WhoaitsZ

i've never clicked the LL link. its theirs, it is a forum where women can discuss matters i probably really, really rather not know about.

i can't beging to imagine the hell they'd get having to post for advice on something to have a bunch of nitwit men all shouting answers.

do i want a men's board? at times, but mostly i don't care. i think men have much fewer issues to conceal than women.

political correctness is social suicide. let them have the board and leave 'em alone.

Xiomar

I just scanned through the other posts in this thread so I could respond. I think the ladies having their own "place" is great.
You should feel luky you are allowed to read it.

XenuHubbard

Hell, yeah!

That's why I go there!

__________________
The above was written by a true prophet. Trust me.

"What doesn't kill you, makes you bitter and paranoid". - SB2000

denim

What I saw was that he made a simple observation and a number of people jumped down his throat with no warning at all, even though he was labeled "rookie" and was clearly sympathetic. I got a kind of "deja vu" feeling.

People around here seem to like to assume the worst, even when it's clearly not what the person actually said. That sucks ass.

redravin40

What you have seen denim is that members of TFP have strong opinions and are quick to defend things they care about.

Just about anybody who has been here very long has run into that experience.

The trick is not to take it personally and to appreciate why you received the response.

denim

They say it's about respect, but they're willing to jump on people who aren't even being offensive just because they might be! That's acceptible to you?

This is to everyone: read what people actually say. Don't put words in their mouths. If you're not sure, ask! There is time, honest.

(edit: reworded last paragraph to try to clarify it)

redravin40

Standing up for something you believe in can sometimes lead to being a bit sensitive to the subject as I am sure you know.

I try never to read things into what people say and take what they mean at face value but like everyone I have previous experiences that lead to conclusions about certain types of statements.

You are right. It is always best to get a clarification of what the person truly meant but I have found that people often try to pass off something as a joke or as unoffensive when they realize that people are reacting intensely.

Being reasonable and intelligent takes patient understanding on both sides.

denim

If someone does it often enough, people will start to notice the pattern, and treat the person... differently.

Yes, and some people don't have enough experience to be able to step back, give themselves a minute or two to think, and then post. I have trouble with it too, that's one reason I tend to go back and edit to fix things like bad wording.

komodo

Ya see, the thing we should do is, what we should do is, when ya register for TFP, you say you're either male or female. If male, then you get access to a board called "The Gentlemen's Club". If female, you get "The Ladies' Lounge". But never both for the same person.

<lush>

THE MAC GOD

I think there should be a men's forum with exact same rules as the ladies... its ONLY fair... and it's a place just for those sexes... without feeling the pressure or nervousness of the other sex replying when it's only a 'guy' thing...

__________________
Why continue fighting? Is it for Love? Illusions. All as artificial as the Matrix itself, although only a human mind could invent something as insipid as Love.

spectre

Honestly, I don't care who reads or responds to my posts. Male or female. They either like them or they don't. I don't really give a shit if they don't like them. That's why I don't see a need for the new forum.

__________________
"Fuck these chains
No goddamn slave
I will be different" ~ Machine Head

denim

I could see doing it if the situation were reversed, but it's not. Oh for the day that there are a dozen tech women for every tech guy!

(mmmm.... use me, use me.... mmmmm.... make me a sex toy...)


(no, not really)

titsmurf

I understand why the women treasure their forum, the way it is right now. I genuinely love the idea of having the ladies lounge.

I don't know exactly how many women are on this board, but I think the number of them that stay here would be lower if the the ladies lounge wasn't around.

I don't think they're doing anything wrong there. We are allowed to read everything they write. So that rules out their plotting to kill all men, keeping only a few to reproduce with, yet.

And whenever I read something like "all men are pig", I'm happy knowing that mine is not the only party who is made to look bad thru that statement.

sbscout

I visit the L.L. occassionally and I have, admittedly, "stolen" a thread or two and brought it to the G.D. board for discussion by both genders. I have always given the L.L. credit for coming up with the ideas.

Funny thing though. For the most part, men don't comment on these "new" threads; they get a couple of responses, then just fade away.

Perhaps the females in this family know what and when to discuss amongst themselves....hmmm...

Keep up the good work ladies! I appreciate your allowing us to view your thoughts....

__________________
Always question authority... it'll keep the bastards on their toes!

Bob Biter

I can't believe that there are some guys who would like to have a "men only" board.

We as a gender outnumber females on the TFP by a very healthy margin. Therefore, even if you didn't want women to comment on a thread you posted, there's an awfully good chance that they wouldn't anyway. Also, what could be so private for guys as to warrant the exclusion of women's opinions, which are frequently more articulate than what we put out? I can see why such things as impotence, prostate diseases or whatever concerns male physiology exclusively would not necessarily benefit from a woman's perspective, but seriously, what would we talk about in a forum free of any female response? They would end up reading it anyway and could bring it up in their own posts somewhere else, so what's the point?

Seriously guys, you have your male friends, you have the overwhelming majority of this board and (hopefully) you have your maturity.

__________________
A plan is just a list of things that don't happen.

HiThereDear

hmm, how about "impotence, prostate diseases or whatever concerns male physiology exclusively would not necessarily benefit from a woman's perspective."

