-2 and 220 pounds, suffered a broken nose, a chipped tooth and a concussion. Jones, 35, was sentenced to four years in prison after his conviction last week in Summit County Common Pleas Court. Sims, a mother of five, told reporters she is sorry about the incident and wishes the case would go away. She denied making the racist remark about Scarpino, although her words are clearly captured on the videotape. She also said she felt the matter was put behind her last August when she agreed to a plea bargain with Akron city prosecutors. Sims agreed to serve six months in jail after pleading guilty to misdemeanor assault, disorderly conduct and criminal trespassing. In October, however, county prosecutors brought a felonious assault indictment against her. She is scheduled for trial March 14 and faces two to eight years in prison, if convicted. Prosecutors are expected to argue that in essence, Sims used Jones as a deadly weapon in order to cause serious physical harm to Scarpino. ``I would like to apologize... to Joseph. I didn't expect that to happen,'' she said. ``Every day I think about this incident. It hurts me and I know it affected (Scarpino).'' Scarpino could not be reached for comment. Sims' attorney, Walter Madison of Akron, would not allow her to comment on what is seen in the videotaped beating. Madison filed a motion Thursday asking Judge Brenda Burnham Unruh to dismiss Sims' case, citing the previous plea and claiming the new charges violate double jeopardy protections. A similar motion filed by Sims' former attorney was denied Feb. 2, when Unruh agreed with prosecutors and ruled the plea deal with city attorneys does not prevent county prosecutors from bringing felony charges. Madison said if the county officials were acting in good faith, they would have commuted Sims' sentence when the indictment was first brought, months before she finished serving six months in jail. ``What we have here is a person who had accepted responsibility now finding herself facing punishment a second time,'' Madison said. ``What I'm doing now, I'm asking the court to dismiss it because of constitutional issues that the state has acted in bad faith. We believe a case brought with an evil eye should not see its day in court. Ultimately, a deal is a deal.'' The tape has been played repeatedly on local and national TV, but Sims said she has not watched it. She said she can't change public opinion that blames her for the attack. ``I'm living this day by day. I do wish it would go away. I wish I could have my life back,'' she said. ``It's a scary feeling that my freedom is still in jeopardy.''

03-02-2005, 01:16 AM	#106 (permalink)
Rdr4evr Banned	I feel sorry for their five children who have to be raised by these two lunatics. Talk about irresponsible selfish immature fools. They should permanently have their children taken away from them and given to a caring and responsible family who wouldn't jeopardize and traumatize them and their well-being. So are hate charges going to be applied as well ("take care of this white mother fucker'')? If not, which I'm sure will be the case, it shows the double standard and how ass backwards the system actually is. "I would like to apologize... to Joseph. I didn't expect that to happen,'' she said. "Every day I think about this incident. It hurts me and I know it affected (Scarpino).'' Oh, I feel just awful for her! She must be suffering severe anxiety with that on her conscience. Sorry bitch, you should have thought about that before you and your neanderthal boyfriend decided to beat someone senseless. I hope she serves the maximum penalty possible; they are a hazard to society and shouldn’t be given sympathetic consideration. Last edited by Rdr4evr; 03-02-2005 at 01:20 AM..

03-02-2005, 03:11 AM	#107 (permalink)
whocarz Jarhead Location: Colorado	DDDDave, I have to thank you for further reinforcing for me that I shouldn't turn to the police for protection. Your statements and the Supreme Court ruling have ensured that a loaded rifle sits next to my bed when I sleep. If I were in that situation, and I were carrying, I would have shot that guy if he didn't stop after I told him. They can take their laws and shove them up their collective ass. And I have to say, you and your wife's assesment of the video scares me. You just assume the guy said some racist remarks. Then you think he could have "retreated" out a crowded and cluttered store when the only likely escape route was blocked off by a three hundred pound guy who was shortly punching him in the head. The guy TRIED to escape, but got dragged back and beaten down some more. Have you ever been punched in the head? It is pretty fucking disorienting, I have to say. If you get punched hard enough, and you aren't expecting it, which this guy didn't seem to be, you won't be able to do anything as complicated as running away. Maybe stagger around a little then fall down. There was no fight, all I saw was battery. The guy never even attempted to fight, he just got his head punched. Once he was on the ground, the big guy should have walked away. But he kept up his assault. Could you, at that moment, say you knew that he wouldn't continue the beating until the other man was dead? No, you can't. To me that would be a perfectly good reason to produce a weapon and tell that ape to stop. Anyway, you believe what you want. __________________ If there exists anything mightier than destiny, then it is the courage to face destiny unflinchingly. -Geibel Despise not death, but welcome it, for nature wills it like all else. -Marcus Aurelius Come on, you sons of bitches! Do you want to live forever? -GySgt. Daniel J. "Dan" Daly

