sixate

LINKY



This really pisses me the fuck off.
Can someone please tell me why everyone thinks that when they break the law they should not be punished.
Does anyone other than me realize that laws are made so that complete chaos doesn't break out?
I'd never have to worry about having a kid that did something this dumb, but if I did there's no way in hell I'd let them appeal. I would tell the school to suspend them.

HALDONIA

I AGREE.THE SENIORS GOT OUT OF HAND.THEY EARNEDTHE POSITION TO BE PUNISHED

spectre

I agree with you on this one. It's really amazing how people feel that they can do whatever they want to and can cry and sue to get out of it. I just find it funny that she's suing over being suspended when there could have been much worse consequences for her.

__________________
"Fuck these chains
No goddamn slave
I will be different" ~ Machine Head

Cynthetiq

Yes.. worse consequences... let me ask...

WHERE THE FUCK ARE THE PARENTS??!?!??!?! The parents are the ones who are not talking to these children saying that they were WRONG in doing what they did and should TAKE THEIR FAIR PUNISHMENT?

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

kurty[B]

Not to jump to conclusions, but the parents are probably the ones that don't want to see their kids punished, and probably the ones who suggested to their daughter to sue, and use their family lawyer to get out of trouble.

I'm surprised harsher penalties were not delt. If the evidence is plain and clear I think expulsion would be the least of punishments they receive.

Double D

This is local news in my area, and I believe I've heard a number of times that assault-type charges will be filed by the police against those that have either been caught on video-tape and/or are fingered by witnesses, 50 of which btw, were boys standing around watching and cheering.

Many of those involved are spoiled rich kids, whose parents have questionable moral standards, but thick wallets. Their darlings can do no wrong, and they will hire the best attorneys to make that point.

Cynthetiq

let them learn that their shit stinks just like everyone else's...I hope that they get a judge that DOESN'T take this crap.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

Big Julie

If they gonna expedite the appeal process for the suspensions, will they expedite whatever assault charges come about, as well? Fair is fair, I think.

Here's to some big black marks on their permanent records!

MrFlux

This is just stupid, why can't people accept that they've broken the law and take responsibility for their actions these days?

__________________
flux (n.)
Medicine. The discharge of large quantities of fluid material from the body, especially the discharge of watery feces from the intestines.

Daval

Sixate, this is one of the few times that I agree with you wholeheartedly. I couldnt have said it better myself.

__________________
"It is impossible to obtain a conviction for sodomy from an English jury. Half of them don't believe that it can physically be done, and the other half are doing it."
Winston Churchill

MSD

Judging by the video, the parents were taping it.

Slims

As far as I am concerned, if it happens off campus, the school should stay out of it. It is up to the police and parents to deal with things that happen off campus.

Esp. if the police do file charges against some students, they shouldn't be punished by the school, and the courts.

__________________
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." - Winston Churchill

"All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act out their dream with open eyes, to make it possible." Seven Pillars of Wisdom, T.E. Lawrence

BulletBob

The school has no right to punish the students. I was involved in a similar instance once where me and some friends egged a house or 10. The parents of the kids whose houses we egged tried to get the school to suspend us. The school basically told them to fuck off and talk to the police. They never did (Thankfully).

Cynthetiq

my private school deemed a 5 miles radius around the school as to be a ANYTHING HAPPENS jurisdiction, just for reasons like this and this was in the 80's.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

denim

I agree. Suspend them, expel them, then make them wear funny hats. Not to make less of what they did, no.

denim

Fine, then arrest them and throw them in juvinile hall, where they'll get treated much worse. Is that what you had in mind?

XenuHubbard

Why not? If they have committed criminal acts, the legal system should decide what should happen. Schools are not above the legal system.

__________________
The above was written by a true prophet. Trust me.

"What doesn't kill you, makes you bitter and paranoid". - SB2000

Loki

Sorry to interrupt on the orgy of confirmation here, but.. um... they hire the lawyers and try to fight it, because they can.

