Armstrong on his way to another victory - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Rekna · 07-17-2004, 09:44 AM

It looks like this guy will win it again. This guy is amazing, to come back from near death and win 5 (maybe 6) times in a row is awesome.

One thing that concerns me is why does it seem that so many people are out there trying to find dirt on this guy. There is an article on Fox News about french reporters going through his hotel rooms.

Do the French respect or hate Armstrong?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5410879/

Quote:

The Associated Press
Updated: 1:29 p.m. ET July 17, 2004

PLATEAU DE BEILLE, France - Clearing the path to a record sixth straight Tour de France crown, Lance Armstrong overpowered his rivals Saturday to cement his place as one of cycling’s greatest riders.

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Armstrong captured the 13th stage to move within just 22 seconds of leader Thomas Voeckler, who most likely will be easy prey for the Texan.

With just the Alps and two time trials left to negotiate next week, only a meltdown by Armstrong or an unforeseen accident appeared to stand in the way of victory in Paris on July 25.

Only Italian Ivan Basso managed to stay with the five-time champion on the last of seven climbs in the Pyrenees, a devastating ascent to the Plateau de Beille.

As Armstrong and Basso bobbed off their saddles through excited crowds lining the route, other riders scattered down the mountain, their hopes of winning seemingly over.

“The team was great. ... It was a dream,” Armstrong said.

Tyler Hamilton, a pre-Tour favorite, pulled out with severe back pain, climbing into a team vehicle shortly before the halfway mark of the 127.7-mile trek from Lannemezan. A year ago, the American rode most of the Tour with a broken collarbone and finished fourth.

Armstrong overtook Basso with a final burst of speed. He also won this route in the 2002 Tour. The stage win was Armstrong’s 17th in 10 Tours and his first this year. He also won the team time trials with his U.S. Postal Service squad this year and last.

On Friday, in the first Pyrenean stage, the placings were reversed: Basso won a stage for the first time in his career and Armstrong was second.

As in previous years, when Armstrong sealed victory in the mountains and then took his prize in Paris, he said he was not ready to declare the three-week race over yet.

“As I always say, the Tour finishes in Paris,” the 32-year-old rider said. “There are still the Alps and many dangerous stages.”

Germany’s Jan Ullrich — abandoned again on the last climb, as he was Friday — was 2 minutes, 42 seconds behind. He came into the Tour seemingly determined to dethrone the Texan, who has beaten him three times — but his race unraveled in the Pyrenees.

Ullrich, the 1997 Tour winner and a five-time runner-up, is 6:39 behind Armstrong overall. Last year, he lost the Tour to Armstrong by just 61 seconds. Armstrong had rated the German as his most respected rival.

In just two stages in the Pyrenees, Armstrong has sliced Voeckler’s lead from more than nine minutes. Voeckler, the French champion, dropped away on the last climb to the Plateau de Beille — an ascent so hard it is not rated. But he persevered, limiting the damage and keeping his overall lead.

“I hung onto this jersey with my guts,” he said.

“I don’t think many people were betting on me this morning — perhaps even me. I’m happy because it is mission accomplished,” he added.

Armstrong said it had been his intention to take the lead when he set out Saturday. He came very close on the last 9.9-mile ascent, mined with hairpin bends that throw off riders’ rhythm. While Voeckler clung on, other rivals collapsed.

Roberto Heras, a former Armstrong teammate, placed 49th, 21:35 behind Armstrong and Basso, who finished in the same time. Iban Mayo, a Basque rider whose climbing skills deserted him in the Pyrenees, placed 115th — 37:40 back.

Basso, 1:17 behind Armstrong in the overall standings, has emerged as the last main rival. But he is not an outstanding time trial rider while Armstrong is. Basso gave up 2:02 to the champion in the final time trial last year and finished seventh in the overall standings, an improvement from his 11th place in 2002, when he was anointed the Tour’s best young rider.

“We take him very seriously,” said Armstrong, who added that his team tried to recruit the Italian last year. “He’s riding super strong.”

He added: “I knew Basso would be dangerous.”

djtestudo · 07-17-2004, 09:47 AM

During the race the other day, French reporters tried to break into his hotel room looking for any proof of their claims of him doping.

I'd say that counts as not too much respect.

(edit: I didn't see you mentioned that at the top of your post...sorry

)

And it's a little early to say he is "on his way" to another win, but since this is the time he usually kills everyone and takes a big lead, I think it could very well be true.

