CSflim

A question for all here. Do you agree with euthanasia? For those of you about to vote for the fourth option, euthanasia is "assisted suicide". It is when somebody, who is terminally ill, wishes to end their lives, peacefully, with little pain (e.g. be administered a lethal injection)

At the moment in most countries it is ilegal. Do you think it should be legalised?

Oh and "I'm not going to touch that with a 40 foot pole is NOT an answer!

CSflim

My personal opinion:
I hate to say it, but I agree with euthanasia, but only in very specific circumstances. First of all, the person must be of completely sound mind, and must fully understand what they are doing, otherwise there is absolutely no way it should be allowed. I agree with it if the person is terminally ill, and in a lot of pain, and the doctors can do nothing to help the person.

I think that the process of "applying" for euthanasia should be pursposely long and complex, with lots of bureaucracy and red tape! Just to ensure that the people who have applied really want it (need it?) and have thought long and hard about it, i.e. it is not just a whimsical decision.

Many people would say that eutanasia is murder, and murder is always wrong. My reaction to this would be that its not murder when someone wants you to do it. In a similar way its not stealing if you have someones permission (in that case its called recieving a gift, or borrowing!)

If your first reaction is to disagree with euthanasia, I would say to you this: Try and picture some person, probably very old, in a lot of pain, unable to live for themselves due to being bedridden, and enjoying absolutely no quality of life. Every breath they take is an extereme effort, and they know that the future holds only the certainty that things will get worse, and that the end will come in a painful and degrading way. This person wants to end the pain, go peacefully, with a little bit of dignity. Now look into their eyes and tell them:
"no. I am not allowing you to do this, but I'm on your side! I want to 'protect you'...killing someone is wrong, and always will be wrong, so sorry, you're going to have to live out your painful and undignified life, because of my delicate sensibilities"

One danger of eutanasia however is that if a person does become very ill, and can no longer cope on their own, and is instead completely dependant on others, that person might feel that they are too much of a burden, and might feel "pressurised" into opting for euthanasia.

Any thoughts?

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ARTelevision

Of course.
Who's life is it, anyway?

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spectre

I think CSflim summed up what I was thinking pretty well. If euthanasia was legal, it should be after a lot of thought and with a thorough review to be sure that there is no chance of survival.

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sixate

I have no problem if someone wants to take their own life.
If I ever got in an accident and my legs and arms were cut off I'd much rather be dead. That would reason for me to want to kill myself. Others have dumb reasons for wanting to die, but if they wanna do it then let them.

Loki

one wonders if you'll feel that way after said accident...imo, even a half life is better then no life.


Yes, on the proviso that the persons own wish that they should die, not the wish of money hungry relatives...

ARTelevision

well, by definition dumb people will have dumb reasons.
forget the careful review process.
don't impose your intelligence on people who think on a different level.

it's their life, not yours.

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sixate

I understand what you're saying art.
I just think that people killing themselves because someone left them is a dumb reason. I'm sure my reason is just as dumb to others. That's fine by me.

Macheath

Yes, but I think I'd have a nervous breakdown if I was the lawyer who had to draft the legislation.

It'll be hard enough for lawyers, bureaucrats and ethicists to figure out how to make it legal without religious imperialists breathing down their necks.

bullgoose

This is a very personal subject to me; during the past week, my 79 year old mother was diagnosed with Lymphoma, and it was a late diagnosis; it's spread to her bones. I'm aware, and so is she, that the chances of recovery are slim. I've said for years that death with dignity is one of the most important things in life; there's no dignity in the loss of control of body functions, the inability to communicate, lying in a bed racked with pain that so intense as to be indescribable. The argument that life is sacred just doesn't hold water when the real horrors of cancer take hold; I'll abide by my Mothers descision as to how she wants to deal with the situation, and if she needs help, I'll be there for her. What else can a child who loves his Mother do?

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rogue49

yep, if you're in incredible pain.
who are we to make you continue to suffer without solution?

JStrider

i agree with it... pretty much on all the same reasons people have mentioned before... the dying with dignity and all that...

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The_Dude

i look at myself in a situation like that.

if i'm real old, real sick, and no chance of getting better, i dont see a point of living in misery (just for the sake of living).

i'd rather be dead, and i sure hope that we legalize euthanasia before i'm old!