Cynthetiq

right... and look like even bigger asshats in the process.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

Prophecy

I'm still wondering though why we haven't heard anything from the parents of the kids put in the hospital. Shouldn't they be doing something instead of the school? This would especially true in my eyes if a few of the parents add kegs of beer to the party to kick the hazing off... That contributing to the delinquency of a minor isn't it? And it just seems odd that a school can claim jurisdiction over property that isn't even theirs. I don’t mind the school taking action the kids need to be punished, but where are the parents?

__________________
La Disciplina È La Mia Spada,
La Fede È Il Mio Schermo,
Non salti Ciecamente In Incertezza,
E Potete Raccogliere Le Ricompense.

Cynthetiq

I don't know... I've been wondering about that from day 1. I think that they've all been told by legal advisors to not say anything because it may jeopardize the cases when brought to civil/criminal court. But even to hear the sound byte.. "No Comment"

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

SecretMethod70

I take offense to blanket statements such as that. Having grown up about 15-25 minutes away from that neighborhood, and now working with many people from that area, I know that there are plenty of good, decent people who come out of there. Demonizing those who have money is pointless and really just shows a lack of understanding, or, perhaps, caring to understand. As with most things, I don't think the issue is that this is an overall corrupt group of people, just that the corrupt are the most visible. I don't make blanket statements about the African American population in the US just because a disproportionate number of them are incarcerated, just like I don't make blanket statements about all people from an area or who have a significant amount of money just because the most vocal of those groups are people with questionable morals.


Anyway, back on topic. I'm a bit torn on this one. I honestly don't think the school has a right to mete out any punishment to these students BUT I strongly believe that they ought to be punished for their actions. I'd much prefer to see each and every one of them brought to trial and given hefty fines/stays in juvenile hall/prison if applicable. I'm not talking about a year or anything, but I do think a few months of prison time would do them some good. For most, that would leave a life-long impression in their heads as far as thinking about the consequences of their actions.

Unfortunately, I don't trust that punishment to come from the courts considering their age and that they're probably all first time offenders (not to mention, let's face it, that they're female). So, I'mleft with no other choice than to fully support and hope that the school expels every last one of them and that the expulsion is upheld through any appeals, despite the precedent such an action sets.

__________________
Le temps détruit tout

"Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

seretogis

..not to mention the ones to purchase the alcohol.

This is just yet another example of how much of a failure at parenting that the baby-boomer generation is.

__________________
seretogis - sieg heil
perfect little dream the kind that hurts the most, forgot how it feels well almost
no one to blame always the same, open my eyes wake up in flames

SecretMethod70

Yes, any parent who contributed to this by purchasing alcohol or any other means ought to be punished to the full extent as well. I want to see dents in these parent's and kid's wallets and major disruption to their lives.

__________________
Le temps détruit tout

"Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

seretogis

I would prefer chemical castration, to ensure that such horrible parents never reproduce again.

__________________
seretogis - sieg heil
perfect little dream the kind that hurts the most, forgot how it feels well almost
no one to blame always the same, open my eyes wake up in flames

denim

If they had kids at this particular gathering, it's waaaaay too late.

OTOH, things are looking up: http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/05/14/hi...ing/index.html

seretogis

Partial-birth abortion is legal in the US, how much of a leap would it be to legalize post-birth abortion? :P If they screw up before they hit 18 years old, abort!

__________________
seretogis - sieg heil
perfect little dream the kind that hurts the most, forgot how it feels well almost
no one to blame always the same, open my eyes wake up in flames

SecretMethod70

Saw that in the papers today. I'm very pleased. Now it's back in the school board's ballpark to vote for expulsion.

