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Old 05-24-2003, 12:33 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Location: USA
Technology and Telepathy Update

This is full of implications.
It doesn't take too much reading between the lines to get the fact that we are very close to reading minds at a distance surreptitiously.
.................
New research looks inside the brain to catch liars in the act

The Associated Press


PHILADELPHIA - Scientists are turning to cutting-edge technology, from MRIs to near-infrared brain scans, in an attempt to answer what courts and corporations have long wanted to know: How can you prove that someone's lying?

But as research presses on, critics say there's another question that must be addressed: Is it ethical to look into people's minds if they're suspected of being untruthful - even if uncovering the lie would benefit the greater good?

At the University of Pennsylvania, biophysicist Britton Chance is testing a headband outfitted with near-infrared light emitters and detectors to "see" blood-flow changes in the brain, and psychologist Daniel Langleben is putting volunteers inside a type of MRI and telling them to lie as the machine photographs their brains.

Both say their work could potentially be used to detect deceit more accurately than today's polygraphs - a prospect that not everyone appreciates.

"There's only one thing worse than a lie detector that doesn't work, and that's a lie detector that does work," said physicist Robert Park, a longtime polygraph critic. "It's the last invasion of privacy that you can imagine, and it frightens me that we seem to be almost able to do it."

Chance said his brain-imaging machine "penetrates the skin and the skull into the prefrontal cortex, where social inhibitions reside, where decisions are made and which is stimulated by deceit."

Subjects are asked to answer some questions truthfully and others not, and the tiny bursts of brain changes - only milliseconds long - are read by the sensors and fed into a computer. The changes begin when the subject makes the decision to lie - before the lie is spoken, Chance said.

He says his machine theoretically could evolve so the headband itself isn't needed.

"We're interested in covert detection of prefrontal activity, where the subject may not be told the experience is occurring. That's in the future but it is possible," he said. "Obviously, there are ethical problems."

Traditional lie detectors, known as polygraphs, measure heart and respiratory rates as a person answers questions.

Critics claim polygraphs are easy to beat - they say something as simple as stepping on a tack placed in a shoe can skew results in the test-takers' favor - and largely unreliable, as evidenced by people like former CIA agent Aldrich Ames, who passed polygraphs, concealing his work as a Russian spy.

Though federal agencies use polygraph tests to screen workers and job applicants, courts do not allow them to be admitted as evidence. Researchers believe the new wave of machines could change that.

"I doubt that anything in life will ever be 100 percent reliable, including lie detection. But will we have a technique that's good enough to be taken as one source of evidence? Probably," said Stephen Kosslyn, a Harvard University psychology professor who is studying the brain scans of liars.

"It strikes me as odd that people seem rarely to see the positive side of a reliable lie detector," he said. "If you're innocent, wouldn't it be nice to have a way to support your claims?"

Langleben is using functional magnetic resonance imaging, which detects part of the brain active in response to specific stimuli. Volunteers were given a specific playing card and told to not divulge it. They were then placed within an MRI scanner and "interrogated" by a computer, which showed them a series of cards and asked them whether they had that card.

When each volunteer lied, part of their brain lighted up, Langleben said.

Other scientists are looking at "thermal imaging" (training a heat-sensitive camera on people's faces that would register increased blood flow around the eyes) and "automated face analysis" (a computer that analyzes the tiniest expressions in the face) as potential lie detectors.

Lawrence Farwell, an Iowa-based neuroscientist who runs Brain Wave Science Inc., has developed what he calls "brain fingerprinting." It focuses on a specific electrical brain wave, called a P300, which activates when a person sees a familiar object.

The machine has already been used in an Iowa court by a convicted murderer petitioning for a new trial. The test showed that the defendant, Terry Harrington, had no memory of the crime scene, but the judge refused to accept it as evidence.

None of the new technology has been proven to work like the scientists claim, said Barry Steinhardt, director of the American Civil Liberties Union's technology and liberty program.

