dod123

Clavus, for asking that question, even though i can only answer for myself, the answer is yes, i firmly believe that if i could do something of that much importance, i would give up anything that is my own (my body, my life, my possessions) to do it. To me, giving life is truly a great gift. As i said before, sometimes, we have to look at reality. The real world is not so nice, it is not kind, nor is it forgiving. There aren't always second chances, and no, life IS NOT FAIR, and it will never be. This is my take on life. Desperate situations call for desperate measures.

The mere fact that we are talking about 'rape' is vaguely irrelevant. If the situation were reversed, and there were a million women and 50 guys, should the guys be forced to impregnant the all? What if there were all ridiculously disgusting? My answer would be the same, reality calls for desperate measures. And nobody commented on what i said earlier. If one of the women had a infectious and devastating disease, would you PREVENT her from having children, or prevent her children from procreating? Or worse, would you simply kill her off just in case? This is truly a moral predicament, because now we're talking about the so-called 'quality' of someone's offspring.

When we're talking about life, or no life, the choice is easy. If life is more important, then things must happen that may not be pleasant. In this instance, i would say impregnate them all, not necessarily by rape, but if need be, sure. If the situation were reversed, have those 50 guys do the same. My point is, life isn't fair.

If life were truly fair, Americans wouldn't throw perfectly good food away each day in the trash, waste electricity, over heat and over cool their homes, drive SUVs, etc etc and perhaps some of our surplus could continue to help those in need. (uhoh, i hope i don't open up a debate about foreign countries, i take it all back). Let me just say, life is NOT fair . We try to make it as fair as possible, but it just isn't.

But anywayz, that's just IMHO

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Phaenx

Sure thing.

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"I went shopping last night at like 1am. The place was empty and this old woman just making polite conversation said to me, 'where is everyone??' I replied, 'In bed, same place you and I should be!' Took me ten minutes to figure out why she gave me a dirty look." --Some guy

denim

And TOTAL SELFISHNESS is TOTAL SELFISHNESS, and STARVATION is STARVATION. What's your point?

chavos

don't think i could ever bring myself to it. How we live is more important than if we live.

Consider telling the women you love that you feel this way-i figure they deserve to know your human rights record.

Phaenx

You can't be convicted of the rape of an imaginary woman, chavos. If she were to get pissed off, I'd make fun of her so hard she'd probably dump me anyways.

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"I went shopping last night at like 1am. The place was empty and this old woman just making polite conversation said to me, 'where is everyone??' I replied, 'In bed, same place you and I should be!' Took me ten minutes to figure out why she gave me a dirty look." --Some guy

bobw

Human cloning !!!

guy2003

One would hope that all of these fity wemon decided to do their part to repopulate the human race. However, if they were intent on never having childeren it is within their rights to make that choice and it should be respected.

dod123

hmm, you make a good point chavos.

I was thinking more about myself. Personally, i would do it for the 'good of the people' type of thing, but i don't think i could force my gf into something like that. I guess i just wasn't thinking. I love her too much to imagine that.

I retract all previous comments. Their body their right. It may be selfish, and it may definitely not be in the best interest of the (possibly) vast majority, but sometimes i forget that we have natural rights that shouldn't be taken away. Life, liberty, pursuit of happiness (although, it's not like the government hasn't ever taken them away, but that's a whole different story). I retract my earlier statement with an apology.

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"I may be newb, but at least i'm not stupid O.o"

Stiltzkin

Especially:
"Is there a moral imperative to perpetuate the human race?"

Very eloquent. I'd have to concur with clavus's opinion.

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The most important thing in this world is love.

raeanna74

I don't think that rape would be morally acceptable even then.

On the other hand if that scenerio were the case I doubt that ALL the woman would refuse to have children.

When I was growing up my mother repeatedly told me about a study that she had read about. Her point of telling it was to encourage me never to put myself in a place where I would have the opportunity to have sex with anyone but my marriage partner. Obviously I haven't listened. Now I said all this to tell you about the study. I may have a few facts mistaken but if anyone happens to know of this study or any similar then they could help.