__________________
Le temps détruit tout

"Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

d_p_w_k

"The judge, however, said that under the terms of the suspension Holz would be allowed to take tests and exams, just not at the school. If she passes those she would be able to graduate. "

Now THAT sucks...no graduation...no prom...(sniffle, sniffle sob) AND you still have to take tests and exams...

Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

I am glad they had the opportunity to file their motion, and equally glad that it was dispatched with quickly.

It does bring to mind an interesting question though (one that is raised by others before me)...Namely, how far do we extend the authority of the school to police the students? If this happend in another town?? Speeding tickets?? Underage drinking??

Liquor Dealer

What has been done so far was done by the school. Criminal charges will probably follow in light of the publicity this has received. (It probably would not have without the publicity)
I know that in our state - those kegs of beer are tagged by state law - a keg registration form must be filled out by the purchaser and this information must be kept by the seller until the keg is returned. I don't know if Illinois has such a law but I am sure they have something similar - If this is the case, and they have any type of dram shop law to go with it, the purchaser of the kegs is in deep shit. He could be criminally liable for the physical injuries suffered by some of the girls.

I did think that it was interesting that these kids realized the legal jurisdiction of the park in which they had their party - they are probably in a lot less trouble in dealing with the "tree cops" than they would be in dealing with regular law enforcement.

__________________
Life isn't always a bowl of cherries, sometimes it's more like a jar of Jalapenos --- what you say or do today might burn your ass tomorrow!!!

Cynthetiq

my HS.. Notre Dame High School, affliliated with another NDHS school in Louisiana, and affiliated with Notre Dame University run by the Brothers of the Holy Cross. They have a name and noteriety to protect. Thus they established rules that were clearly stated to EACH INCOMING STUDENT and what punishments would be for each infraction. They extended the school grounds to reach a 5 mile radius, which happened to encompass my girlfriends home. So had I gotten in trouble there, I could have gotten trouble also in school.

I didn't find it unreasonable as they took the time to make sure it was understood before I attended their school.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

Prophecy

well in light of the judges ruling maybe now the parents will show on be half of there injured children.



Also why would the kids want an initiation into the senior class by students anyway?

__________________
La Disciplina È La Mia Spada,
La Fede È Il Mio Schermo,
Non salti Ciecamente In Incertezza,
E Potete Raccogliere Le Ricompense.

Double D

Then why do you make blanket statements like *...let's face it, they're female (so they won't be punished by the courts).*

Just wonderin'.

Bill O'Rights

Sounds like an excellent opportunity for those involved in this B.S. to learn a few of lifes harsher little lessons.

__________________
"I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." - Susan B. Anthony

"Hedonism with rules isn't hedonism at all, it's the Republican party." - JumpinJesus

It is indisputable that true beauty lies within...but a nice rack sure doesn't hurt.

denim

Right out of South Park, that is.

snowace56

I see nothing wrong with psychological hazing and limited physical hazing, but what they did went WAY out of hand. Theres no reason why you should beat the shit out of someone for a powderpuff game.

Macheath

I'd agree that there's a good chance these lawsuits are just stupid, but I couldn't be certain without knowing the details of the case.

It's possible these two girls can prove some lack of involvement or mitigating circumstances, and are fighting a scattergun approach to punishment taken by the school after the matter got national attention.

Possible...but not likely. We don't know for sure because the press generally never goes into ANY relevant detail when writing about legal matters.

seretogis

Heh, is it? I haven't seen any South Park since the first season.

__________________
seretogis - sieg heil
perfect little dream the kind that hurts the most, forgot how it feels well almost
no one to blame always the same, open my eyes wake up in flames

SecretMethod70

Good question. However, I wasn't generalizing. Statistically, that's just the way things are.

__________________
Le temps détruit tout

"Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

denim

That's fixable. The last ep of the second season (IIRC) is a two-parter called "Cartman's Mom is a Dirty Slut", wherein she tries to get a 40th trimester abortion after Cartman starts trying to find out who his father is.

Hint: it's his mother he doesn't know.