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Six Dead in NIU Shooting
We should be be getting familiar with this song. Columbine, Virgina Tech, and now NIU.
ABC 7 Chicago Article DEKALB, Ill. (WLS) -- A gunman who opened fire at an NIU lecture hall Thursday afternoon -- killing five and injuring more than a dozen people -- shot himself to death, police said.I don't know where this thread should go. Moderators, thanks if you move it else where. Oh... Happy Valentines day. |
Not the only one this week...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080215/...s/niu_shooting Quote:
And then I get this kind of news from the US, where you're not supposed to have to worry about being a victim of that kind of random violence as a college student. I mean, WTF? What is so fucked up with our country that we have bastards like this walking into schools and shooting people, for NO FUCKING REASON?? If these individuals had been born in the Middle East instead of the US, would they have become suicide bombers instead? Is this some kind of pathological thing that would happen anywhere these people were born, or is it something about the US that makes these *type* of killings unique? Why guns? Why university campuses? Christ. |
Oh, Superman where are you now? When everything's gone wrong somehow?How do we stop this? How do we get into the mind that justifies these bloody actions? Where do we start? How does it end? We are always left with these questions. We think there will be another answer if we look a little harder. We convince ourselves, "There must be a motive." What happens when it is this time that there was no motive. There was no reason. There was no justification. We could just as easily call it insanity. What if it was not even that? Is this the world we live in? |
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How many school shootings will it take before Americans start to think, "Oh, wait, the greatest threat to our safety is actually happening HERE, on our own soil, at the hands of our own insane people, with our guns in their hands?" I'm rambling, but these are the questions that come to mind. |
Oh no, I understand. I have many the same questions you have. I agree with you.
I am rambling on a different topic. My question is, what happens when there is no motive? What happens when these atrocities have no reason anymore? What do we think? There never is any reason that would justify these shootings. But there is a reason to these people. What happens when there isn't even that? |
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There's a reason... not necessarily a good one, but still a reason. ... (looks at his gun safe) Yet again... mine didn't do anything yesterday. ... What a nightmare. I can see my future tuition costs going to cover the campus SWAT team. Instead of a new laptop, I'll need to buy a friggin' Uzi for my junior year. :grumpy: ... How do you counter this insane behavior? Harsh language? Useless metal detectors? How about special skin-tight uniforms? Professors should be able to carry concealed weapons. |
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People are not terminators ala the movie. We are still social animals with motives and goals. When that gets crosswired somehow you get insane actions. |
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I believe this to be either the fourth or fifth school shooting in a week.
I think its a matter of time before we see students with concealed carry permits bring their sidearms with them everywhere, regardless of school approval. That's assuming there aren't several out there who do this right now. As it is, I know of several students in my area who won't leave home without carrying a knife due to an outburst of muggings and shootings in town over the past few weeks. |
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Its the motivation, the indoctrination, the social pressures that create them, that let them do what to those outside look like insane actions. Thats really the difference between a terrorist and some wacky shooter like this. A wacky shooter is more like a force of nature. Its someone defective, someone who for whatever reason has lost their grip. A terrorist is not insane, but guided with malicious intent. |
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I think there is at least a casual relationship between one who engages in a terrorist act and a "random" school shooter: There are significant stressors that drive them to commit these acts. Neither a terrorist nor a shooter (in most cases, at least, I would say) simply decides "hey, I think it would be good or interesting to kill some people; I'm not doing much else today, so why not? I've always been curious, and it's not like I like these people very much, I hate them even. And I don't even know them. I think I'll do it."