Go Lance!

wonderwench · 07-17-2004, 09:49 AM

Lance had an absolutely awesome past two days - shaving off over 9 minutes between him and the leader. With only a 22 second difference now, he will blow into the lead tomorrow, imo.

Rekna · 07-17-2004, 09:58 AM

For those of you that missed the reporters article

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,125824,00.html

Quote:

Armstrong: French Reporters Digging for 'Dirt'
Thursday, July 15, 2004

Armstrong Disputes Doping Claims
FIGEAC, France — Frenchman David Moncoutie won the 11th stage of the Tour de France (search) on Thursday, while Lance Armstrong (search) accused French reporters of trying to rummage through his hotel room in hopes of finding evidence of doping.

The five-time champion said a French television crew attempted to get access to his room after he left to race in the 102-mile ride from Saint-Flour to Figeac in central France.

"Just this morning, after we left, a TV crew from France 3 was going to the hotel, the receptionve with every day."

"This particular guy from France 3 has been following us for months and it's scandalous," he said. "The scary thing is, if they don't find anything and get frustrated after a couple of months ... well, who's to say they won't put something there and say 'look what we've found."'

Moncoutie won his first stage victory in five Tours by breaking away from the pack with two other riders and then leaving them in his wake as he rode alone over the last few miles to the line.

He was the second French rider to win in two days. Richard Virenque won the 10th stage on Wednesday — France's Bastille Day (search) national holiday.

"To win a Tour stage is fabulous," Moncoutie said. "It was one of my dreams."

crow_daw · 07-17-2004, 12:31 PM

I may possibly respect Lance Armstrong more so than any other athlete playing their respective game today. I mean his life story is just so Hollywood-Disney-movie-perfect, it's almost unbelievable. It's so damn inspiring.

sailor · 07-17-2004, 12:35 PM

I just finished watching today's stage--and damn. The man has this tour wrapped up. The only one who can challenge him is Ivan Basso, the man who was the only one left with Armstrong at the end for the past two days--but Basso will be dropped in the time trials. I suspect him for second. The real news is the strength of Armstrong's team, US Postal--these guys have the race by the balls, and for the past two days have driven the race at such a pace that Armstrong didnt even have to attack his rivals--they just couldnt hang on! An incredible display of teamwork, with the team up front cranking it until they blew up and then dropping off to let the next one do the same, until only Armstrong was left.

And how about the guy in yellow at the moment, Thomas Voekler. Im so glad he kept yellow for another day--the man has heart and courage like you wouldnt believe. Not a good climber, he was expected to be dropped in the last two days, and every day, he would falter, falling off the back, before finding some other little bit of strength to keep him in the race. This man has heart, and its incredible to watch.

If you are interested in cycling, I just posted a thread talking about how cycling and the Tour de France works over in the sports section:
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...threadid=62457

desal75 · 07-17-2004, 04:33 PM

Not only his he a badass bike rider, a cancer survivor, and from what I hear he is banging Sheryl Crow. He is the spokesperson for Subaru, which cements his position as cool

la petite moi · 07-17-2004, 04:39 PM

Yay, I just watched in on TV. He just barely won though. The Italiam guy was RIGHT on his tail.

As for the French and their opinion on Lance Armstrong- I went to France and stayed with a family there. They didn't seem to hate him; it was more like jealousy. I got to see some of the Tour de France guys riding by, too!

sailor · 07-17-2004, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by la petite moi
Yay, I just watched in on TV. He just barely won though. The Italiam guy was RIGHT on his tail.

Yeah, Basso has surprised everyone. Hes climbing like a ghost. Not many people have been able to stick to Lance's wheel, and to do it two day in a row is pretty substantial.

One thing to keep in mind though--Lance was certainly not riding full out. He had no reason to "dig deep" and attack. He had already dropped his rivals, and was merely taking time out of them. Basso, on the other hand, looked about on edge. I think that had Lance really wanted to drop him, there wouldnt have been much of a chase from Basso.

The other thing is that Basso doesnt do too well in time trials--solo races against the clock. Armstrong on the other hand, is a superb time trialist. Unless Lance crashes out, I dont think Basso has much chance to beat him--I definitely put him on the podium though, probably in second.

