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Old 10-08-2007, 05:48 AM   #1 (permalink)
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You or the Government: Who should protect you?

Quote:
Dangerous Sealer Stayed on Shelves After Recall   click to show 
With all the recalls as of late from toys to ground beef, bagged salad to baby carriages, how are you to protect you and your family? Is the government responsible? the companies? you?

Personally, I'm not sure when it comes to chemical items such as this sealer product. I'm always leery of any chemical based items and generally don't like to use them if I can avoid it. I'm happy to pay someone to do the work and let them take the risk or at least have better exposure as to what items are risky when it comes to household chemicals. I even recently stopped using Liquid Plumbr and now use a small auger/snake to clean out the drainage system.

Food is an interesting point for me as I've been studying the food industry for the past 2 years and I'm amazed at what I've discovered. From the manufacturing and distribution, I'm seeing these massive food recalls because major manufacturers are consolidated and distribute their base products across multiple factories.

I already don't buy too much processed food products when it comes to meat included items. My biggest worry is that I do eat out a considerable amount and I cannot vouch for where they are getting their meat products.

I don't think that the government can do much to protect me but to just get the word out. Somehow though I need to be able to see this information easily, simply, and regularly.
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Old 10-08-2007, 06:03 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Unless you are growing your own food, it's pretty well impossible to completely protect yourself against known hazards.

I think the various regulations and potential punishments (from fines to lawsuits) tend to keep the majority of food producers in line.
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Old 10-08-2007, 06:53 AM   #3 (permalink)
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To answer the question in the title (though not actually posed in the OP), I think it's clearly the government's responsibility to protect citizens against injuries caused by faulty products. One way that can happen is through damages recovered through the civil court. Product regulation is another way. The market just isn't successful at self-regulating this sort of thing.

Not to threadjack, but... I really wish my government would put the effort spent protecting me from terrorism into protecting me from foodborne illness or injury from faulty products. I'm VASTLY more likely to have my lungs burned by grout sealer than I am to be hurt by anything a terrorist might do.
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Old 10-08-2007, 07:11 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ratbastid
roduct regulation is another way. The market just isn't successful at self-regulating this sort of thing.
Not only that, but market correction is generally reactive rather than proactive. These are the sorts of problems I'd rather take care of BEFORE people get hurt.
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Old 10-08-2007, 09:06 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Thankfully, Gov't intervention is rarely needed, and companies do take it upon themselves to perform voluntary recalls of dangerous products. They are aware how harmful bad press and a lawsuit can be. And, as hightheif pointed out, you would need to maintain a pretty sizable database at home to protect yourself against every known harmful agent out there.
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Old 10-08-2007, 09:29 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Just like with government regulation of workplace safety and waste disposal/management, govermental oversights of industry have always been enacted for a reason. Because industry's interests differ from those of consumers/employees/surrounding communities and the balance of power to cause change is very uneven.

I believe that government should take an active role in protecting US citizens from the excesses of industry at all levels.
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Old 10-08-2007, 09:39 AM   #7 (permalink)
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This is an excellent case against people who have a similar view to, say, Ron Paul, who tell us that government regulation doesn't work. Without the FDA, who's to prevent things like poison in food? While I recognize that the current incarnation of the FDA has very serious issues with inability, whether that can be attributed to gross misconduct, mismanagement, or simply not having enough funds and personnel.

I do very seriously believe that regulation of products is absolutely necessary, and that the corporations of the country and the world, if left to their own devices, would not regulate themselves. I do believe, based on precedence, that many corporations are satisfied to put profit above the welfare of not only the public, but their own customers. To anyone who would sell a stick filled with carcinogens and addictive chemicals that they know to cause cancer is proof in and of itself.
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Old 10-08-2007, 09:54 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Yea but cigarettes are cool as is evident by James Bond smoking.


Anyway, should there be more government control on food and other commercial goods? Maybe, a case can be made for it, but certainly the world today isn't Upton Sinclair's world. I guess then it's a matter of degree. What level of risk are you willing to accept vs how big of government do you really want? Some things are going to be risky no matter what. I prefer to accept the fallibility of manufactures of food and other products as one of those risks that never really goes away. So from my point of view it's best just not to think about it.
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Old 10-08-2007, 10:41 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Companies have a duty not to put hazardous products into the marketplace.

The vast majority of companies are responsible and accomplish exactly that. One thing that I noted as I read the article was the mislabeling. That is a big part of whether or not a product is hazardous. Wood chippers, for instance, are very obviously harmful products if misused. If, for instance, you stand on the loading bed of a running wood chipper and kick brush into it while a truck is towing the chipper down a road (3 HUGE no-no's in the user manual), then it is not the company's responsibility if all your family has to bury is a sponge.

Material Safety Data Sheets provide the expected results of human exposure to any given substance, from complex petrochemicals down to water. From the article, it looks like those were ignored by the manufacturer. That is a huge problem.

As for the recall, it was an uninsured loss (almost certainly), so no one stepped forward with the money to pay for it. Everyone drug their heels to get the other guy to pay for it, and more people got hurt. Bodily injuries are very insurable, and these folks all have actionable causes against Home Depot and the manufacturer, along with anyone else involved. It's interesting (to me) that Home Depot has a notoriously competent risk management department and that they didn't react better to this, especially given that it seems their name appeared on the product.

There are a number of product liability attorney's salivating over this. The ignored recall just adds to the projected payouts here.

In terms of government involvement, I think that the CPSC needs to be better funded, but that the first line of responsibility should still lie with either the manufacturer or importer. In my world of insurance (and this is very very close to what I do), importers are viewed as manufacturers unless a series of very strict tests are met. As an importer, you need to know whether or not the product you are bringing in is dangerous and what is in it. Not bothering to find out (I'm looking at you RC2) is just moronic, especially when the tests to do so are generally cheap.

I do not think that it is feasible for the CPSC to test every product in the US, and almost all testing, especially the best quality testing, is done by independent agencies (UL) or related-industry agencies (the Insurance Industry crash tests). Depending on the government to test and monitor every single consumer product, though, isn't such a good idea, although they should have the ability to follow through better than they did.
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Old 10-08-2007, 11:56 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by albania
Yea but cigarettes are cool as is evident by James Bond smoking.
That is a conundrum.
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Old 10-08-2007, 05:30 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willravel
That is a conundrum.
I don't think he's lit up in the last 3 or 4 films, mind you.
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Old 10-08-2007, 05:46 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highthief
I don't think he's lit up in the last 3 or 4 films, mind you.
Couple more films and they will have him channeling Allen Alda.
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Old 10-08-2007, 06:32 PM   #13 (permalink)
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i don't believe or trust the government all that much, so as far as i'm concerned, it's up to me to protect myself. the government doesn't care about me, and why should they? i alone am not a majority. when it comes to food, i'm sure the different food groups pay big money for their "scientific findings" to come out as they need to be ok for the government to say "yup, looks good to me." the term "close enough for government work" isn't just a pithy saying.

i've worked in the bowels of the government. i see the people who are government employees. i wouldn't leave my safety up to them no matter what.
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