In either case (again, I will suggest this is most but not all), these individuals are acting out as being driven by stressors that come from society and individual situations. Yes, there are such things as cultural and other conditioning, especially in the case of the terrorist. But indoctrination alone does not drive one to end their lives in a swath of risky violence. There is more to it than that. An extremist of any form does not usually act out in such a way without an accumulation of stressors (or a single extraordinary one) that push them over the edge. If it isn't stressors, it could simply be mental illness. Either way, I don't buy the argument that there is no motive, no purpose...that they do this for nothing. |
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The only other school shootings I have heard of, have been copycats of the American school shootings. Its how we do things, perhaps its part of our culture, but you could just claim all the american ones are copy cats too. Quote:
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Part of the problem is if you start handing out guns to everyone, the shooters will just turn to bombers. Unless they are trying to target specific people or types of people, bombs work. Just look to the Middle East. They don't go around shooting people, they blow up.
It isn't very hard to figure out why these happen. Sure there are thousands of people who might be possible school shooters and don't, so that is the hard part, determining who is going to do this and who isn't. I would say that this was caused by jealousy and emotional problems that he was unable to cope with, and instead of just killing himself, it made sense to take out the people that were happy and successful that reminded him of how much of a loser he was. Maybe in elementary school they should mention that if you tease and bully other students that they might come back and kill them a few years down the line. |
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B: As George F. Kennan put it... society's delicate compulsions... keep us in check. Those that completely fall away from the mold are lost. Sometimes they turn to substance abuse... sometimes they kill themselves... sometimes they kill others with a Glock (www.Glock.com) in a blaze of emo glory... sometimes they just play WoW. C: They do mention it. Turns out the Dr. Phil generation isn't listening to it. We're all "special and unique snowflakes that deserve a chance." Pfft. |
:shakehead: Used to be when you told someone to "be careful" as they headed to the mall or class, it meant "don't fall, don't wreck the car." Now, it's come to mean "Duck if you hear gunshots."
Why do these crazies with guns feel the need to take out everyone in their path when they're suicidal? Go back to the good old days when crazy boy went out back and did himself in. Alone. |
I just want to say that I am enjoying this thread more than I've enjoyed any of the threads that revolved around the other school shootings.
Thanks. |
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...or be Chuck Norris. The math sucks... gun + gun = dead body. Only good thing to come from it is that maybe the "good guys" won't always be on the right side of that equal sign. |
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There are no guarantees in these scenarios except more deaths when one side is denied the ability to effectively defend themselves against those that ignore the laws/rules. |
What about crazy-with-a-gun prevention?
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1. Crazy (a noun for person) 2. Gun (the implement of choice) ... Is it easier to "fix" a gun or "fix" a person? I'd suggest that the gun isn't broken... it's doing what it was designed to do: propel metal projectiles in one direction. How do we fix the person? Good parenting, education, afterschool sports, social programs, less TeeVee, more sex. ... Mmm, I should think about this some more. |
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It's still a situation where I'm not sure adding more guns is the right thing to do. Then again, I don't know if there is a right thing to do. I do know that I'm more unsettled by the idea of random people on the street being armed than I am by the idea of nobody being armed. (Yeah, I know, those aren't exactly the choices offered...) |
Hey I know....maybe its time Americans re-examine their whole "right to bear arms" bullshit. Guess what, the British aren't invading any time soon (which was why that was put in the Constitution in the first place).
I can see no valid reason for a civilian to carry or own an assault weapon of any kind. Time for the laws to change and guns to be restricted. Moving in the other direction, students arming themselves, will be utterly disastrous. |
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Second: Gun control / confiscation would be impossible in the United States. Just handguns alone? Americans legally own fifty-six million according to the gummint. |
Where did he get the guns, and how can we use this information in the future in order to prevent this?
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Crazies will always find better and better weapons. Pilllows to nerf bats to napalm. We, as a society, need to focus on being able to defend ourselves through both mindset and physical means as well as encouraging. Funny how the world is such a safe place and yet the most dangerous thing we encounter while we're alive. The scouts always used the mantra, "Be prepared." I don't know how that applies to crazies, but I know how it applies to me. |
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There are amendments for a reason. Times change. Change or die. EDIT: Quote:
Another EDIT: Crompsin, I find it hard to believe that any individual would need more than one gun. Two at most. Three or more is borderline paranoid, or crazy. Having this amount tells me: "I like things that kill people. A lot." |
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