Armstrong is probably the smartest rider to ever ride the Tour. Not only does he have the legs, but his sense of strategy and tactics is second to none. He has the race under control, and wont let it slip.

thadon · 07-17-2004, 07:33 PM

Lance is the Man, he is the Michael Jordan of the new millenium and the cool thing is it does not take him balls out to do it

pocon1 · 07-17-2004, 08:51 PM

Is it that the French press hates Armstrong, or is that many in the media just love any potential dirt?

whocarz · 07-17-2004, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by djtestudo

And it's a little early to say he is "on his way" to another win, but since this is the time he usually kills everyone and takes a big lead, I think it could very well be true.

If they actually killed people I would watch it. Death Race 2000 on bikes!

Cross-Over · 07-17-2004, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pocon1
Is it that the French press hates Armstrong, or is that many in the media just love any potential dirt?

Probably a combination of both to a certent extent. As a citzen of France, I can imagine that it would be easy to root against an athlete from another country (Armstrong) who dominates an annual sport in France.

An American Journalist, Tony Kornheiser, made a valid point when he mentioned that journalists in the U.S attack American athletes about alleged steroid use. He then followed by saying something along the lines as why is it hard to believe that French journalists do the same.

About the race, I hope Armstrong wins a record 6th title!

Ace_O_Spades · 07-17-2004, 11:29 PM

I'm cheering for Lance as well... It's just such a great success story.

I eat this shit for breakfast

World's King · 07-18-2004, 02:40 PM

I could win the Tour De France. I just don't feel like it.

blindawg · 07-19-2004, 12:26 PM

It takes a team.. LAnce kicks ass definately, but we have to give credit to the US Postal team for their added contributions to his success.

paddyjoe · 07-19-2004, 12:35 PM

I though the French just hated everybody.

Nazggul · 07-19-2004, 02:27 PM

At least some of Greg Lamond's comments are so very true. "If he is clean, it's the greatest comeback, if not, then it's the greatest fraud." Until someone actually comes up with proof that he's been doping then I choose to believe he is clean. I mean really, if you had gone through what he went through would you really want to put even more drugs in your body? I can't imagine it.

Also, if someone had to break into his room to find something, I would question their intent and whatever they'd "found." I would think it more likely they would have placed it there to validate their suspicions.

Armstrong is a monster on the bike. Basso won't be able to stand up to him in the TT's. Barring a disaster, this race is over.

God I love Voeckler's story. This kid is amazing.

EDIT:

Quote:

Originally posted by whocarz
If they actually killed people I would watch it. Death Race 2000 on bikes!

Have you seen some of the crashes!? It is like Death Race 2000!

Watching that T-Mobile rider bounce off the barbed wire fence was...ugh.

sailor · 07-19-2004, 02:46 PM

Yeah, Voekler is the man. Im so glad he retained yellow for another day. Even though Im sure he will lose it tomorrow... What a character. That man has guts.

And yeah, that was a nasty crash. I couldnt believe he got back on his bike

kutulu · 07-19-2004, 03:27 PM

It amazes me that after some 1500 km on a freaking bike that a 1st and 2nd place can be decided by a mere 22 seconds.

sailor · 07-19-2004, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kutulu
It amazes me that after some 1500 km on a freaking bike that a 1st and 2nd place can be decided by a mere 22 seconds.

Yeah, its pretty crazy--you look at these guys, and clearly, some are in better shape than others, but the fact is, these 188 riders (now less because some have dropped out) are the 188 best riders in the world, and are in better aerobic shape than probably *anyone* in the world.

The sport is about pushing yourself until you break, and then keeping on going. And then getting up the next morning and doing it again. A few other sports surpass it in intensity (think Ironman Triathalon), but none match it for intensity and duration. Its completely awe inspiring, and is why Europe has a love affair with it. Im just saddened that the US doesnt seem to grasp it, although Armstrong's domination seems to have changed that a bit--everyone likes seeing an ass-whooping every now and then, especially when its a fellow countryman doing the ass-whooping.

KWSN · 07-19-2004, 03:40 PM

If there were ever a proper ambassador for American sports it would be Lance.

Just look at our other sports "heros," they suck. Like Shaq and Kobe. I have never heard two grown men whine like that on TV before. Jesus.

sailor · 07-19-2004, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by KWSN
If there were ever a proper ambassador for American sports it would be Lance.

