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Boy gets probation for stabbing bully with pencil
His lawyer says it was defense against bully
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS - 05/09/2004


ATLANTA - A middle-school student who said he stabbed a classmate with a pencil to defend himself from bullying was sentenced to probation by a judge who told him, "It's unfortunate you have to go through that."

Judge Leslie Gresham said at sentencing Wednesday that she did not consider jail time for Daryl Gray because he was 12 when he attacked the other boy in the face in March, permanently scarring him.

The judge had declined at trial to hear the boy's argument of self-defense. He was convicted of aggravated battery April 9 and could have faced up to five years in jail.

Gray, now 13, called his treatment unfair.

"Just because I was trying to defend myself, they want to say I'm guilty," Gray said in court. "I feel like I'm going to continue to be abused at school and nobody's going to help me."

Gray, who had not been in trouble before, said the other boy hit him first. The boy was charged with misdemeanor battery because his blow did not cause serious injury.
Gray's attorneys said the fight followed more than two years of torment for Gray by other students at Pointe South Middle School in Clayton County.

The judge told Gray during Wednesday's sentencing that she empathized with him.

"It's unfortunate you have to go through that every day at a place where the state requires your mother to send you," Gresham said. "If you have been bullied, it should have been cleared up before it got to this court."

Daryl's mother, Jeanette Gray, said Thursday she repeatedly asked school officials to intervene but their only response was to change her son's classes. She said she has asked that he be transferred to another school.

School officials didn't return a call Thursday seeking comment.

Gray was sentenced to 90 days of probation and fined $332. He also must complete counseling and do community service.

The case came amid efforts to toughen Georgia's anti-bullying law, which now covers middle and high school. The state House has voted to expand the law's reach to elementary school.
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forseti-6

It's a shame that officials always try to shide the blame instead of being proactive and helping those bullied. God bless Daryl for standing up to that asshole bully.

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Lasereth

Yeah, this guy is a hero. I always told the "cool kids" to fuck off when they were bullying the "nerds" in high school. I can't stand bullying like that. I've even told my friends to stop doing it and that they were being immature dicks. In many cases, you have to tell the bully to fucking stop before they realize they're even doing anything. It usually works though!

-Lasereth

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fypon

My oldest daughter had a problem with a couple of boys a couple of years ago teasing and giving her a hard time. When she bent down to tie her shoe one of the boys shot her in the butt with a rubberband. She had finally had enough. She took on two of them bloodied ones face and put the other on the ground. She was never suspended and to this day
has never had any more trouble from them.

Sometimes you have to make a stand, no matter who you are.

kutulu

How could the Judge keep him from argueing that it was in self defense? SHouldn't they be appealing the verdict?

onetime2

A friend of mine stabbed me in the arm with a pencil when I was in high school. Didn't think much about it till a couple of years later when the point worked its way back to the surface and came out. Of course this same friend stabbed a kid with an x-acto blade too. Funny, back then he only got a couple of days of suspension.

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PredeconInferno

I like the story Fypon gave us...

I think you're right to make a stand at some point. However, if you're going to go out of your way to torture someone from what they did to you, that's a little wrong.

You should be able to stand up for yourself. I think this Judge did a very good job in handling the situation like she did.

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cherriesue

my sister stabbed me in the hand and in the face (I think she was aiming for my eye) with a pencil when we were kids...I have a dot in both spots from the lead...ah, sisterly love

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Charlatan

I don't see this kid as a "hero" at all. There is nothing heroic about resorting violence. All he did was stoop to their level.

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Nikilidstrom

Juvenile justice is different than the adult system. In juvenile cases, the judge or referee that is presiding is judge, jury, and, for lack of a better term, executioner. The judge listens to all sides of the story, takes suggestions from the probation officer, if one is already involved, and makes his/her decision based on their own experience and opinion. Prior delinquent acts, and the consequences of those acts, are also considered in the judges final verdict.

Now, if the prosecutor had decided to persue adult criminal charges against the boy, then the whole ballgame changes, and thats when juries, appeals, and so forth get involved.

World's King

Yeah... take that ma'fucker.

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MSD

He's a hero at age 12 for stabbing someone in the face with a pencil, in another 4 years he would have been a loner who shot up his school because of the evil music he listened to. Maybe the schools should do something about the problem instead of letting it get to this point.

KellyC

When I go to school in Vietnam, any time a bully is caught bullying other kids, that bully will be hit on the hands with a ruler infront of the class. Not just a little tap, but really hard whip that leave red marks on the hand, if repeated, a litteral ass whooping on front of the class, repeated again...expelled.

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fypon

Hero or not he probably wont have any problems from that bully.

fypon

Schools are very unwilling to do anything about these kinds of problems. Its and issue they dont want to deal with.

filtherton

Since when is violent retaliation in a school a heroic act? If this kid is a hero, certainly dylan klebold and erik harris are heroes as well.

It really is a fucking shame that he was bullied, but he comitted assault. In any case, it seems like the school's administration is the problem here.

Cynthetiq

***stands and claps***

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irseg

You have to deal with people on a level they can understand. Some people only understand violence; sitting down with them for tea and crumpets and calmly discussing the problem doesn't do the trick.

