05-11-2004, 07:20 PM | #41 (permalink) |
Existentialist
Location: New York City
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Spike I get what you're saying. We have a few problems at hand though. I'll trying to explain without getting too opinionated.
#1 We have poor civilian leadership in Rummy and Bremer. Rummy wanted to fight an efficient war. Bremer, the genius that he is, fired the Iraqi Army. #2 Our Army is too small to make this a quick campaign. Again poor planning on Rummy's part. #3 I believe once we turn over power to the Iraqi governing force, things will increase tremendously. Until that happens, the insurgents are going to continue their troublemaking.
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"Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened." - Dr. Seuss |
05-11-2004, 07:22 PM | #42 (permalink) | |
Loser
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05-11-2004, 07:25 PM | #43 (permalink) |
The Original JizzSmacka
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Nick Berg went to my high school. I found out this evening. Totally shocking.
Bush needs to pull those troops out of there right now.
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Never date anyone who doesn't make your dick hard. Last edited by Jesus Pimp; 05-11-2004 at 07:33 PM.. |
05-11-2004, 07:27 PM | #44 (permalink) |
The Best thing that never happened to you
Location: Silverdale, WA
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Forseti, I understand 100% what you said about the problems.
This whole thing either reminds me of the Keystone Cops or the 3 Stooges with Bush, Rummy, and Bremer. And to bigoldalphamale to "trust that Mr. Bush has your best interests in mind" I'm glad to hear that someone has faith in this guy. Because I don't think he's done a thing for the people of the US that he's not had his fingers crossed behind his back or that wouldn't benefit him somehow. How horrible is it to start a "war" just for the sake of trying to save face?
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I'm so in love with a girl... she is my everything |
05-11-2004, 07:34 PM | #45 (permalink) |
Tilted Cat Head
Administrator
Location: Manhattan, NY
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in honor of this man and those others that have died on BOTH sides of the conflict. Today, this is my flag.
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I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. |
05-11-2004, 07:36 PM | #46 (permalink) | |
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05-11-2004, 07:44 PM | #47 (permalink) | |
pow!
Location: NorCal
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Ass, gas or grass. Nobody rides for free. |
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05-11-2004, 07:45 PM | #48 (permalink) | |
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05-11-2004, 07:51 PM | #49 (permalink) | |
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05-11-2004, 07:51 PM | #50 (permalink) | |
Existentialist
Location: New York City
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"Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened." - Dr. Seuss |
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05-11-2004, 07:53 PM | #52 (permalink) | |
Existentialist
Location: New York City
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I too still have faith in president Bush. You have to. He's our leader.
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"Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened." - Dr. Seuss |
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05-11-2004, 07:56 PM | #53 (permalink) | |
Existentialist
Location: New York City
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"Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened." - Dr. Seuss |
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05-11-2004, 07:57 PM | #54 (permalink) | |
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05-11-2004, 08:14 PM | #55 (permalink) | |
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05-11-2004, 08:39 PM | #56 (permalink) |
Crazy
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You will never understand how gruesome it is untill you see the actual video
http://www.davva.com/beheaded.wmv You have been warned. Do not click on the link if you do not want to watch |
05-11-2004, 08:44 PM | #57 (permalink) | |
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If more people realized this a year ago we might not be in this mess. Now that we are, we need to finish what we started. This may not turn into another Viet Nam but it could be America's Afganistan like Afganistan was for the Soviets in the '80s.
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People Are Stupid. People can be made to believe any lie, either because they want it to be true or because they fear that it is. |
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05-11-2004, 08:46 PM | #58 (permalink) | |
Kiss of Death
Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow
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In response to the Daddies' war argument: Bush Sr. went in with a UN mandate, that mandate never called for regime change, nor did it call for widespread military action against the baathist regime. The whole point of Desert Storm I was to get Saddam out of Kuwait. Bush Sr. and Stormin' Norman' wanted to finish the job, however it was not part of the plan. No WMD's? There are no WMD's in Iraq? That's interesting because the whole pretense of the war was that Saddam still had not destroyed weapons he had earlier acknowledged having, that is a fact. Those weapons to this day are still unaccounted for. BTW since going into Iraq we may not have found a smoking gun link, but we have found precursors for WMD's and found proof that the WMD programs were still on going, that is a fact. Bush's first two wars' haven't succeeded? Well seems to me despite an ugly occupation which was to be expected, Bush has did an amazing job of removing one of histories most nitorious villians from power in a matter of days and with minimal casulities. And what about Afganistan is not successful? Bin Laden is incapacitated, last time I checked no terrorist attacks have taken place on American soil since 9-11. Islamofacist Taliban is out of power. All the road bumps that are coming along politically are to be expected seeing as to we are trying to bring western ideals of democracy and freedom to countries and cultures that haven't moved out of the 6th century. Anything else that I haven't touched in mindless subjective garbage that hasn't been backed up by an ounce of truth from you.
