Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community (https://thetfp.com/tfp/)
-   General Discussion (https://thetfp.com/tfp/general-discussion/)
-   -   At work today... (https://thetfp.com/tfp/general-discussion/153382-work-today.html)

Strange Famous 02-19-2010 03:03 PM

At work today...
 
....the Customer Services Manager (who is either mad, or "zany" or somewhere in between) had a meeting with her team. I used to be sheltered from this shit but since my company got bought out my desk moved to the open plan office (Im not moaning about that, a lot of people got laid off and I do get that moving desk and having to work in Birmingham (150 miles away) 3 days a week isnt a hardship compared to losing your job.

But anyway, half way though the meeting they all (the customer service people) starting shouting out random words in turn as some kind of "team building" thing, and the manager shouted out "nigger"

In the whole site there is one person of mixed race (white mum and black dad)...but that doesnt seem to me to be the point. I guess I do understand that on the one hand the n word is socially a lot more unacceptable than other racial slurs (like dago, or mick, or wop or paki or yid or whatever) and that maybe isnt logical. But I was also quite shocked to hear someone yelling that word across the office.

If I did it I'd expect to lose my job. But I guess I wont complain officially about it -I mean Im not black so I guess it doesnt effect me personally and the one person who is mixed race is in another building and wasnt there at the time...

Maybe Im over reacting.

Or maybe the fact I wont take up a complaint with HR is kind of the same reason there is are no black or Asian people working at the company (in the last few years there have been 6 or 8 black guys/girls working there but none stayed)... Ive never noticed overt racism but then again perhaps I dont notice it cos it isnt against me.

I really feel like I ought to take it up with HR or whatever, but I know I wont.

fresnelly 02-19-2010 03:14 PM

And the room didn't suddenly plunge into a shocked silence?

Wild.

LoganSnake 02-19-2010 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fresnelly (Post 2760371)
And the room didn't suddenly plunge into a shocked silence?

Wild.

He doesn't live in the States. I seriously doubt the word would have as much impact anywhere in the world as it would have here.

Hell, I don't know what dago, mick, wop, paki or yid mean. If somebody would've yelled them out in a meeting, I wouldn't even bat an eye.

Pearl Trade 02-19-2010 04:03 PM

It's a little upsetting I guess, but doesn't bother me a whole lot. He probably justified yelling it by seeing that there wasn't any black people in the room. You could always make an anonymous complaint. It's like one of the member's here signature say's: "First they came for the Jews and I didn't do anything...Then they came for me and there was no one to stand up for me."

Strange Famous 02-19-2010 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoganSnake (Post 2760376)
He doesn't live in the States. I seriously doubt the word would have as much impact anywhere in the world as it would have here.

Hell, I don't know what dago, mick, wop, paki or yid mean. If somebody would've yelled them out in a meeting, I wouldn't even bat an eye.

They are all ethnic slurs

Dago is used against Spanish or Italians
Mick against Irish
Wop against Italians
Paki against Asians (mostly Pakistani's)
Yid against jews

MSD 02-19-2010 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Famous (Post 2760368)
Or maybe the fact I wont take up a complaint with HR is kind of the same reason there is are no black or Asian people working at the company (in the last few years there have been 6 or 8 black guys/girls working there but none stayed)... Ive never noticed overt racism but then again perhaps I dont notice it cos it isnt against me.

I think you probably hit the nail on the head with that last point. I'm pretty sure that if someone had shouted "Kike!" that you would now be the star of a viral video with less-intelligent-than-average comments on Youtube, and even those of us who don't particularly approve of violence would be rooting for you.

A few weeks ago at the MLK symposium at work, one of our professors asked the audience what we thought of various groups working together, and my response was that everyone who is the target of discrimination is best off standing shoulder-to-shoulder and declaring with a united voice that intolerance in any form is unacceptable. The intolerance in the UK is different from what we see in the US, but it's no less real and no more acceptable. If you think you can bring it up to HR without fear of retribution or alienation, do it. If not, I hope you can at least be a positive influence on your coworkers.

percy 02-20-2010 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSD (Post 2760390)
If you think you can bring it up to HR without fear of retribution or alienation, do it. If not, I hope you can at least be a positive influence on your coworkers.

Unfortunately, there shouldn't be any fear in calling out ignorance and disrespect in any form.

What would concern me is working for a company where that type of attitude is prevalent and worse, not addressed.

And it is probably a good thing that no one had a cell phone recording this and posting it on You Tube. Would be something if the company suffered because of it and those who stayed silent, ended up losing their jobs.

Shell 02-20-2010 08:27 AM

If you were fired for blowing the whistle
that would another legal violation against the company.

MSD 02-20-2010 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shell (Post 2760509)
If you were fired for blowing the whistle
that would another legal violation against the company.

