KillerYoda

I always liked this quote:
<i>There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.</i>
-Benjamin Disraeli

While that story may be new to "Ananova.com" it's rather old, from November of 2002, I think.
I still can't find the fucking ABCnews report I mentioned before, but here's the Brit version of the same story about marijuana messing up your head:
Marijuana's may not have substantial effects
And occassionally, pot can even help your brain:
Is Marijuana Good for the Brain?

You got to give me some credit on research, it's not like I linked to High Times or something.

__________________
"So you're Chekov, huh? Well, this here's McCoy. Find a Spock, we got us an away team."

sierra2774

That explains a lot.

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"Every tomorrow brings new opportunities, challenges we must address...A chance to affirm all our wishes and dreams, to seek beauty and true happiness."

Derwood

I love how Cigarette, Alcohol and Pot users can so easily rationalize self destructive behavior. Smokers get fucking hostile when you tell them that they are assholes for smoking, pot heads pull out the "no one ever died from smoking pot" bullshit, etc.

I've seen enough people I know turn from bright, focused, goal oriented adults into listless, aimless, uncaring pot heads that I think I wouldn't mind never hearing the word "pot" again.

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"You can't shoot a country until it becomes a democracy." - Willravel

butthead

Well what the fuck do you expect.

"You're an asshole for smoking." Think about it, man.

Drugs have risks, some people are willing to accept the risk and harms that come with drug use.

Total emotional reasoning.

BBtB

Maybe they don't feel they owe YOU a justifaction. Using your same logic I could say how hostile honda drivers are. I mean every time I tell a honda driver he is an asshole for driving a honda they get all hostile like. Not to continue the bullshit but no one has ever died from smoking pot. I mean how so is that bullshit?


Have you really though? I really doubt you have met that many adults (over 21 atleast) who never (or rarely) smoked pot before suddenly turn into lethargic slugs. I mean you may be able to cite and example or two but that is definitely the rarity. Its been my experience that the sterotype of the lazy pothead is just that, a sterotype. Its about as good as the sterotype of the black man eating chicken. Sure you can find a few that fit the sterotype but you ignore all the ones that don't. You also ignore those who aren't in that sterotype who do whatever that sterotype says (I.E. White man eating chicken, Lazy non pothead) Saying that 50% of potheads are excessively lazy isn't saying alot when 45% of the general population is excessively lazy.

__________________
Meridae'n once played "death" at a game of chess that lasted for over two years. He finally beat death in a best 34 out of 67 match. At that time he could ask for any one thing and he could wish for the hope of all mankind... he looked death right in the eye and said ...

"I would like about three fiddy"

juanvaldes

Keep it civil folks.

sixate

I've been in too many pissing matches about drug abuse already, and I'm not about to start all over again. There's no need to. All I can say is everyone keep smokoing it and check back with me in 15 years and I'll be my life I run circles aroung you mentally, physically, and emotionally.

butthead

It usually works well if you put up a logical argument, which I have never, ever seen from you in a drug debate I have participated in. If you're not about to start all over again and don't want to, then why did you start this thread (especially in the antagonistic manner you chose to do so)? That's begging to be trounced.

All I can say is there is more than what you think you see.

zfleebin

Sixate: those are some pretty hostile words towards tokers has one hurt you? Whats your view on alcohol? Did you miss the research that said that marijuana does less damge to your brain than alcohol.

sixate

Never been hurt by a weed smoker. Only seen a ton of people fuck their families up because of it and booze. My feelings on alcohol are much the same.

butthead

Anyone found the study yet? I was looking at some interesting stuff yesterday when I ran "robin murray marijuana" through google. Heh.

http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v02/n2110/a05.html?999

Mr Scorcex

Thinking back to high school, there were stoners in my AP classes, and there were complete burnout potheads in the bottom level classes. Combined with all these conflicting reports, it seems to be a crapshoot as to how it affects one. I'm not a gambling man, I'll just sit back and see how it ends up. As for booze, I'm not really into knowingly doing anything that kills brain cells. I'll stay straight edge, and if it turns out that it was just in good fun in the end, well, I won't know what I missed anyway.

cdwonderful

Honey? Did you read all the posts and the replies? All the conflicting information, sources and the general tone of combativeness? Thoughout the thread?

It seems to explain very little........