A far as I can remember there was a study done with rats. There were 2 groups all of which were kept in cages with a center strip of floor to them that was electrically charged. The test rats would be placed on one side of the charged strip and on the other side they placed the bait. The bait was either food or a rat of the opposite gender. The rats would actually almost starve to death to the point of being to weak to cross the strip when the only bait used was food. The rats with "procreation" as bait on the other side would all invitably cross and most would not wait very long. The conclusion - the instinct to procreate is stronger than any other instinct.

The fact that people now in our day and age choose not to procreate at times is based on many external motivators. I believe if the population would limited to such a small number that most if not all of the people would be willing to at least attempt to procreate.

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My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

hobo

Dolphins rape each other. It has been observed by many scientists but is usually not talked about. There are homosexual animals too, of pretty much every mammal and some birds. I know some cheetas or something like them rape too.

That was just general info. I don't think rape is a good thing. If there were 50 women left and 1 guy, I think it would be best if he had as many children as he could with each of the women as to create a larger population with some genetic diversity coming from their mothers. Each of those children should pair with a child with a different mother. As time goes on, natural selection will ensure that the humans that survive to retake the planet won't carry too many crappy genes.

Fire

This is an interesting and provocative thread- here goes my two cents worth- rape is wrong- period- but whether it should happen in this case is a question of two evils- which is worse? do you kill off the species or do extreme harm to the souls of 50 women ( I too know women that have been raped- most seem to me to be little more than shells, as has been mentioned by others in this thread, but some do seem to survive and live good lives) I know that in the course of human history we have on numerous occasions been faced with horrible choices , recognized them as such, and then chosen one because we thought the alternative was worse- would the children of rape victims be well adjusted- doubtful- would the gene pool be large enough- who knows- would such an event leave big scars and some fucked up shit behind- yes- but the alternative is to allow all of human achievement, good and bad, to fall into dust- in this case, horrible as it is I have to come down on the side of survival of the species...I guess this just comes down to whether you think the species is worth saving, and at the cost of trampling individual rights...

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Mood the more as our might lessens

dod123

you pose a good point fire, and that really is the question, is 'this' (rape) worth the cost of trampling individual rights? If it were me, i would say i'd give up my rights. In fact, i thought that any individual should, for the 'greater good'. However, chavos makes a valid point, i have to reverse my decision. I would not, and i cannot, ask my gf to make such a decision. It is reprehensible for me to expect, or even consider, ASKING (not even forcing) her to give up her body, her individuality, for ANY reason. If she felt the obligation to do so, i would support her. But the image of her being raped... i would personally tear any man (or woman) limb from limb if they tried to hurt her. For that matter, i couldn't ask any of my female friends (or male if there was a similar situation) to do that. It's just not right. My heart tells me so, and well, brain comes in third in the command chain (can anyone guess what comes second? , hint, heart is #1)

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"I may be newb, but at least i'm not stupid O.o"

flamingdog

Personally, I think the human race has done more than enough for it not to be missed, Hiroshima and Nagasaki included. Every facet of our being seems to tell us we have some kind of right to survive, when we really don't deserve it.

moonstrucksoul

there is and never will be any excuse or reason for rape. period

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water_boy1999

IMHO, If you're so bored, perhaps you should check out some other venues that would cater to such thoughtful responses regarding such a serious question.


Rape is rape, which has been said before. If the world had come to that kind of scenario, my morals would still prevent me from even thinking of it, however, different situations lend to different actions. Right now I say no way in hell would I ever rape, but if the world was in a state where this happened, who knows what kind of mindset would compel me to do it. Tough question.

Kaos

If I was left with a bunch of people who would resort to something as hideous as Rape, I wouldn't want to be apart of the "new" society they were trying to create.

bonehed1

now thats what im talking about......who cares if they hate you

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ChrisJericho

Like 50 chicks are going to be able to resist getting it on with me....