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To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition. |
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05-11-2004, 08:58 PM | #59 (permalink) | |
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The two wars have suceeded? Really? Last time I checked Bin Laden was still free and im sure laughing at Bush's pathetic attempt to find him. Also, just because there has not been a attack on America since 9/11 does not mean shit, I assure you this will only fuel the hate that Al-Qaeda has for America as well as other terrorist orginizations, and future attacks are almost certain. America will NEVER win the war against terrorism, it is impossible, all they are doing is making attacks more likely to happen. And as for the Iraq war, all of the people that Bush has killed would have been probably been alive under Saddam, he has done nothing but make situations worse in Iraq. What Bush needs to do is worry about his own country which has enough problems as is than to worry about others. Iraq was not a threat to the US pre-war, but now will be. They may have put Saddam out of power, but the thousands of Saddam followers are not going anywhere. Last edited by slvrnblck; 05-11-2004 at 10:11 PM.. |
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05-11-2004, 09:52 PM | #62 (permalink) | ||||
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05-11-2004, 09:55 PM | #63 (permalink) |
Upright
Location: Bay Area, CA
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^word
that video made me sick to my stomache. i have a VERY close friend going over there in august, and im scared shitless for him. It makes me want to cry. how could you take a man's life like that? do you know the pain that man went through? and for whjat? to help rebuild their ungrateful country. Fuck iraq. these people are sick, they have absolutely NO reguard for life. I cant imagine what the women POW's have to go through if a man is forced to endure this pain. My tears go out to them. |
05-11-2004, 10:16 PM | #65 (permalink) | ||
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05-11-2004, 11:44 PM | #66 (permalink) | |
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And unless YOU intend to make sure America regrets its 'invasion' into Iraq, I suggest you stop with this childish innuendos of gloom and doom. |
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05-12-2004, 12:10 AM | #67 (permalink) | |
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05-12-2004, 04:25 AM | #68 (permalink) |
I change
Location: USA
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Observing some of the statements above and in the air these days, what concerns me is how soft and weak-willed we seem to have become as a collective "free world."
All these mea culpas and collective self doubts make me wonder if we have what it takes to overcome an enemy sworn and dedicated to destroy us and our way of life.
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create evolution |
05-12-2004, 04:30 AM | #69 (permalink) | |
I'm baaaaack!
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You don't know from fun. |
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05-12-2004, 04:35 AM | #70 (permalink) |
Addict
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That clip they show on TV is horrifying. How can a person stand in a room with another person and just take their life. Humans can be absolutely disgusting, vileness incarnate. Although, maybe I don't consider those people human. God damnit, that shit just fucking makes me so sick, and angry, and disappointed, and confused. How was he so calm? The people that did that weren't infact people. Everybody is so in the dark. I understand where all these people are coming from, but I can't understand how the fuck they are coming from there. We're playing games.
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05-12-2004, 04:44 AM | #71 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: NJ
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There seems to be a tendency for many people to assume that American action in just about any case is wrong, misguided, or disrespectful to other societies, cultures, or ethnicities. Too many people first ask of Nick Berg "What the hell was he doing over there?" rather than denouncing the acts of the terrorists. Apparetnly the thinking is "Well they have no other recourse after all, we invaded them." The answer of course is BULLSHIT there are plenty of other avenues open to them that don't involve murdering people but god forbid we acknowledge the fact that some groups of people are just plain morally bankrupt. In the case of the Iraqi prisoners, has a single person asked "What the hell did they do to be in prison?" Not that I've heard. It would be interesting to hear the stories of the "tortured" prisoners just as we are hearing the stories of the murdered Americans and "brutal" prison guards. I'm sure at least some of them are guilty of some pretty heinous acts that go beyond stacking naked people up and taking pictures. And before I get jumped on for "defending" the actions of the prison guards, I'm not. I think it's disgusting. But I'm also getting sick of hearing how wrong the US is and how the terrorists are excused because "they're terrorists and they don't hide what they are" or some other line of crap. At some point the attrocities exacted against innocents by terrorists will overcome most people's acceptance of their evil acts and we will have a more united front. Unfortunately it will probably take another 9/11 or two before people realize that understanding will get us nowhere.