Fly

15 years later is now.and i don't think anyone is any better,physically,mentally or emotionally than me.some peolple might like to think so though.it comes down to responsibilities and priorities.

if you get those right....what the fucks it to anyone what i do.


full time job...mortgage payments...clothes for kids....food on the table.made every payment iv'e ever had...no trouble with the cops.i mean come on.if you're a dumb fuck to begin with,well then,you're a dumb fuck.some people got a handle on life and some don't.can't blame it all on pot.


*read my sig*

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BASTARD

SterlingStudios

WhoaitsZ

hmm.

lemme see here

my best friend has succesfully juggled it for years with zero side effects. i hve never, ever, noticed until he mentioned it.

another close friend who was a heavy smoker for a long, long time is still the single smartest person I know.

one friend graduated from Milsaps... he's fine and shows no odd side effects. neither does another friend.



smoking pot is a choice. you should not be damned if you do or if you do not.

it sure as hell is safer than alcohol, cigs, and harder drugs.

for pain management, read what i've put on the lit boardt hus far... "-takes a deep breath-" or such thread...

pot is a tool. stupid people and intelligent people use it differently. anybody who wants to damn something can find a con. anyone who wants to do the opposite can do so, too.

if it doesn't bother me in any form, do what you want. i don't like the idea of staying unsober for long periods. its me. i don't have the right to damn either way unless they are driving or what not.



all i've seen on here is childish bickering. made me kind of quesy towards the end of page one and all of page two. gotta problem? fucking say it like i do. this crap i see people barely managing to not flame one another is goddamned annoying and shows how much good our age really does us when we're angry.

pathetic.

ScaryFast

so what. weed is still 39879384 times better than alcohol.

Quant

Not so much the question is it? I don't care about cocaine's damage, as it's clearly a hard-core drug. But comparing the effects of alcohol and pot is interesting. Both will seriously fuck you up if you use them too much. Pot will seriously fuck up your head, and can do so even without chronic use if you have pre-existing tendencies. Alcohol will seriously fuck up your liver and other organs. Neither is good for you, so be moderate.

But really, why not legalize pot? I think cultures that don't go overboard on substance control experience different sorts of problems. In the US, underage drinking is a huge problem, and because of its cachet and relative availability, will continue to be. The drinking behavior caused by being forced to drink illicitly is much more dangerous, both at the time (heavier drunkenness) and long-term (more binge drinking, etc.), compared to the healthier attitude towards alcohol in Europe (for example). Reducing the drinking age and making it feasible for families to instill respectful attitudes towards mind-altering substances at a reasonable age can only help. A similar argument should hold for marijuana legalization/regulation.

Dorp

Three words to this:

Smoke weed everyday

zfleebin

Dorp: It had to be said and I have respect for someone finally saying it. If people dont like weed then they shouldnt smoke it. If people dont like alcohol they shouldnt drink it. I personally dont like it when people tell me how to live my life, so I do things my way. So far it has worked pretty well and I will continue to make my personal decisions personal and leave judgement to my higher power. Anyone who thinks that their morals and views are better than mine can keep em cause I respect them more than they respect me.

LunacyNight

Don't blame something that has been around for very long time...hey I think God and Moses was smoking when god thought he can float on water and Moses split the sea. Now people that think that there televisions are talking to them well you know what there is no drug out there they should touch.

*edit: No personal attacks, please*

kalisto_911

I agree completely, these are my exact thoughts on that ad.

TaLoN

more like every person that ever created a religion was on drugs, you take a "hard" drug and you will discover new "religions" as well.

MacGnG

according to the canadian legalization of cannabis councel (not the actual name, but govrnment group that is decideing what/how to legalize cannabis in canada)
the guy specifically says in his report that alcohol is much more dangerous than weed

also that the billions of dollars spent on the anti-weed compaign on tv, etc.. has done nothing, simply because it is ineffective and counterproductive.

also the various european country that have been using Harm reduction practices have not had to spend nearly that much money and have had positive outcomes. (harm reduction is pretty much sayin: if you are going to drugs anyway we want to make it safe for you to do it.)