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"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows us that faith proves nothing." - Friedrich Nietzsche

Prince

Now, considering what this species has done to this planet, not to mention other animal species that co-inhabit it with us, there is the question of whether our species should even have the moral right to survive.

But then on the other hand, ANY species with as high an intellect that was on top of the food chain would likely commit the same crimes against moral that we as a species have. Morals as a concept are a human creation, to help us be able to exist together as a society.

If it were down to the last 50 fertile women, and the survival of the species was at stake, I do not see the world being a very sovereign place. At our most animal-like level, we have a need to survive and procreate, regardless of how much we try to supress it in favour of morals, ethics and wholesome values. The closer we get to that level, the less these values mean. The less you see the suit and the tie, and the more you see of the animal.

The survival of the species takes precedence over the feelings of an individual, and if it's down to the last 50, then fuck morals.

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omega2K4

If it comes down to rape to keep our species alive, I say let us all die.

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"Reason has always existed, but not always in a reasonable form."- Karl Marx

Prince

Well if you believe the Bible, it was incest that got us all started to begin with.

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Who is John Galt?

Mr.Deflok

If the human race is reborn out of the barbaric act of rape, we deserve to perish.

Milopost

Wouldnt really mind.

You know rape doesnt have to involve violence.

I occured to me that while reading (and thats alot of posts to read), there a quite a few people who have a 'zero tolerance' or 'can NEVER be justified' attitude to rape/murder.
But seriously if you think about it, you'll find a way to justify it, whether you like it or not. Ok should i start the bid at 'saving 2 billion human lives from horrible deaths in nuclear armegeddon, just for raping/killing one person'. It doesnt matter if this person is bad/good/'a nun'/'the terrorist detonating the bombs'; you'd still have a go wouldnt ya?

sapiens

Where did you read that? I spend a lot of my time reading about human evolutionary history and I have never encountered any academic sources which suggested that the human species became what it is through rape or that there was no consensual sex. (I really do want to know where you heard those statements).

Maybe it is commonly accepted among forum posters, but not among evolutionary biologists. Most evolutionary biologists would agree that humans have a survival instinct. Very few would agree that humans have an instinct to preserve the species.

I agree.

fuzzix

Rape for the survival of the species? Sickening. I'd give myself a backyard vasectomy to STOP the survival of the species.

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I'm most definately not 'lovin' it'.

wipeout

kinda a weird and infeasable senerio--but got me thinking--thanks

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Of weakness within the strength of youth...

Monre

But without rape you wouldn't exist right now.Many cultures raped to show power and to take leadership.Your great grandmother times 23 might of been raped.Rape is a human instinct forced back my society...but without society dead the one man would likely fall into urges.I am not saying im pro-rape it is just likely to happen in this situation.

PredeconInferno

Rape is immoral anyway you look at it.

However, by saying you will not prolong the existence of the entire human race, you are performing Genocide.

Which is worse?

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Samurai in Training
Knowledge is power. Guard it well.

chimbleysweep

Survival of the species trumps all.

analog

Rape happened for so long because we had a basic, innate desire to procreate and no system of communication- and later no established civilized behavior upon which to base our actions.

Once people became civilized, it was no longer called rape, it was called "arranged marriage". How many of those women do you think actually WANTED sex from some guy they've just met that day? Their hand was forced.

Today, despite the arrangement of marriages still in practice, we consider rape solely as the act of a person forcing sex or sexual actions on another person.

It seems like everyone is ignoring a very easy question, though...

Would the man really have to rape these women to further the species? Was there no one woman willing to give herself to have a child, knowing that she may be the last mother of the human race? And if ALL 50 women said no, are you obligated to force them? I'd say, "you asked, you tried, that's good enough."

Rape is the most disgusting crime. I can't imagine anyone "justifying" it in their mind for any reason.