Just look at our other sports "heros," they suck. Like Shaq and Kobe. I have never heard two grown men whine like that on TV before. Jesus.

Ill definitely support that. Here is a man who was told in no uncertain terms "you will probably die from this disease, and will never compete again," fought his way back, and managed to win the most grueling sporting event in the world five times in a row, almost six now. He is humble (at least by American sporting standards... he has been known to be a little... confident--but he certainly has the goods to back it up), does his sport because he loves it, and doesnt remind everyone who sees him of an overpaid, immature, whiny child.

He is a sports figure the likes of which America has not had in a long time, and I think that is why he is so highly regarded in the States. A hero in every sense.

murp0837 · 07-19-2004, 06:31 PM

Lance is the greatest cyclist ever. There have been other greats - Indurain, Mercck, etc. - but at a time when athletes are so advanced there is no comparison. I contend, and always have, that cyclist are the best conditioned athletes in the world. Indurain at his peak, when he won 5 tours in a row, had a standing pulse rate of 22 BPM (That's incredible). I don't know what Armstrongs is, but I think it's in the 30's. When he is cycling, though, is aerobic pulse rate is around 200. Most people's hearts/bodies couldn't handle that. Anyone who has ever biked up a modestly steep HILL knows how difficult it can be... think about climbing MOUNTAINS like the Pyranees and Alps.

It's a little too early to say that Lance has this race wrapped up. Basso is a great cyclist (although new on the scene). Someone mentioned that Lance is, in essence, letting Basso stay with him, but that nonsense. Lance was out of gas two stages ago and didn't have enough strength to thwart Basso's attack. Lance won the last stage, but if you watched the climb, Basso stayed in the saddle while Lance was up and standing on the peddles. Perhaps it's a different style of racing, but both are very effective and I wouldn't expect Lance to lose Basso in the Alps. It will be very close.

Don't forget Ulrich. He is 6.5 minutes behind Armstrong, but in the midst of Armstrongs success and well deserved fame, Ulrich is another great cycling story that has gone somewhat unheard. Ulrich won the tour 6 years ago and has finished 2nd for the past five years. In the absense of Armstrong he would have been the first 6 time winner. Don't think Lance has forgotten about him.

Bottom line... Lance is the man, but there is still alot of racing to do.

sailor · 07-19-2004, 07:02 PM

There certainly is a lot of racing left--but 6:30 is far too much time to make up unless Armstrong crashes. Sure, Ullrich could have a good TT, but there is no way he is making that time up, unless, like I said, Armstrong crashes. He wont be able to get into a break either--US Postal has shown how strong they are and how well they have this race wrapped up. Any breakaway with anyone of importance will not be allowed to survive. Ullrich has already said that he will likely be throwing his support behind Kloeden, his teammate who is far better placed than he is. I dont discount Ullrich coming back in the Alps--he is a monstrously strong rider--but, barring Lance crashing, this tour is over for him.

As for Basso, he is no threat to Lance in the final time trial. There, if nowhere else, Lance can take several minutes out of him. As for the climbing styles, Lance does a good bit of his climbing out of the saddle. Watch him even on small rollers--he gets out of the saddle. Its not a question of how tired he is, its just how he does it. I dont know too much about Basso's climbing style, but it looks to echo Tyler Hamilton's--in the saddle all the time. Neither is necessarily better, just different.

I do think that Merckx was a better rider. The difference is that Merckx rode as many races as possible, and still managed to clean up. He had over 400 wins in his career--Lance has had "only" around 70. When Lance does the spring classics, the Giro d'Italia, and then wins the Tour, then he will be on the same stage as Merckx. But yeah, Id have to give Lance second.

whocarz · 07-19-2004, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nazggul
Have you seen some of the crashes!? It is like Death Race 2000! Watching that T-Mobile rider bounce off the barbed wire fence was...ugh.

Maybe they should make a highlight reel?

mrsandman · 07-19-2004, 09:37 PM

I'm a big fan of Armstrong. He's an imspiration, and I hope he wins more than 6... but...

I was watching McEnroe interview Lyle Lovvett, and "Gollee Sargent!", except for the hair, I do believe they are twins separated at birth!

isis · 07-20-2004, 04:06 AM

I think the thing we seem to be forgetting here is that if Lance takes the lead, and he does crash, its pretty traditional in the race for everyone to stop and wait for the leader to get back on. I think I read that somewhere..

