billege

Correct. Does the fact that black actors have recently won, mean that progress is not being made? Are we to discount the fact that they HAVE won, because they didn’t win earlier? I think if change is a process there must be a starting point.

I also think that Halle winning an Oscar has more impact than her winning a Source Award. If we assume that racism is still prevalent, it should follow that making progress in the mainstream should be the goal; if, that is, our assumed overall goal is an Equality. Which is something that must be in the mainstream for the definition of equality to be met.
To achieve that goal a group must affect the largest amount of people where they live. Blacks recognizing blacks does build support within the black community, which should be used to leverage winnings in the mainstream community.


Early Americans didn’t treat anyone fairly from the start. The Indians got screwed, the immigrants that came after got screwed, the Asians got screwed, and the Hispanics got screwed. The important difference was that most of the “screwies” were white, and thus did not get screwed as badly. Slavery is also a differentiating factor.
Since that is a factor concerning blacks in America, it should separate the treatment of blacks from other groups.
In all fairness, I think I can say that the white man <I>is</I> doing it on his own accord. It’d be fair to say that the establishment is still white. The establishment created and passed the affirmative action laws. Blacks protested, whites listened. Maybe we could be optimistic enough about this to believe that whites even learned, and changed. Maybe we could grab that progress with both hands and build on it. Would you say blacks did that? Where are your black activists now? Where are the mass protests? Why did the tide of change fall back?
I don’t know the answers to those questions.
After the 60’s especially, blacks made progress. Evidenced now by black Fortune 500 company CEO’s, etc.
Would you say that progress has stopped? Stagnated? Or, are blacks discounting progress made, ignoring what could still be done, and focusing on the past failures in the white man’s process of atonement?

I think that’s part of it.
Complaining about what didn’t happen is a waste for all of us. It deafens blacks to what could happen tomorrow; it deafens us all to what we could do; what we should be doing.

Yeah, it’s true.
I ask you, though, what do you intend to have happen?

I’ll agree that the starting line analogy is apt, but do you think the white man will stop running? Does Black America expect the white guy to take a Gatorade break?
I just earned myself a new job, with the degree I worked and paid for. Am I to give half my earnings to a random minority person? Maybe insist my new job be given to a minority?

Those questions are ridiculous for a reason. I’m trying to point out that no one can call a time-out in this particular race. I’ve got my mouth to feed, and I’ve got my wife’s mouth to think about too. There is just no way the race is going to stop so someone can catch up. The world does not work that way.

That doesn’t mean a time out isn’t appropriate, but there’s a big difference between what should happen, and what will.

I don’t know how to convince a white majority that they should give up. Especially because I don’t think they see themselves as “in this together.” I seriously do not think of any white guy, or girl, as my “white brother” or “sister.”

Please…that’s plain absurd.

I compete with anyone in the race with me because I must. If I stop, my white skin will not feed, clothe, or bathe me.
There is no "white america," there is just America. No white people I know consider me part of some white frat.

Well, yeah, America is doing what it has been doing. Except that statement is only true if you discount that blacks aren't slaves, they can vote, they can sue, they can be lawyers and judges, they can have educations, they have the honor of being the group to make our country recognize and pass civil rights laws, they have affirmative action laws, and they have more and more black leaders than ever.

Yeah, if you discount all the hard work YOUR fellows did, America is doing the same thing it has always done.
America is a bunch of people trying to feed themselves. I honestly don’t believe that the white Americans have put aside differences to keep the black man down.
I honestly hope that ALL our Americans can realize that we are one country, and it’s us against the world for now. If we intend to win, we’d BETTER work together.



I brought up progress, and I’d just like to make sure we all realize it’s something we have to do together. Thursday at work a black guy, in reference to a piece of power equipment I was using (and had set momentarily aside) said, “It’s black history month, I don’t give a fuck, I’ll take it if I want.”

While I realize this particular guy is an asshole, and not the black race, he sure isn’t helping ANYONE with that kind of crap comment.

I think I bring him up to remind us all that it doesn't require a special skin color to hold up equality.

__________________
I can sum up the clash of religion in one sentence:
"My Invisible Friend is better than your Invisible Friend."