03-02-2005, 06:04 AM	#108 (permalink)
DDDDave Addict Location: Sarasota	I'm just posing another side to the story. Everyone here has said 'Throw those fuckers in jail for the rest of their lives'. I am saying that is just not realistic, and not appropriate. How many others have said ' Shoot him dead on the spot' Really? I am glad none of you have guns. The crime he committed was an assault. It was an ugly incident, no doubt. Question for all of you gun toters out there. You see a fight in the parking lot of your local Wal-Mart. Two yahoos are going at it and one guy is getting beat down. Do you pull out your gun and shoot dead the guy who is winning the fight? Why not? Who is right, who is wrong. What are they fighting about. What business is it of yours. Do you pull your gun and say 'Stop it or I'll shoot'. Yeah, right. That shit is for the movies. You do not pull your gun to threaten someone, you pull your gun to use it. The law everywhere in this country is your life must be in immediate danger to justify using deadly force. Want to keep a rifle on your nightstand, fine. Say a 20 y.o. black kid rings your doorbell at midnight and asks to use the phone. You open the door and the kid says give me all your money. Can you shoot him dead? No. Why didn't you just shut the door? Why did you open the door in the first place? Was your life in immediate danger. That is the standard that must be met. Most people are not aware of that and thankfully most of us will never be placed in that situation. Ask any cop how often they pull their gun. Most will say they never have. Their life or someone else's must be in immediate danger. Two guys fighting in a pizza parlor does not fit that criteria. Yes, I have gotten punched in the head. It is completely disorienting and it is difficult if not impossible to stand back up and fight. I am not arguing that. You're 'eyes' comment is appropriate too. If you are going to get up in the chicks face and argue with her you better be prepared to look her boyfriend in the eye when he arrives. If I think he might hit me, I'm not going to look away and give him the chance to blind side me. The guy was 28, 6'2 225. Not some scrawny little kid or feeble old man. Why didn't he just fall to the ground and stay there? He just kind of bends over and continues to get hit. Whatever happened to falling to the ground and covering up? I am not defending anyone's actions here. It's all monday morning quarterbacking now. I think it leads to a very passionate discussion and makes everyone consider things that they deem unpleasant. But passionate discussion and considering different opinions is good for everyone __________________ I am just a simple man trying to make my way in the universe... "Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you have imagined." - Thoreau "Nothing great was ever accomplished without enthusiasm" - Emerson

03-02-2005, 06:39 AM	#109 (permalink)
IC3 Poison Location: Canada	This thread's got alot of attention. Thier's no doubt that this dude got sucker punched, He was lookin down at his cell, But if i had a big ass dude standing infront of me..Last thing i would be doing is looking down...Sorry, But when your being confronted and you look down..That's not a wise move. Some of you think 4 years is not enough for this? I think 4 years is alittle much, People get thier asses beat everyday..Yes, even the same way this guy did. If everybody who kicked some ass got a sentence like this, I don't think we could build enough prisons to hold them. It's wierd how the victim took the time to get in the womans face and then when the guy pulled her back and stepped up to the victim, He took his attention off of the big guy..Like i said, If i had somebody like that step to me that was obviously pissed..My full attention would be on any little movement his shoulders made. It was a bad situation, If i was there i wouldn't do anything either unless i had something to smack the guy with. I also noticed he only punched him when he was standing, when he fell to the ground he tried to get him back up then dropped him back to the floor..Believe it or not, That may have been something looked at in the court room. I agree with dddave that the 4 year sentence most likely had to do with his past criminal record..If this guy had a clean record..I highly doubt he would have gotten any time..Or very minimal. __________________ "To win any battle, you must fight as if you were already dead" -Musashi

03-02-2005, 01:16 PM	#118 (permalink)
drakers Psycho Location: IOWA	That video is really disturbing to watch, how the hell are you supposed to defend yourself when the guy is 2 1/2 times bigger than you. I can tell why he didn't even try to hit the guy back, besides the fact he was probably almost unconsious after the first blow, because the guy would have probably kicked his ass even more. __________________ Friends don't shake hands, friends 'gotta HUG!

03-02-2005, 01:19 PM	#119 (permalink)
kel WARNING: FLAMMABLE Location: Ask Acetylene	.................... __________________ "It better be funny" Last edited by kel; 03-02-2005 at 07:17 PM.. Reason: This discussion is to emotional for me and I don't think my content is appropriate for this forum in its current form

03-02-2005, 01:32 PM	#120 (permalink)
Blackthorn Beware the Mad Irish Location: Wish I was on the N17...	My first thought was I don't know how many times I call people out for being overtly rude -- line cutting and such. I'm not in bad shape for my age but even at that -- that guy was HUGE and totally not present when cell-man makes his comment. Ouuuuch....are you supposed to just let rudeness go unchecked? After all the freeway shootings I rarely flip someone off anymore for being a goombah behind the wheel. You just never know how unbalanced someone really is....very sad. __________________ What are you willing to give up in order to get what you want?