So even if he DOES have a crash, he's Lance Armstrong. Everyone will wait till he gets back on the bike. I'd seriously be disappointed if he WAS doping, as my (English) diploma exam was on "determination" and a story relating to Lance Armstrong's successes.

murp0837 · 07-20-2004, 07:52 AM

Lance won the stage today, finishing 9+ minutes ahead of the leader. Basso finished second and Ulrich finished third. It's going to come down to these three riders, but I would expect Lance to win. Ulrich is basically out, he made a move today but the peloton caught up with him fairly quickly. If he was going to compete for the yellow jersey, he needed to do something today.

Sailor... Basso only finished 27 seconds behind Armstrong in the Prologue. I read that Basso had an equipment failure early in that stage too. Lance will win, but this could be as close a finish since 91. Ultimately, Lance will outsmart Basso.

Isis... at this point, if Lance crashes, there is no way that Basso will wait for him.

sailor · 07-20-2004, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by isis
I think the thing we seem to be forgetting here is that if Lance takes the lead, and he does crash, its pretty traditional in the race for everyone to stop and wait for the leader to get back on. I think I read that somewhere..

So even if he DOES have a crash, he's Lance Armstrong. Everyone will wait till he gets back on the bike. I'd seriously be disappointed if he WAS doping, as my (English) diploma exam was on "determination" and a story relating to Lance Armstrong's successes.

isis, the crashing "rule" is a very subjective one at best. It depends on the riders and the circumstances. If you are doing one on one battle climbing for the finish alone with the other rider and one falls, yeah, they would probably wait. But if it happens when there is still somewhat of a group, dont count on it. I would hope that they would wait, but dont place any money on it.

Quote:

Originally posted by murp0837
Sailor... Basso only finished 27 seconds behind Armstrong in the Prologue. I read that Basso had an equipment failure early in that stage too. Lance will win, but this could be as close a finish since 91. Ultimately, Lance will outsmart Basso.

27 seconds is a long time when you are talking about a course three miles in length. Certainly being so close to yellow will give Basso some legs to crank it, but given that Armstrong is one of the best time trialists in the world, I dont think he has much of a chance.

I definitely agree that Lance has the smarts. He is the most coldly calculating rider I have ever seen. If nothing else, he has experience, something Basso lacks.

MR_WALLACE · 07-20-2004, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Lance is the greatest cyclist ever. There have been other greats - Indurain, Mercck, etc.

Sorry but Lance is not even close to Merckx.

Main Victories/Achievements

5 times Tour de France winner (1969-72, 1974) and 35 stage wins. Wore yellow jersey for a record 96 days.

5 times Giro d'Italia winner (1968, 1970, 1972-74) and 25 stage wins.

Vuelta a Espana winner (1973)

World Champion (1967,1971,1974)

Hour record (49.431 km, 1972-84)

3 times Paris-Nice winner (1969-71)

Tour of Switzerland (1974)

7 times Milan-San Remo winner (1966-67, 1969, 1971-72, 1975-76)

Tour of Flanders (1969,1975)

Paris-Roubaix (1968, 1970, 1973)

Liege-Bastogne-Liege (1969, 1971-73, 1975)

Amstel Gold Race (1973,1975)

Tour of Lombardy (1971-72)

Het Volk (1971,1973)

Ghent-Wevelgem (1967, 1969-70, 1973)

Fleche-Wallonne (1967, 1970, 1972, 1975)

Paris-Brussels (1973)

Henninger Turm (1971)

Grand Prix des Nations (1973)

Edouard Louis Joseph Merckx was born on 17 June 1945 in the village of Meenzel-Kiezegem, Belgium, the eldest child of Jules Merckx and Jenny Pittomvils. In August 1946 they moved into a grocers shop in Sint-Pieters-Woluwe, a suburb of Brussels.
Merckx is almost unanimously considered the world's greatest cyclist with 445 professional victories. He won the world amateur championship in 1964. Three years later he was to hold the professional title.

Eddy Merckx was voted Belgian sportsman of the year six times and on three occasions he earned the title International Sportsman. On December 15 2000 Merckx was voted Belgian sportsman of the century.