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ninety09

I can't find any reasons why euthanasia shouldn't be made legal.

krwlz

I dont think it is so much of a moral question as a politcal one.

I don't think that it is something the government should have any say in. Period.

So yea, I guess I am for it.

*Nikki*

Being that I work in a Vet Clinic I deal with Euthanasia on a daily basis.

Somehow though I will never be quite ok with a human being playing God.
That is just what I believe though. I have become almost desensitized to the whole experience. It is just another part of life to me.

phredgreen

i had a job where i used to deliver medications to convalescent and elderly care homes... i've seen people who have lost all control of their minds and bodies wasting away the last years of their lives, lonely and afraid.

fuck that.

i completely support euthanasia. i think it should have been instituted a long time ago... i know it goes against the hippocratic oath to never do any harm, but with new diseases and more prevalent life-threatening conditions, it should be an option. i think there should be specialists, just like there are anestisiologists and phlebotomists who can administer specialized procedures. i just don't feel that our resources are best spent on the dead and rapidly dying, and as the "boomer" generation nears the time when more catastrophic things can happen to them health-wise, i think that euthanizing should be a viable option for those who truly need it.

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CSflim

I think the reason why euthanasia will not be legalised any time soon, and the reason why there is no serious push among politicians or otherwise is simple: It forces you to face up to reality. It forces you to accept the fact that there is such suffering in the world, people want to live in a "perfect world", and in a perfect world there would be no need for euthanasia, and as such striving for a perfect world involves keeping euthanasia ilegal. Obviously, when it is put like that, it is very easy to see the glariny hypocracy of it, but you may be surprised at the willful ignorance of many.

I think also the christian ideal has much to do with it. I think that many people who do not accept the christian belief (God, Jesus, Creation etc) still accept the christian morality (In many respects, myself included) And that in itself is not a bad thing, as christainity could be summed up very nicely as "Wouldn't the world be great if everyone was nice to each other". It is however when you start taking the christian idealism to the letter that it becomes a problem.

BTW: I opened my personal response to the question with "I hate to say it", I didn't mean this to come across as if I was ashamed/shy of my opinion, but rather I meant it be come across as "I would prefer if it didn't have to be so, but unfortunately it is".

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billege

Yes.

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gibber71

Everyone in my family has died of cancer including both of my parents.If someone is terminal,it is such an individual experience. My mother was lucky in the sense that even though she suffered the wrath of such an unforgiving and undignifying disease,in the end she was only in pain for a week.I consider myself an areligious person,but when she died,I thanked God he took her fast. I think my answer can only come if and when I am in that position,and I hope I am coherrant enough to make that decision,whatever it may be.

WhoaitsZ

(Megedeth's Youthanasia. um anyhow)

I firmly believe in choice in all things that do not concern the physical harm to another living being.

if you wish to commit suicide, i have no right whatsoever to say 'no'. I also have no rright in telling someone that they cannot assist someone in said sittuation.

What our country has done to the good Dr. K is one of the things that occasionally makes my eyes cross with sheer rage.

i , myself, have pondered suicide in many different events and in different ways.

aftter getting the tracheotomy at the age of 17 i thought my life was over. all i knew for a very long time was pain and hate, yet I refused to give into suicidal thoughts.

i'll let that be the only example for now..

i need help doing almost anything, so unless i wished to OD i would be required to get assistance, which is a nono according to the law of nazis.

i know for a fact that many people who swear death will be the absolute sure answer to a sittuation they think they cannot live with is, in the end, complete and absolute bullshit . pure badass ego. i think that if you are cancer ridden or have a serious 'believe me you will die in six months bawling like a child in pain' illness and no family to turn to. you piss yourself, you can't do anything. You exist. You're fucking right you have the right to end it now. i commend these people with their beautiful strength.

and if you wanna commit suicide because you look different or some reason, go ahead. its your life, become a pussy if you want.

suicide is for the incrediably sickly weak or the immensely strong. the in between is most likely sheer cowardness.

CSflim

I think the point is that you won't be able to make that decision. the state has already made it for you. Eutanasia is not an option.

WhoaitsZ

... and why inform the state?

there are measures to be taken to ensure they have no proof.