According to the article, the kid tried the "turn the other cheek" strategy for 2 years before he went to Plan B. And I bet the bully never fucked with the kid again. Violence should always be a last resort, but sometimes it is necessary.

Sorry if it conflicts with your view of a friendly world full of puppies and kittens and green grass where everyone holds hands and sings in perfect harmony, but it's the truth.

MaGlC_MaN

he didn't resort to violence, the bullies resorted to violence. they could have just teased him and whatnot but they hit him first. if someone teases me i will think twice about hitting them, but if they hit me then i'll be hitting them back immediately. i can see why someone would be upset because he used a pencil, but imo if he just fought back without the pencil then no one should be upset.

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Bill O'Rights

BINGO!!

The kid's not a hero. Was he justified in doing what he did? Mmmmm...maybe, I might even say yes, but there is no way that I'm going to call him a hero.

The school administrators, though!! Now, there's a different story. If there is a villain in the whole nasty mess, it would be them. I place the entire responsibility square on their shoulders. Pure. Simple.

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pig

I'll agree it sounds like an administrative problem - I don't know if I'd say he's a "HERO", but it sounds to me like he's getting a raw deal. If he's the kid that everyone's going around with the "You've got Gray germs" or whatnot in his school, and some guy pushed him too far one day, actually hitting him, I can't really blame him for jabbing the guy with a pencil if that's what he had in his hand. It doesn't sound like he was out stalking the guy with a pencil or anything..if anything, I'd bet the other guy cornered him.

As far as the Columbine references, I see y'all's point - but I think that *might* be a little slippery slope. Equating stabbing a bully in the face with a pencil while he's trying to beat the snot out of you, versus showing up in school with an arsenal of weapons to blow your classmates to smithereens really could be construed as going a bit far, I think.

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Nefir

I had a classmate stab me in the arm with a pencil when I was in elementary school. I still have a circular scar where it struck.

As for this kid... I am sure this act of vengeance gives him plenty of good credibility with some groups, but in the broader view, I am sure there were better ways to solve this problem than by resorting to violence.

I will not defend him for taking this particular course of action, but I won't condemn him either. I just hope he gets the help he needs and turns out ok in the end.

School officials do need to be blamed though - its their responsibility to keep all kids safe. It seems they either go in the "no tolerance" direction, or in the "I didn't see it if you didn't see it" direction. Neither is good for the kids...

sixate

I seriously wish I knew where all these "never resort to violence/violence solves nothing" people lived. So I could break in their house, beat the fuck out of them, and rob them for everything they have without the fear of anything happening to me.... Any of you willing to give me an address? I really want it...

I was always taught that if someone hits/pushes me... To fucking push back even harder. The bully got exactly what he deserved.

Thinking that this kid is gonna turn Columbine after fucking up a bully is stupid. Dumb reference. Period!

How the hell can you expect a school to control a kid when the parents have never even tried to do it? It just doesn't happen. The problem is at home, and brought to school. To stop the problem you must stop it's point of origin......

nanofever

I don't think violence of this level is the best way to deal with this situation.
. The kid took the violence to the next level with a sharp object to the face; that act is violence with the intent of major damage or death. The boy was seeking revenge not a end to the bullying. Punching/pushing is one thing but stabbing to the face could easily be a case of attempted manslaughter.

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PulpMind

anyone who says that he wasn't justified in what he did obviously was never harassed in school to any major degree.
on a side note, the news reports I've hears said that he didn't purposely hit the kid with a pencil... he just hit back, and, unfortunatelly, he had a pencil in his hand which caused some well deserved damage.

fuck bullies.
One should not have to use violence as a solution, but at a certain point ENOUGH IS ENOUGH, and one MUST defend themselves when they have no other options. And as far as this child and his mother were aware, there were no other options.

saut

Comparing this incident to Columbine is apples and oranges. Klebold and Harris killed 12(?) people that they probably never even knew -- they had graduated several years earlier, and were exacting revenge for what their classmates did to them. They were only standing up to their bullies indirectly, leaving a dozen innocents dead. Klebold and Harris were IDIOTS and their actions are in no way justified.

The 12 year old boy, however, stood up to his bully directly. No one was killed. A much different situation, if you ask me.

maximusveritas

Well, its not clear from the article whether it actually was an act of self-defense. That's what he and his lawyer are claiming, but we don't know if its true. For all I know, he just went up and stabbed the bully without provocation.
Still I feel sorry for the kid. Seems like the school officials let him down.

Charlatan

You were taught wrong...

By the way... come to my house any time. PM me and I'll give you my address. I'd enjoy seeing you in jail.

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noahfor

I think stabbing someone in the face with a pencil is resorting to violence. In fact, I know it is.

The bully is just a kid too. All 12 year old kids are in the first levels of moral development. They make moral decisions based on things other than the well being of other people, so none are better people than others. All the bully needed was to grow up. I'm sure he'll feel remorse later on in life. Now he has a permanent scar on his face. He's a kid, they are learning how to live. He's learned that if you bully someone you'll get hurt, instead of if you bully someone you are hurting that person.