In a career spanning 17 years he was the only cyclist to win the Tour de France, Giro d'Italia, Vuelta a Espana and Tour of Switzerland. He was one of only two cyclists, along with Stephen Roche, to win the Tour de France, Giro d'Italia and world championship in the same year (1970). He was one of two cyclists (with Miguel Indurain) to take the Tour de France and the hour record in the same year. In 1969, Merckx won all three major classifications (overall, points, and King of the Mountains) of the Tour de France.

Eddy Merckx retired from the sport in May 1978 due to persistent back problems.

http://www.kings5.freeserve.co.uk/merckxpalmares.htm

Nazggul · 07-20-2004, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by isis
I think the thing we seem to be forgetting here is that if Lance takes the lead, and he does crash, its pretty traditional in the race for everyone to stop and wait for the leader to get back on. I think I read that somewhere..

So even if he DOES have a crash, he's Lance Armstrong. Everyone will wait till he gets back on the bike. I'd seriously be disappointed if he WAS doping, as my (English) diploma exam was on "determination" and a story relating to Lance Armstrong's successes.

It is traditional to not "attack" the yellow jersey when it is down. However it is only tradition and not a rule and that doesn't mean the field will “wait” for him per say. If he has a problem then he will still have to catch up. Depending on the circumstances or severity he may not be able to.

Today’s finish was awesome. I couldn’t get up early enough to watch the race but I will tonight. I think it is fantastic that T-Mobile went on the attack early. They’re pulling out all the stops to find a way to get that time back and attack US Postal. Fantastic, just fantastic.

=)

Oh, deets: Armstrong’s Resting HR is 35. (22 is incredible IMHO, wow).

sailor · 07-20-2004, 05:01 PM

Yeah, theres no way Lance tops Merckx. I love Lance--but hes not Merckx.

Quote:

Originally posted by Nazggul
Today’s finish was awesome. I couldn’t get up early enough to watch the race but I will tonight. I think it is fantastic that T-Mobile went on the attack early. They’re pulling out all the stops to find a way to get that time back and attack US Postal. Fantastic, just fantastic.

I just finished watching it. It was indeed nice to see Ullrich attack like that. He didnt gain any time, and I didnt expect him to, but it made things interesting

I kinda hope he manages to make it to the podium. It really would suck to have one's career continually finish second because this Armstrong character keeps beating you--I dont want this to be the end of Ullrich's career. Its about time for a changing of the guards in the peloton, which we are starting to see with riders like Basso, Kloeden, and Cunego--but I dont want to see Ullrich always frustrated with failure.

billege · 07-21-2004, 10:40 AM

Go One-Nut!!!!

I love that tagline....

07-17-2004, 09:47 AM	#2 (permalink)
djtestudo Baltimoron Location: Beeeeeautiful Bel Air, MD	During the race the other day, French reporters tried to break into his hotel room looking for any proof of their claims of him doping. I'd say that counts as not too much respect. (edit: I didn't see you mentioned that at the top of your post...sorry ) And it's a little early to say he is "on his way" to another win, but since this is the time he usually kills everyone and takes a big lead, I think it could very well be true. Go Lance! __________________ "Final thought: I just rented Michael Moore's Bowling for Columbine. Frankly, it was the worst sports movie I've ever seen." --Peter Schmuck, The (Baltimore) Sun

07-17-2004, 12:31 PM	#5 (permalink)
crow_daw Idolator Location: Vol Country	I may possibly respect Lance Armstrong more so than any other athlete playing their respective game today. I mean his life story is just so Hollywood-Disney-movie-perfect, it's almost unbelievable. It's so damn inspiring. __________________ "We each have a star, all we have to do is find it. Once you do, everyone who sees it will be blinded." - Earl Simmons

07-17-2004, 12:35 PM	#6 (permalink)
sailor beauty in the breakdown Location: Chapel Hill, NC	I just finished watching today's stage--and damn. The man has this tour wrapped up. The only one who can challenge him is Ivan Basso, the man who was the only one left with Armstrong at the end for the past two days--but Basso will be dropped in the time trials. I suspect him for second. The real news is the strength of Armstrong's team, US Postal--these guys have the race by the balls, and for the past two days have driven the race at such a pace that Armstrong didnt even have to attack his rivals--they just couldnt hang on! An incredible display of teamwork, with the team up front cranking it until they blew up and then dropping off to let the next one do the same, until only Armstrong was left. And how about the guy in yellow at the moment, Thomas Voekler. Im so glad he kept yellow for another day--the man has heart and courage like you wouldnt believe. Not a good climber, he was expected to be dropped in the last two days, and every day, he would falter, falling off the back, before finding some other little bit of strength to keep him in the race. This man has heart, and its incredible to watch. If you are interested in cycling, I just posted a thread talking about how cycling and the Tour de France works over in the sports section: http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...threadid=62457 __________________ "Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws." --Plato Last edited by sailor; 07-17-2004 at 12:37 PM..