Hmm, maybe the same point as the Ladies Lounge, which, if you didn't realize, men go and read anyways and bring up in their own posts and elsewhere. However, I do think that the LL should be off-limits to us.
In RL, if you've got something to talk about that has to do with impotence, or maybe you feel like ranting against women because you just got in a fight with GF or dumped, or if you just want some advice on how to pick up girls - where would you really bring up these discussions? In your big (mixed) group where you'll have to worry about embarrasment (impotence), useless advice (e.g. to pick up women, you should have a sense of humor, but be responsible and serious as well. You should also be spontaneous but stable. You have to be confident but not cocky, etc.), or have to defend yourself instead of just getting it off your chest (rants against women)? No, you go and talk with your guy friends.

Maturity, riiight.

JackSpratt

Bob Biter
First off, in reference to you question about potentially male-only topics, check the thread on male rape. There are multiple postings by women in that thread. If you had been raped or otherwise sexually abused by a woman, would you feel comfortable talking about it in a mixed gender environment? Seriously, this is not a matter to treat lightly. It does happen, and it is not always a matter of the guy getting "lucky".

In any case, I'm not sure if you read my previous post, but I only suggested the idea in the spirit of fair play. Actually, I do believe there'd be less discussion of the LL if there was an equivalent for men, even if it was never, ever used.

Furthermore, I'm obviously a rookie, so who the heck cares what I think? Its called a "Discussion Board" ya know? Its no big deal! Many of the points you make were previously expressed in a very polite (and much appreciated btw) manner. So calm down, take a deep breath and relax, K?
Peace,
JackSpratt
(articulate enough for ya?)

Bob Biter

HiThereDear and JackSpratt:

If the tone of my post offended you, then I apologize. I went back and took out the curses, but my opinion on the matter still stands.

Obviously, there are times when a guy wants to talk to other guys exclusively. I fully agree with that. However, as I've mentioned before (and wasn't quoted on in your counter-points), the male/female ratio is stacked heavily in our favor. This means that the potentiality for any female response on male centered threads is substantially smaller than the opposite case. Even if women posted to a thread males deem "private" or "embarrassing," at least they are not physically facing each other. There's a lot to be said for the anonymity provided by the Internet.

While this argument could be construed to mean that said anonymity would also eliminate the need for an all-female board, I believe that its existence is better justified than any potential all-male board, based on my previously stated male/female ratio argument.

As for the "male rape thread" example, if the poster wanted a uniquely male perspective, he could've simply put a "male replies only please" warning on the thread title. While females would not be restricted to posting, I believe that this would be a sufficient deterrent. Rape, as was noted in that thread, is a problem that concerns everyone, which is why people from both genders replied. Also, it was posted in general discussion, one of the most heavily visited boards on this site. Had it been posted in "Titled Advice", with my previously mentioned warning, then I believe no women would have replied. Of couse, I realize that this is an isolated case.

As for my "articulate posts" comment, this was not meant to be all encompassing as if every male post was by nature mediocre, as my use of the word "frequently" was meant to convey. Please do not take this personally.

While I understand the desire for "fair play," I'm afraid I don't see what's unfair here. Obviously, if the ladies didn't feel like they were overwhelmed by male posts, they wouldn't need their own board. However, I've never seen a male poster complain about the fact that women were replying to a given thread, so, IMO, there's no problem here and an all-male board is not needed.

__________________
A plan is just a list of things that don't happen.

Cynthetiq

Nice to see some passionate discourse and that everyone is playing in the sandbox nicely.

I do agree with you that if there was a Men's Lounge there would be little discussion about the LL. But as I have watched the TFP grow of the past year, the ladies have become more numerous and also bolder in discussing things with the men and without them.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

HiThereDear

I've only been here for a little while, but I have the feeling that the male/female ratio that everyone feels is overwhelmingly in favor of males is wrong. Sure, the majority of posters to the TB are probably male. But in the forums that actually count I see more posts from women and of the regular posters I think it's pretty evenly split between m/f.
And as for annonymity, people from TFP seem to meet up regularly, so there's a chance that you will indeed meet face to face. They get to know each other well, and really even their online self/reputation is important to them, so the internet's not really as anonymous as all that.

If you think that it's sufficient to put "(replies from men only)" in the thread title, then the same could be said for women. You wouldn't need a separate lounge, just put "(replies from women only)."

Frankly, I think it should be both or nothing. This way seems to intimate the idea that men are less private and that manhood isn't as big a part of being a man as womanhood is for a woman.

Anyways, no offense taken.

~springrain

legolas... i feel badly when you guys take it this way... it is important for you to know that an occasional RANT in the Ladies Lounge does not in any way shape or form mean that we group all men into one big clump in order to start our "She-ra Man-haters Club".

some days... for us women... it feels like our opinions and thoughts are drowned out by the multitude of male voices in this forum... the LL is simply a place for us to find respite... that's all... nothing personal...
and if you men really wanted a" Men's Only" lounge... where women could not post... i can safely state that we Ladies would say "more power to you" and be fine with it...

please don't take the LL too personally... we are here because we want to be and generally like the company of you men... everyone once in a while we need a break... that's all... *warm smile*

cdwonderful

for god's sake! Leave the poor girls alone! Isnt it enough that they make an average .75 less an hour than we do? And generally do twice as much work? It doesnt seem like much to give them their own forum.

Besides, they are all so cute......

__________________
Never try to teach a pig to whistle
it wastes your time,
and annoys the pig.....