Charlatan

kittens and green grass...

I know a lot about violence in the school yard and what retribution can lead to...

a) I was bullied for most of the 5th and 6th grade. Teachers and Principals did nothing. When I fought back, which was almost always, I was never met with just one on one, it was always a group effort... Inevitably I would end up in the office with the bully or bullies and would face equal punishment (detention or the strap). I eventually used my head and stayed away from the bullies. I arrived for school as the bell rang and at lunch I would leave school grounds and only return when the bell rang. It let me get by. Eventually they moved on to other kids. All fighting back ever did was create more problems.

The interesting thing is that I've grown into a reasonably well adjusted adult. The last I heard of the lead bully was that he was somehow implicated in the death of his ex-fiance.

b) My best friend was bullied in high school. His solution was to kill his bullies and then kill himself. Used his father's P38.


Stick your tea and crumpets where the sun doesn't shine and don't underestimate experience.

When I say, violence begets violence I know of what I speak.


I'll go back to my kittens now.

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charlesesl

He may be only 12. He may have resorted to violence. But he stood up for himself, and for that he is a hero. The bullies and the "cool" kids may not think so, but for all those who have been violated, he is a true inspriation.

I don't mean to get political, but this kid is like islamic radicalists in some aspect. They may be considered as terrists by the West, but they are freedom fighters to their people.

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raeanna74

This situation should never have gotten to this point. The school should be held accountable for not preempting the fighting between these two boys. Part of the problem is not enough supervision - not enough teachers for the number of students many schools have. When I taught and there was a problem with one boy I and the other teachers tag teamed to watch him and make sure he wasn't harrassing the other boys. If the school hadn't allowed the bully to pick on this boy he wouldn't have felt a "need" to stand up for himself.

That said I learned a lesson when I was in school - I was picked on lots, one particular bully would stand and punch kids in the arms while standing in line. The teachers really did nothing at all that I can recall. Two times in a row I ended up standing in front of him and being punched repeatedly. I just ignored him because I KNEW he wanted a reaction. I just simply didn't react even though it hurt. Next time we stood in line some other kids were picking on me, he happened to be standing there, he stood up for me. I had earned his respect and he'd lost interest in picking on me. It's no fun for a bully to get no reaction to his persecution. He and I actually became fairly good friends that year in school.

Ever try passive resistance? Kids need to be TAUGHT how to deal with bullying. They'll get it in all different places through out life. As adults we are responsible for their actions.

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iamnormal

Evil begets more evil.
Hate begets more hate.
Violence begets more violence.

I am a passive person. I was bullied alot in public school.
I allmost reached a brakeing point in high school.
I could have became a vary bad thing.
Instead of exploding I implode and now my life is shit.

Lasereth

I actually agree with ya for once, Sixate. Jesus, this kid isn't a hero because he resorted to violence, he's a hero because he <B>stood up for himself</B> instead of letting the bully keep fuckin with him. Violence may not be the best answer, but the kid didn't take shit anymore. That's why he's a hero. Running from the situation is possible sometimes, but in most bullying cases, it simply makes it worse.

Blame it on the administration, blame it on the parents, blame it on Columbine...it all boils down to the fact that the kid was fed up with being mistreated, and he did something about it. I applaud him!

-Lasereth

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mingusfingers

A pencil in the face. Dag, yo.
Reminds me of the time someone threw a pencil at another guy in the locker room, and it stuck in his forehead.

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filtherton

If you don't see a connection than you're not really trying. The point is that, if violent retaliation to bullying makes one a hero, than dylan klebold and erik harris are one hell of a dynamic duo. They were like "Fuck a pencil, and fuck just getting revenge on one of these fucks, let's kill as many as possible" And i'm sure all of you people calling this kid a hero, upon hearing about columbine, exclaimed "Well, good for them, it's about time somebody taught those bullies a lesson. Let's throw a parade for those heroic murderers!!" Didn't think so.


How the hell can i expect a school to control a kid? Are you aware of what schools do? They control kids, that's part of their fucking job. How can you try to pawn this off completely onto the parents? How can you even pretend to know anything about the parents, much less that "the parents have never even tried to do it(control a kid)??" Certainly parents play a role, but the article clearly stated that the school did essentially nothing to stop this kid from being bullied.

Violence has a tendency to cause more violence. This kid could've earned more respect from his class mates, or he could have just invited an even more severe ass whupping. Stabbing the wrong bully in the face with a pencil just might get you killed.


I'm not a pacifist, but kids stabbing eachother with pencils is not something i look at and think, "Way to go! Timmy is finally standing up and demanding the respect that he deserves."

StormBerlin

Couldn't have said it better my self. I notice throughout your posts that you and I think alike, filtherton

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StormBerlin

Easy there bucko. I'd gladly give you my address if beating the shit out of a 100 lb female is gonna make you happy.

Columbine is a perfect reference, because if you allow one, you need to allow for the other. Who's to draw the line? The Columbine kids put up with alot more shit, so they should deserve to retaliate a little more harshly?

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filtherton

Cheers! I hope we don't think alike in that, while i have my moments, i'm often quite dense.

iamnormal

How about some whips and some spanking?