07-17-2004, 04:33 PM	#7 (permalink)
desal75 Psycho Location: Western New York	Not only his he a badass bike rider, a cancer survivor, and from what I hear he is banging Sheryl Crow. He is the spokesperson for Subaru, which cements his position as cool __________________ The Man in Black fled across the desert and the Gunslinger followed.

07-17-2004, 04:39 PM	#8 (permalink)
la petite moi Filling the Void. Location: California	Yay, I just watched in on TV. He just barely won though. The Italiam guy was RIGHT on his tail. As for the French and their opinion on Lance Armstrong- I went to France and stayed with a family there. They didn't seem to hate him; it was more like jealousy. I got to see some of the Tour de France guys riding by, too! Last edited by la petite moi; 07-17-2004 at 04:42 PM..

07-17-2004, 09:49 AM	#3 (permalink)
wonderwench Banned	Lance had an absolutely awesome past two days - shaving off over 9 minutes between him and the leader. With only a 22 second difference now, he will blow into the lead tomorrow, imo.

07-17-2004, 07:33 PM	#10 (permalink)
thadon Cruisin thru life Location: Alpharetta, GA	Lance is the Man, he is the Michael Jordan of the new millenium and the cool thing is it does not take him balls out to do it

07-17-2004, 08:51 PM	#11 (permalink)
pocon1 Banned	Is it that the French press hates Armstrong, or is that many in the media just love any potential dirt?

07-17-2004, 11:29 PM	#14 (permalink)
Ace_O_Spades The Death Card Location: EH!?!?	I'm cheering for Lance as well... It's just such a great success story. I eat this shit for breakfast __________________ Feh.

07-18-2004, 02:40 PM	#15 (permalink)
World's King Here Location: Denver City Denver	I could win the Tour De France. I just don't feel like it. __________________ heavy is the head that wears the crown

07-19-2004, 12:26 PM	#16 (permalink)
blindawg Lord over all I survey Location: Northern Michigan	It takes a team.. LAnce kicks ass definately, but we have to give credit to the US Postal team for their added contributions to his success. __________________ ( • Y • ) I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it. ( • Y • ) - Jack Handey

07-19-2004, 12:35 PM	#17 (permalink)
paddyjoe through charlatans phone Location: Northcoast	I though the French just hated everybody.

07-19-2004, 02:46 PM	#19 (permalink)
sailor beauty in the breakdown Location: Chapel Hill, NC	Yeah, Voekler is the man. Im so glad he retained yellow for another day. Even though Im sure he will lose it tomorrow... What a character. That man has guts. And yeah, that was a nasty crash. I couldnt believe he got back on his bike __________________ "Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws." --Plato

07-19-2004, 03:27 PM	#20 (permalink)
kutulu Junkie	It amazes me that after some 1500 km on a freaking bike that a 1st and 2nd place can be decided by a mere 22 seconds.

07-19-2004, 03:40 PM	#22 (permalink)
KWSN green	If there were ever a proper ambassador for American sports it would be Lance. Just look at our other sports "heros," they suck. Like Shaq and Kobe. I have never heard two grown men whine like that on TV before. Jesus. __________________ Your arms are broken!