Mr.Deflok

I'm glad to see that someone else knows that Hiroshima wasn't the only place devastated by Burning Malice.

Mehoni

I'd rather kill myself.

If I was forced to get pregnant I would do everthing in my power to produce a miscarriage and if I gave birth I would not take care of the baby.

I do not wish to have any babies and especially not being forced into having one.

But then again, I don't view human extinction as a great loss.

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There seem to be countless rituals and cultural beliefs designed to alleviate their fear of a simple biological truth - all organisms eventually perish.

meembo

People usually respond with violence when their personal survival is threatened, but I don't think people would generally resort to rape if the species was threatened. And it wouldn't ever be right if you wouldn't want it yourself.

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less I say, smarter I am

fuzzix

Genocide is extermination, this would be extinction. Genocide would be if someone went and killed off the remaining 50 women.

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I'm most definately not 'lovin' it'.

KUGR

At the point that only 50 women are left, it would be important to preserve all the diversity possible, and all the women that were capable of having children should do so at the fastest possible rate. Its for the preservation of the human race!

"It shouldnt be called rape, it should be called suprise sex!"

Not a funny quote in most situations, and I appologize if it offends anyone.

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Boof!
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Mr.Deflok

I think you should just edit your post accordingly and pretend you never said that.

The human-race is the most devastating plague upon this world.

billege

We are alive to have this discussion becuase people in the past did far, far worse things to ensure survival. The past is nasty, people. People are nasty, violent, vicious killer animals.

Anytime you forget that, read a history book.

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"My Invisible Friend is better than your Invisible Friend."

Supple Cow

I am horrified to have read all three pages of this thread only to discover that, while many people have gone to a great deal of trouble to ask "what if all 50 women said no," "what if your girlfriend had to get raped?" and so on, nobody bothered to ask "what if the women died from complications at childbirth?"

Not all women can give birth, even when we're talking about the last 50 hypothetically "fertile" women on Earth. "Fertile" just means that a woman ovulates and that her eggs (which are only released approximately every month) successfully make it to a place where they can successfully be fertilized by sperm.

You can argue that, in our hypothetical case, we would know for certain that all of these 50 women would be fertile (as I have just explained), free from any diseases (sexually transmitted or not) that would cause either or both the women and their babies to die within a short period of time, free from any predispositions to mental illness that might cause them to suffer so much from post-partum depression that they might kill themselves and/or their babies.... I could go on for a while. Let me instead direct you to this website:

http://www.noah-health.org/english/p...gproblems.html

Just to expound a little on one thing I wrote above, even a lack of known predispositions to certain diseases (and mental illnesses) could never guarantee that something wouldn't go wrong so that a woman (or both a woman and her baby) wouldn't die.

Now talk to me about how it's more important that you risk my life by traumatizing me psychologically (and possibly physically) - on top of the trauma of being one of the last 50 odd people on Earth - in order to impregnate me with a baby that I don't want to have, whose birth might cause me death and/or permanent physical damage (probably involving pain) and will certainly cause me at least several hours of pain and more psychological damage.

I know I made these risks sound really extreme, but isn't it also extreme to assume that all 50 women would refuse to at least try to have a baby? Isn't it extreme to say that it would be necessary to rape any or all of these women in the case that none of them would be willing to attempt to reproduce or - even worse - in the case that not enough of them volunteered to sustain what the smartest of the remaining 50 odd people says is a viable species? (And what are the odds that the "smartest" person is some kind of biologist or other scientist who would have any kind of helpful knowledge on this subject?)

I'll stop before this becomes a treatise. I hope I've made my point.

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"I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. Twenty-six times I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed."
(Michael Jordan)

PDOUBLEOP

Someone already brought this up but what if by raping one person you could save the rest of humanity? The ultimate indecent proposal...one night with the psycho or he'll push the launch button. I'm forced to say that if you getting raped will save the lives of my children and everyone else's, unfortunately, I'd choose rape.

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