But if it does, "then it would become another weapon in the arsenal of those who want to put us into a surveillance society where every action, every deed and one's very thoughts can be monitored, categorized and correlated," he said.

.....................

None of this stuff scares me.
Why? Because I got my mind together.
I know it scares a lot of people.
They must not think they have their minds under control.
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Old 05-24-2003, 01:38 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Location: right behind you...
i get scared a lot due to my body. i also have a tendency to simply not worry about things that are inevetable (sp) like terrorism...

i am still not seeing a direct link to telelapathy out of a lab... but, even if its possible, i fear not.

its pretty damned cool either way, though.
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Old 05-24-2003, 05:43 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Location: Midwest
I've never feared anything like this before. My way of seeing it: its like cameras on the streets that record your actions. If you are a regular, law-abiding joe who should care?

I don't like the idea of someone trying to read my mind, but I haven't anything to hide. If you really want to see whats in there, go ahead. But I may need to come with a parental guidance label....
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Old 05-24-2003, 06:10 PM   #4 (permalink)
Insane
 
Location: your front door...*ding dong*
As long as the thing works 100% I see nothing wrong with it. Obviously if people have something to hide they would be afraid to use it and who here wouldn't love to KNOW the answere to things such as OJ being guilty or not and If Britney has silicone or not. Other then those obvious questions I'm sure it could be used for more good, like say strap some politicians up to it and see where thier stance on certain subjects really are.
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Old 05-24-2003, 06:17 PM   #5 (permalink)
Loser
 
I don't fear lie detector tests, no matter how good.
I'm a open book, so no need.

If they ask me something, then I tell the truth.
I would prefer someone like me for what I am.
No shame wanted.

The only time I would fib would be to not hurt someone's feeling,
if it really didn't matter.
But even then I'd probably be blunt about it.
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Old 05-24-2003, 08:10 PM   #6 (permalink)
Crazy
 
Location: right behind you...
Quote:
Originally posted by rogue49
I don't fear lie detector tests, no matter how good.
I'm a open book, so no need.

If they ask me something, then I tell the truth.
I would prefer someone like me for what I am.
No shame wanted.

The only time I would fib would be to not hurt someone's feeling,
if it really didn't matter.
But even then I'd probably be blunt about it.
dude, i'm the say way. I say how I feel or i simply stay silent and I never go unvoiced.

however, i have things to hide. some things are not meant for everyone, even the law.
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Old 05-25-2003, 12:40 AM   #7 (permalink)
The Cheshire Grin...
 
Location: An Aussie Outback
That'd be ok if it was like for a big crime, or standing trial where you've agreed NOT to lie on the stand. Most people take a polygraph cause they agree to take one. So why should this be any different?
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Old 05-25-2003, 03:45 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Location: Somewhere in Ohio
Quote:
Originally posted by rogue49
I don't fear lie detector tests, no matter how good.
I'm a open book, so no need.

If they ask me something, then I tell the truth.
I would prefer someone like me for what I am.
No shame wanted.

The only time I would fib would be to not hurt someone's feeling,
if it really didn't matter.
But even then I'd probably be blunt about it.
Same here dude. Only I wouldn't fib so I wouldn't hurt someones feelings.
I'm a firm believer that always telling the truth or saying whatever's on your mind is the best thing to do.
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Old 05-25-2003, 05:56 AM   #9 (permalink)
Slave of Fear
 
gov135 I'll tell you what the problem is, These types of invasions like the cameras you mentioned, start off fairly innocuous. Like you say if you aren't doing anything illegal you have nothing to worry abt. Pretty soon they are using them to catch minor infractions then even more minor infractions then the likely hood of infractions. And soon those in authority has all the power and will never relinquish it back to the people. Do you really want someone watching you every minute with the power to decide if you are doing something they think you shouldn't. This has happened all a small scale already. Talk to people who lived in East Berlin before the fall. Where every third person was being paid by the government to spy on their neighbor. Ask them if they would like to go back to that kind of life style.
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