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Strive to be more curious than ignorant. Last edited by onetime2; 05-12-2004 at 04:46 AM.. |
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05-12-2004, 04:44 AM | #72 (permalink) |
Is In Love
Location: I'm workin' on it
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This whole thing makes me sick. I'm to the point where I don't want to watch the news, or read anything on the internet. I'm sure as hell not going to watch that video. I think it's disgusting that it's even available to watch, and that people will watch it.
We need to get every single one of our troops out of Iraq and Afganistan and any other country that we are in NOW. I'm just tired of this all. Bone weary tired.
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Absence is to love what wind is to fire. It extinguishes the small, it enkindles the great. |
05-12-2004, 04:51 AM | #73 (permalink) | |
The Matrix had a point...
Moderator Emeritus
Location: 10th Mountain ASB Fort Drum, N.Y.
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BuDDaH walks by you and taps you on the shoulder and then whispers in your ear, "Too late....."
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05-12-2004, 04:51 AM | #74 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: NJ
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Strive to be more curious than ignorant. |
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05-12-2004, 04:57 AM | #75 (permalink) | |
Is In Love
Location: I'm workin' on it
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Take Switzerland or Canada. Canada is an enormous county. When was their last terrorist attack? Never? And Switzerland was right there in the smack of things for WWI and WWII and did they get bothered? Nope. Cause they're neutral. I can't even get my thoughts straight. So many people in so many countries hate us. Because they constatnly have American this and American that shoved down their throats. I'm not giving anyone an excuse. And yes, I think that if we pulled our troops it would stop terroism. Put our troops in airports. Use them for security check points and all that shit. Have them checking the cargo getting loaded onto planes. Have them checking transport trucks. Have the troops at the borders. But I guess we put our noses in where it didn't belong too long ago, and it's too late to get out now. Okay, I guess none of this is really useful in this thread. Sorry guys. I'm just angry at this all.
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Absence is to love what wind is to fire. It extinguishes the small, it enkindles the great. |
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05-12-2004, 04:58 AM | #76 (permalink) |
Flavor+noodles
Location: oregon
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Hmmmmmm.....Never thought about it that way before.
Americans are not as mean. Americans respect the dead bodys and what not. WE have more class but I guess we do have are faults, sometime's that lowers us a little.
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The QTpie |
05-12-2004, 05:14 AM | #77 (permalink) | |
Tone.
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And there's a mistake being made about the anger toward the beheading. We have to remember the culture we're dealing with here. This is a culture that cuts off your hand if you're caught stealing. It's a culture where it is not unheard of for people to be punished for the crimes of their relatives. And now they watch Americans torturing their own people. What reaction did you expect? They're gonna be pissed off - doubly so because we marched in there shouting to the world how wonderful we are and how morally sound we are and how nice, respectful, and mindful of human rights we were. And then our people do something like this? Exactly what do you THINK Iraqis are going to feel about that? |
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05-12-2004, 05:16 AM | #78 (permalink) | |
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This story though, maybe just seeing it, hurts me so deeply. Americans are schmucks for building military bases on muslim holy land, and kicking the palestinians out of palestine. Muslims are shmucks for giving a shit about the holy land. That's my narrow ignorant view of the situation. It's time to quit this shit. There is no God, there is no after life, so fucking stop worrying about that fantasy crap, work on being a good person, enjoying life, and that will be that. |
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05-12-2004, 05:18 AM | #79 (permalink) |
Is In Love
Location: I'm workin' on it
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You know what I find most fucked up about this? That we keep sayin "yeah that's horrible BUT...." There should be no BUT. Everything about this is fucked up. The beheading, the prisioner abuse, those killed contractors who were dragged through the streets, the children being killed, the children who have machine guns....
We shouldn't be saying This is bad but what about what we did? Because where does it all end? Theres cause and effect here. Nobody should try to justify any of this. It's all just so fucked up.
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Absence is to love what wind is to fire. It extinguishes the small, it enkindles the great. |
05-12-2004, 05:27 AM | #80 (permalink) | |
Psycho
Location: the hills of aquafina.
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"The problem with quick and dirty, as some people have said, is that the dirty remains long after the quick has been forgotten" - Steve McConnell |
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american, beheaded, complete, iraqi, thread |
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