CSflim

Thats true, but if someone dies of unnatural causes, you can be damn sure their's going to be a thorough investigation into it, and if you get caught....well you're a murderer.

And lets face it...do you think a bed ridden cripple is going to want to go throught with a staged murder? The whole point is to let them go painlessly and with dignity!

madsenj37

I am undecided simply because it depends on how far it goes. Like if you gave someone poison and they chose to take it, sure. But if someone has to have hands on in the killing then I do not think so.

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Craven Morehead

Sure, if I'm of sound mind and know that by preserving my life my family would suffer and bear the added cost of delaying my demise, why shouldn't I be able to 'cut my losses'? We already allow family members to 'pull the plug' in the case of a comatose relative, why shouldn't the patient be allowed to pre-empt that possibility by dealing with it on their own terms?

Besides if it were allowed, that doesn't mean you have to do it. But to have that option could minimize a tremendous amount of suffering for the patient and their family

BoCo

No way! Let them die when it's their time to die.

Otherwise it's murder!

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gibber71

Couldn't agree more.I hope that option is available if and when I need it.But then again if that option isn't there legally, it will still happen.

Willowsr

yes... It is my life... I get to choose...

Vayda

I completely support euthanasia..
I have worked around 8yrs now in a intensive care setting and have seen several patients die a very slow and painful death because family members as well as physcians are inable to let go. Its quite amazing with the medications and equipment we have nowadays how long you can actually prolong someones life dispite the quality.
Death is not easy for anyone to deal with and if you are still able to make a sound decision and know you are dying of a terminal illness then I believe it should be your right to say when you have suffered enough.

MrFlux

Yes.

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HiThereDear

Your right to die is as fundamental as your right to live. I can't believe people presume to tell others that they can't kill themselves.

Xiomar

One of the hardest questions I have ever seen. I don't know. Honestly. Before things changed, I would have said no. But after having to sit day in and day out with your mother, telling her it's ok... it's time to sleep now. I don't know. She had cancer and after it reached her brain... she started to lose her mind. Now... im not sure what my answer would be. I just don't know.

Daval

I agree with CSflim. well written post!

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Troublebot

Actually, I can think of one, and it's the reason I said no in the poll. Euthanasia is a slippery slope. If someone is dying of incurable cancer and, being of sound mind, decides they want to die, I agree completely. As many others before me have stated, it's their body and their choice.

Where it gets alot murkier is in situations where the person is severly handicapped, both mentally and physically. Parents or guardians can say "They were in pain and told us they wanted to die." Who's to say if they did or not?

Check out info on the disability activists "Not Dead Yet." They're an interesting group and can bring alot more information to this discussion than I can.

http://www.notdeadyet.org/

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mtsgsd

There's no doubt in my mind that it should be legalized. It's my life, my morals, and my ethics. To hell with what yours are! Now, if I decide to kill myself in a way that harms or brings risk to others, that's different, but something like what we're talking about here?

How can anyone say that you have no control over your own life?
When it lines their pockets that's when. Notice how it's perfectly legal for:
a Hospital to let you die if they don't think you have money to pay for treatment.
Lifesaving treatment/drugs to be withheld if you can't afford to pay for them.

BUT, if you do have the money, but are brain-dead or otherwise out of direct control of yourself, or simply terminaly ill, you or your family must pay thru the nose while you linger on.

Sorry for the rant. Just a peeve of mine. A kid in the Chicago area died a year or two ago because they couldn't find a hospital that would admit him. He died on the door step of a hospital while staff argued policy. He was unlikely to be able to pay you see. No insurance.

vermin

That's just the point. If you know you're dying, how likely is it that you're going to make a sound decision? Most likely you'd be clinicallly depressed (not just "sad", but emotionally unstable as in "psychollogically unfit to make a rational decision").

BTW: My religion teaches that suicides go to hell. If you believe in and trust in God, leave your time up to him. If you don't believe in God, maybe He's letting you hang on a little longer to give you time to find Him.

And for those in pain, there's morphine.

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joshibahn

I completely agree!

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Bill O'Rights

Yes, the U.S. has the best health care that money can buy.

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Certainly. Every man/woman has the right to decide over his/her life and death.

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