This site specializing in UK employment law outlines protected disclosures as follows:
Quote:

Qualifying Disclosures

Certain kinds of disclosures qualify for protection ("qualifying disclosures"). Qualifying disclosures are disclosures of information which the worker reasonably believes tend to show one or more of the following matters is either happening now, took place in the past, or is likely to happen in the future :

a criminal offence;
the breach of a legal obligation;
a miscarriage of justice;
a danger to the health or safety of any individual;
damage to the environment; or
deliberate covering up of information tending to show any of the above five matters.
It should be noted that in making a disclosure the worker must have reasonable belief that the information disclosed tends to show one or more of the offences or breaches listed above ('a relevant failure'). The belief need not be correct - it might be discovered subsequently that the worker was in fact wrong - but the worker must show that he held the belief, and that it was a reasonable belief in the circumstances at the time of disclosure.

Protection under the provisions applies even if the qualifying disclosure concerns a relevant failure which took place overseas, or where the law applying to the relevant failure was not that of the United Kingdom.
My understanding is that UK law requires that employers maintain a non-threatening work environment. therefore SF's workplace breached their legal obligation by not reprimanding the employee who used a racial slur. However, in reality I've heard numerous stories in the US of employers who circumvent whistleblower laws and find other reasons to get rid of employees who cause problems for them. I'm pretty sure that this is a universal phenomenon.

Bartender123 02-20-2010 07:24 PM

I remember a kid in middle school who was shouting nigger in the locker rooms. I asked him what the fuck he was doing and he responded with, "Why, what does it mean?"

Pretty lucky that we lived in a town that had 100 black people max.

HannaH13 02-23-2010 08:47 PM

I don't know ... but as Dante said in "The Devine Comedy"
THE HOTTEST PLACES IN HELL ARE RESERVED FOR THOSE WHO, IN TIMES OF GREATEST MORAL CRISIS, MAINTAIN THEIR NEUTRALITY.

You can always question the manager ... why did you say that? Not every offensive action requires an equal reaction ... but your chafing about this so .. ask, simply ask.

Charlatan 02-23-2010 10:01 PM

I would have raised the issue with the manager after the event over a private chat. That sort of behaviour is unacceptable.

Toaster126 02-24-2010 04:11 PM

What was the reaction of the other people in the room?

I'm surprised that a guy that talks so tough didn't find the words to speak up when he felt a wrong was going on. :(

hunnychile 02-24-2010 04:20 PM

This is serious stuff esp. in the States, where using the "n word" is totally unacceptable. I've worked at large companies that did training seminars to make sure everyone learned to never use any words or nicknames that can hurt any other person on their team. Everyone on the job (and elsewhere IMHO) should remember that we are all created equal and deserve equal respect.

Words can be terribly painful. I can't believe a manager/meeting leader or whatever would say something such as that in a gathering you all were involved with. This is considered slander and illegal or a reason for a legal action, in many places.

It must not be tolerated. Nicknames included!

girldetective 02-24-2010 07:02 PM

i find this alarming.
Im with MSD on this.

You know that if you dont address it
it will bother you forever.
Its one of those awful things.

Im sorry.

Merlocke 02-25-2010 11:08 AM

With Apologies to Jesse Jackson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Lasereth 02-25-2010 11:42 AM

You would be insta-fired at my job for ever saying that in front of someone who reported it. It's definitely a no-no.

Seeker72 02-25-2010 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lasereth (Post 2761924)
You would be insta-fired at my job for ever saying that in front of someone who reported it. It's definitely a no-no.

Same here, we have ethics classes 2 times a year and have to sign off that we completed them and accept the ramifications if we cross the line.

robot_parade 03-01-2010 08:51 PM

Anecdotally, I've been led to understand that 'race issues' are very different in GB than here in the US. Here, I'm pretty damn sure that manager would be fired by now. OTOH, the racism that exists is not discussed at all, whereas in the UK y'all seem more open about it. Airing the dirty laundry and all that.

Ice|Burn 03-01-2010 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoganSnake (Post 2760376)
He doesn't live in the States. I seriously doubt the word would have as much impact anywhere in the world as it would have here.

Exactly!

Racism is too pervasive in the US still. I mean cripes, a good portion of people still think our current president is a muslim. I realize that racism will always be a part of society. It's just too bad that after all this time we haven't learned to look past someone's skin. Maybe I was just brought up differently...

I do know that if I had made a comment like this manager in question I'd be fired (sacked) so fast my head would spin. This is one of those comments you just don't make in a setting such as a meeting... There's a time and a place... this was neither.

MSD 03-02-2010 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ice|Burn (Post 2763175)
Exactly!

Racism is too pervasive in the US still. I mean cripes, a good portion of people still think our current president is a muslim.

The problem isn't that they think he's a muslim, but that they think there's something wrong with that.

Ice|Burn 03-02-2010 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSD (Post 2763541)
The problem isn't that they think he's a muslim, but that they think there's something wrong with that.


You're right. I'm in no way a religious person (see sig for details) but it kind makes me angry and feel sad for those that say that all muslims are terrorists and hate america. Clearly they aren't students of history and read or even witnessed some of the greatest atrocities committed in the name of christianity.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 12:43 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
© 2002-2012 Tilted Forum Project


1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360