Foster children taken from grandparents over single spanking incident
 

I don't think this even comes down to supporting or not supporting hitting children. A snap judgment like the grandmother made is a perfect example of how negative reinforcement to discourage bad behavior can help a child to stay out of danger until he's mentally developed enough to use judgment like an adult. I doubt that anyone faults the grandmother here, but if you do, I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

What this seems like to me is a case of zero tolerance and inefficient bureaucracy coming together to hurt a family. Foster children certainly have to be protected from abusive surrogate parents, and at least in the US, abuses that become high-profile tend to reveal systematic failures of Family Services or Child Protective Services to take care of that. It seems that they're very careful to protect these kids in Australia, but why isn't there some sort of oversight that could allow a guardian to make an appointment with the department that handles this and explain to a judge or a social worker that it was a simple swat on the bottom rather than abuse. I would say it's emotionally abusive to take these young children away from a loving family for so long.

Is there a middle ground where we can be sure that kids are safe from abuse and safe from overprotection? It seems to me that there at least needs to be a review of what is asked -- going into detail when a suspicious answer is found -- and some sort of in-between step before children are taken from homes over what might be a misunderstanding. There has to be a balance between allowing abuse and child abuse hysteria (it's not the same as this, but along the same lines.)

Bajeez. Ridiculous.

Grandmother did nothing wrong. Corporal punishment isn't illegal AFAIK. Abuse is. Separation of the two can be difficult if its in a grey area, but this is so far into the white it's not even funny :\

This does sound like hysteria. I underwent severe corporal punishment as a child and went the other way with my kids. Taught respect without ever having to raise a hand to them.

But this situation is ludicrous. Why would someone interpret a casual "Yeah, she smacked me last week" into a situation where a child is endangered?

Isn't endangerment the line? I hardly see a smack as endangering a child's mental or physical well-being.

Is it definitely legal in Australia? A lot of us have a tendency to look at things from the perspective of US law. I don't think it should be illegal; spanking hurts, but it's not going to cause any lasting harm, even bruises, unless a parent is genuinely abusive. As far as I'm concerned, you can have a doctor look at the kid's ass the next day and conclude the parent is innocent if there aren't any marks and they're only doing it as discipline..

Inherited Bad Habit
 

Although I think the child should NOT have been taken out of the home in the above case, I think its important to realize that child buttock-beating for the purpose of gaining compliance is nothing more than an inherited bad habit.

Its a good idea for people to take a look at what they are doing, and learn how to DISCIPLINE instead of hit.

I think the reason why television shows like Supernanny and Dr. Phil are so popular is because that is precisely what many (not all) people are trying to do .

There are several reasons why hitting kids isn't a good idea. Here are a few good reads:

Plain Talk About Spanking
by Jordan Riak

The Sexual Dangers of Spanking Children
by Tom Johnson

NO VITAL ORGANS THERE, So They Say
by Lesli Taylor, M. D. and Adah Maurer, Ph. D.

Me thinks there be more to this story.

Some children are just idiots and can't learn or realize, even for just a day, that what they may be doing is wrong without being spanked. They don't think like adults at all, and so their form of punishment should be different.

I'm not saying smack your kids around, but for christsake, if he is climbing down a friggin drain and simply yelling "You may fall in there!" is not working, go to him and grab him and smack his rear.

I'd rather have my kid cry for a few minutes than be stuck in a drain for hours.

Also, spanking a child under the age of 8 or 9 for situations like this is nothing like spanking a 14 or 15 year old. And some people say, "Well, I'd NEVER spank my cat!" Because a cat is a CAT and not a human child. The same as a child is a child and not an adolescent or adult.

Spanking them everyday may be harsh.. and whipping them is harsher.. but a few quick slaps to the rear in their lifetime isn't going to traumatize a child if you give them the love and care and support they need.

I was on the receiving end of many a hiding in my youth, both at home and at school (back then teachers were allowed to physically discipline kids). I remember one time, I must have been 7 or 8. Me and a friend were running around in our neighbour's backyard trampling flowers and making a right mess of the place. After one or two ignored warnings, Joseph came out and gave us both a few whacks on the ass. I, like an idiot, ran home to tell my father, where I promptly received more of the same. The point of my story is, I believe I'm a better person today because of it. And it reinforces my belief that it takes a village to raise a child.

In response to the OP, I think the grandmother was perfectly within her rights to do what she did. Granted, she probably did it out of shock and fright, but it was by no means the wrong thing to do.

I can't imagine what kind of effect this will have on the kid who got spanked/smacked. Will he be afraid to tell the truth from now on? Will he think that the whole thing was his fault? Will his siblings resent him for what he did? All these things could've been avoided if some rational thinking had just been applied to the situation.

It all depends on the child. Some children are devastated if you just give them a disappointed look. Others, you can restrict them and take everything away from them but their arms and legs and nothing phases them. They need something more (but not abuse of course).

I remember my dad spanked me until I was about 8 yrs old...then one day he told me to go to my room and wait for him to come to give me the spanking. I took a dinnerplate with me and stuck it in my pants. He said he realized then that I was getting too old for spankings. :lol:

Oh give me a break. There is something going on behind the scenes in this story. It was probably published with the sensationalist "can't spank the kids" quirk to get it popular.

ding ding ding ding ding

There may be more or the fact that the mother had a drug problem was part of the reason they removed the kids from the family. They won't admit it though.

Agreed there is probably more to this than meets the eye.

I agree with spanking your children every now and then. Not for everything mind you, but for some cases than yes it should be done.

I used a shoe, like in The Little Rascals, heh