EDIT:my thoughts--
if u are mad stoned u arent gonna be all angry and kill someone, rob a store, rape a girl at a party... u are gonna chill out and watch tv cause its cool or do anything that doesnt involve lots of work.

none of those commecials are helpful, there is a big difference between "stupid stoner" and "person that smokes pot"
---
NO ONE HAS EVER DIED BECAUSE OF A POT OVERDOES!

something to think about: if pot was legalized, the prices would drop dramatically, it could be taxed (possibly), IT WOULD BE CLEAN POT, you'd probly have to be at least 16 to buy it, (so the younger kids would smoke it anyway, not a big deal in my eyes), and rich dudes would smoke expensive pot in there fancy leather chairs in their yacht clubs, etc...

if that last one doesn't seem funny to you, then you need to smoke some pot

shakyg

I've been an irregular pot smoker for many years, not starting until after college. It has not been a gateway drug for me, but has not helped with the family curse of depression either. Therapy and medication certainly have.

That is not genius news. If you smoke tobacco or drink regularly your whole life, that will mess you up too. Marijuana is a gift from god, growing in ditches all over the world. It has its place like everything else, and has definitely made my life much better.

I smoke very little these days, but I sure as hell enjoy it and will not stop (except within a month or so of when my wife and I get pregnant). Each one of us is different and each one of us must be aware of our own needs and frailties. There are no clear answers to the difficult questions in life, so don't tell me you know what is best for me. Only I can decide that, and yes, I will take responsibility for my choices.

darksparkles

exactly.
i had panic attacks and got stupid, so i'm in the process of quitting, but so many people that i know get along just fine.

and i agree with MacGnG about the legalization and harm reduction and everything... and the expensive pot on yachts bit is pretty damn funny.

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"I could be the walrus ... I'd still have to bum rides off people." -Ferris Bueller.

fallen_angel

so that explains the voices

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from the Havens I have fallen. . . to the earth as a mangled form. . . writhing in pain, my wings torn and bloodied. . . I have one purpose, only one goal. . . to find you and love you, for I am your. . . fallen angel

Destrox

If they do it in thier own homes, NOT IN PUBLIC VIEW, and ffs not driving or WORKING.

I dont care if they smoke, but the very instant they step foot on the road, at work, or general public social locations, they should be fined just the same as public drunkeness or dwi's.

As for the article, eh... it is as said before, way to vague.

But I do know from watching on a first hand basis, that it simply does make people stupid. Not all, but some, get downright fucking moronic permenent damage.

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You bore me.... next.

MacGnG

in the report by The Senate Special Committee on Illegal Drugs they state that if it was legalized smoking and driving would be prohibited as drinking and driving is prohibited. will really take effect when they have a breathalizer type device for THC.

zfleebin

They have a breathalyzer for pot concentration in Amsterdam

castex

I defy anybody to tell me they drive better straight than I do stoned. I'd similarly challenge anyone to show me the facts which say that smoking weed makes one's driving worse. Yes, the idea of it is frightening if you don't know what you're talking about, but if you do, you know there's no problem. If the stuff were legal, they might do some proper tests. Until then I know there are a host of other factors that make the roads an extremely dangerous place to be. Deal with it, or take the train.

clifclav

"Well looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue."
/Lloyd Bridges

Tip your waitress. I'm Clifclav and I am outta here.

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Neither rain , nor cold, nor dark of night shall.......ahh whatever, just get me a beer!

remiel

my take: cannabis like any other drug has its advantages and its disadvantages. It's as fallacious to say 'if you smoke dope you will kill your entire brain in one puff, you utter moron' as it is to say 'getting high cures cancer'. It has risks. It also has benefits. We're slowly getting better at understanding both of these.

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"Then said Joseph to St. Mary, henceforth we will not allow him to go out of the house; for every one who displeases him is killed."

Gospel of the Infancy of Jesus Christ, 20:16

Phaenx

Thxachu, NIDA:

Marijuana affects many skills required for safe driving: alertness, the ability to concentrate, coordination, and reaction time. These effects can last up to 24 hours after smoking marijuana. Marijuana use can make it difficult to judge distances and react to signals and sounds on the road.

There are data showing that marijuana can play a role in crashes. When users combine marijuana with alcohol, as they often do, the hazards of driving can be more severe than with either drug alone.

A study of patients in a shock-trauma unit who had been in traffic accidents revealed that 15 percent of those who had been driving a car or motorcycle had been smoking marijuana, and another 17 percent had both THC and alcohol in their blood (17).