07-19-2004, 06:31 PM	#24 (permalink)
murp0837 Upright Location: Buffalo, NY	Lance is the greatest cyclist ever. There have been other greats - Indurain, Mercck, etc. - but at a time when athletes are so advanced there is no comparison. I contend, and always have, that cyclist are the best conditioned athletes in the world. Indurain at his peak, when he won 5 tours in a row, had a standing pulse rate of 22 BPM (That's incredible). I don't know what Armstrongs is, but I think it's in the 30's. When he is cycling, though, is aerobic pulse rate is around 200. Most people's hearts/bodies couldn't handle that. Anyone who has ever biked up a modestly steep HILL knows how difficult it can be... think about climbing MOUNTAINS like the Pyranees and Alps. It's a little too early to say that Lance has this race wrapped up. Basso is a great cyclist (although new on the scene). Someone mentioned that Lance is, in essence, letting Basso stay with him, but that nonsense. Lance was out of gas two stages ago and didn't have enough strength to thwart Basso's attack. Lance won the last stage, but if you watched the climb, Basso stayed in the saddle while Lance was up and standing on the peddles. Perhaps it's a different style of racing, but both are very effective and I wouldn't expect Lance to lose Basso in the Alps. It will be very close. Don't forget Ulrich. He is 6.5 minutes behind Armstrong, but in the midst of Armstrongs success and well deserved fame, Ulrich is another great cycling story that has gone somewhat unheard. Ulrich won the tour 6 years ago and has finished 2nd for the past five years. In the absense of Armstrong he would have been the first 6 time winner. Don't think Lance has forgotten about him. Bottom line... Lance is the man, but there is still alot of racing to do.

07-19-2004, 07:02 PM	#25 (permalink)
sailor beauty in the breakdown Location: Chapel Hill, NC	There certainly is a lot of racing left--but 6:30 is far too much time to make up unless Armstrong crashes. Sure, Ullrich could have a good TT, but there is no way he is making that time up, unless, like I said, Armstrong crashes. He wont be able to get into a break either--US Postal has shown how strong they are and how well they have this race wrapped up. Any breakaway with anyone of importance will not be allowed to survive. Ullrich has already said that he will likely be throwing his support behind Kloeden, his teammate who is far better placed than he is. I dont discount Ullrich coming back in the Alps--he is a monstrously strong rider--but, barring Lance crashing, this tour is over for him. As for Basso, he is no threat to Lance in the final time trial. There, if nowhere else, Lance can take several minutes out of him. As for the climbing styles, Lance does a good bit of his climbing out of the saddle. Watch him even on small rollers--he gets out of the saddle. Its not a question of how tired he is, its just how he does it. I dont know too much about Basso's climbing style, but it looks to echo Tyler Hamilton's--in the saddle all the time. Neither is necessarily better, just different. I do think that Merckx was a better rider. The difference is that Merckx rode as many races as possible, and still managed to clean up. He had over 400 wins in his career--Lance has had "only" around 70. When Lance does the spring classics, the Giro d'Italia, and then wins the Tour, then he will be on the same stage as Merckx. But yeah, Id have to give Lance second. __________________ "Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws." --Plato Last edited by sailor; 07-19-2004 at 07:06 PM..

07-19-2004, 09:37 PM	#27 (permalink)
mrsandman Addict Location: 3rd coast area	I'm a big fan of Armstrong. He's an imspiration, and I hope he wins more than 6... but... I was watching McEnroe interview Lyle Lovvett, and "Gollee Sargent!", except for the hair, I do believe they are twins separated at birth! __________________ Hail to ALL the troops and shadow warriors.

07-20-2004, 04:06 AM	#28 (permalink)
isis Insane Location: In the Woods.	I think the thing we seem to be forgetting here is that if Lance takes the lead, and he does crash, its pretty traditional in the race for everyone to stop and wait for the leader to get back on. I think I read that somewhere.. So even if he DOES have a crash, he's Lance Armstrong. Everyone will wait till he gets back on the bike. I'd seriously be disappointed if he WAS doping, as my (English) diploma exam was on "determination" and a story relating to Lance Armstrong's successes.

07-20-2004, 07:52 AM	#29 (permalink)
murp0837 Upright Location: Buffalo, NY	Lance won the stage today, finishing 9+ minutes ahead of the leader. Basso finished second and Ulrich finished third. It's going to come down to these three riders, but I would expect Lance to win. Ulrich is basically out, he made a move today but the peloton caught up with him fairly quickly. If he was going to compete for the yellow jersey, he needed to do something today. Sailor... Basso only finished 27 seconds behind Armstrong in the Prologue. I read that Basso had an equipment failure early in that stage too. Lance will win, but this could be as close a finish since 91. Ultimately, Lance will outsmart Basso. Isis... at this point, if Lance crashes, there is no way that Basso will wait for him.

07-21-2004, 10:40 AM	#34 (permalink)
billege Watcher Location: Ohio	Go One-Nut!!!! I love that tagline.... __________________ I can sum up the clash of religion in one sentence: "My Invisible Friend is better than your Invisible Friend."