In one study conducted in Memphis, TN, researchers found that, of 150 reckless drivers who were tested for drugs at the arrest scene, 33 percent tested positive for marijuana, and 12 percent tested positive for both marijuana and cocaine (2). Data also show that while smoking marijuana, people show the same lack of coordination on standard "drunk driver" tests as do people who have had too much to drink (11).

Also, I'm a better driver then you are when you're stoned. I follow the posted speed limit within 5-10 miles an hour, and I don't hit people with my car, flawless victory!

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"I went shopping last night at like 1am. The place was empty and this old woman just making polite conversation said to me, 'where is everyone??' I replied, 'In bed, same place you and I should be!' Took me ten minutes to figure out why she gave me a dirty look." --Some guy

shakyg

See, it can really be worthwhile to take a little hit, then go out in the car with some funky music blowing, almost hit a punk who doesn't get out of the way fast enough, pass a slow car (safely, of course) at 20mph over the posted limit, and generally have fun without hurting anyone and hopefully without getting caught.

If'n I do get caught, I might have a lesson to learn. C'est la vie. Now, on another day I might not even go out in the car while some sober bad driver causes a wreck. Main thing is, don't try to tell me what to do.

Phaenx

I hope you do learn your lesson soon enough, because in all likely-hood you're going to end up getting someone killed doing that.

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"I went shopping last night at like 1am. The place was empty and this old woman just making polite conversation said to me, 'where is everyone??' I replied, 'In bed, same place you and I should be!' Took me ten minutes to figure out why she gave me a dirty look." --Some guy

zfleebin

I have no problems with weed but I dont think any drugs make you a better driver. I think driving while drugged is just plain stupid and is about as selfish as it gets. After saying that I believe that the wording of that article is misleading and just plain unprofessional. I agree with what it says to an extent but it was clearly not done by someone who attempted(in the least) to be objective and I have questions as to whether the scientist who did the research approved that article.

MacGnG

no drugs will make your driving better, ALL drugs can make it worse.

Marius1

These reports aren't worth the paper they are written on.

How can they tell that it isn't:

People who develop mental illness in later life are physclogically more likely to try things like drugs in earlier life.

dreyfus

The study mentioned at the start of this thread refers to subjects who ingest "large amounts of cannabis." What's a large amount? A joint a day? A joint every hour? Search the medical and scientific literature on this topic and you'll find dozens of studies with conflicting results. It is undisputed, though, that tobacco and alcohol are both physically addictive, yet legal in the US.

Weed is not physically addictive, though people with addictive personalities may come to feel psychologically dependent on it after habitual use. I've never heard a health-based argument for treating weed differently from alcohol or tobacco that was even remotely convincing to me. I personally believe it's less harmful than either, and I've been a casual smoker for 20 years so I have some experience in this area. If I smoke for a few days in a row I generally stop for a while because I start to feel burnt. Not mentally, but physically.

I've never been addicted, and smoking weed has never led me to try harder drugs. I made it through college and grad school and more than a decade of my professional career without going psychotic. I pay my taxes, I give to charity, and I go to work every day. Most objective observers would say I'm a productive member of society. If I drink three martinis after work every day to unwind, that's cool, but if I smoke a bowl I'm a criminal and a danger to society? Bullshit.

Those who smoke and drive, or drink and drive, do pose a threat to others and should be punished. Driving while distracted or impaired is illegal, but the fact that people drink and drive isn't used as a justification to ban alcohol. Driving while talking on a cell phone is a huge distraction, and cell phone usage has been a clear contributing factor in hundreds of accidents, but outside of a few jurisdictions it's still legal to drive around with one hand on the wheel and the other on your stupid phone. Hands free makes little difference, because the conversation is the distraction, not the phone.

The bottom line is that responsible adults should be permitted to use alcohol, tobacco, and weed responsibly. I don't smoke cigarettes, and anybody who does these days knows they're increasing their risk of heart disease, lung cancer, and dozens of other life-threatening ailments, but if you want to do that to yourself, it's not my place to stop you. If you want to eat a gallon of ice cream and a 20-oz. steak every day, it's not good for you, but nobody has the right to tell you you can't. If I want to smoke a joint in the privacy of my own home and watch a movie, leave me the fuck alone.

rooster

hell i had mental illness before i started smoking reefer. i am 50 yr old and have been smoking it since i was around 15 .my mental illness hasnt changed i still got it .