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james t kirk · 11-26-2003, 05:47 AM

Ah yes, one of my favourite topics.

Financial irresponsibility.

First off, being Canadian, I have a bit of a different perspective then some of you. Myself, i am socially quite liberal. I believe in Government staying out of the morals business, I believe in our universal health care, in financing education (Canada spends more on education than any other G7 nation.) and I believe in foreign aid (not blowing them up) to the poorer nations because poverty causes anger causes violence which sooner or later bites YOU in the ass.

But economically, i am quite conservative. More so than most of you it would seem.

I do not believe in the concept of a free lunch. If you want something, you have to pay for it. I do not believe that governments should be running fiscal deficits, EVER.

Did you know that in Britain, it is virtually against the law for the country to run a deficit. Yep, it's called the "golden rule". Gotta like that one. Basically, it says that the government can not run a deficit unless that deficit is for investment purposes and will be paid back with interest. And "investment" is not considered to be the daily running expense of the country either. If the ex checker needs more money, they raise taxes accordingly. If they need less, they lower taxes. There is also no such thing as a "tax return". Once it's gone, it's gone.

In Canada, our gov't under a brilliant finance minister (recently elected Prime Minister) has eliminated our deficit and been running surplusses for the last 7 years. Prior to that (under the conservative corrupt government of Brian Mulroney), we had one buffoon after the other buffoon running bigger and bigger deficits each year, spending money like drunken sailors. We have now been paying down our debt even.

The US debt is now at all time records, and getting larger next year, and larger the year after that. Right now, every American household owes something like $125,000 in national debt. Allan Greenspan has repeatedly spoken out against deficit spending, but no-one seems to be listening. Right now, interest rates are at historically low levels. But if inflation rears its head, Greenspan will raise interest rates (he will have no choice) and this will have a HUGE impact on the interest payments the US is currently making, which will in turn require more taxes to go paying just the interest. It's the snowball affect.

What is rediculous is that Americans already pay the lowest taxes of any industrialized nation. Far lower in fact. Americans think they pay big taxes, but in reality, you don't. You just like to bitch about them.

Here's an intersting link with a comparison of tax rates...

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/001201.html

The reality of it is very simple, sooner or later, something will have to give. If you want all the toys, you have to pay for them. Running deficits is just short term thinking since the average joe is not even quite sure what it means, let alone feels the impact. All he knows is that with his tax cut, he could go out and buy a new colour TV.

I will bet you that a national sales tax will be coming to America soon. (That's what they did here.) They basically said, "we have a crushing debt load and this tax will be used to pay it off." (Well, that one is yes and no.) The one thing about consumption taxes is is that they are hard to avoid. Sure, you can pay the guy who does your roof cash, but for the most part, you pay the national sales tax.

As i said, there is no such thing as a free lunch. You have to pay for it sooner or later.

11-26-2003, 05:47 AM	#13 (permalink)
james t kirk Junkie Location: Toronto	Ah yes, one of my favourite topics. Financial irresponsibility. First off, being Canadian, I have a bit of a different perspective then some of you. Myself, i am socially quite liberal. I believe in Government staying out of the morals business, I believe in our universal health care, in financing education (Canada spends more on education than any other G7 nation.) and I believe in foreign aid (not blowing them up) to the poorer nations because poverty causes anger causes violence which sooner or later bites YOU in the ass. But economically, i am quite conservative. More so than most of you it would seem. I do not believe in the concept of a free lunch. If you want something, you have to pay for it. I do not believe that governments should be running fiscal deficits, EVER. Did you know that in Britain, it is virtually against the law for the country to run a deficit. Yep, it's called the "golden rule". Gotta like that one. Basically, it says that the government can not run a deficit unless that deficit is for investment purposes and will be paid back with interest. And "investment" is not considered to be the daily running expense of the country either. If the ex checker needs more money, they raise taxes accordingly. If they need less, they lower taxes. There is also no such thing as a "tax return". Once it's gone, it's gone. In Canada, our gov't under a brilliant finance minister (recently elected Prime Minister) has eliminated our deficit and been running surplusses for the last 7 years. Prior to that (under the conservative corrupt government of Brian Mulroney), we had one buffoon after the other buffoon running bigger and bigger deficits each year, spending money like drunken sailors. We have now been paying down our debt even. The US debt is now at all time records, and getting larger next year, and larger the year after that. Right now, every American household owes something like $125,000 in national debt. Allan Greenspan has repeatedly spoken out against deficit spending, but no-one seems to be listening. Right now, interest rates are at historically low levels. But if inflation rears its head, Greenspan will raise interest rates (he will have no choice) and this will have a HUGE impact on the interest payments the US is currently making, which will in turn require more taxes to go paying just the interest. It's the snowball affect. What is rediculous is that Americans already pay the lowest taxes of any industrialized nation. Far lower in fact. Americans think they pay big taxes, but in reality, you don't. You just like to bitch about them. Here's an intersting link with a comparison of tax rates... http://www.straightdope.com/columns/001201.html The reality of it is very simple, sooner or later, something will have to give. If you want all the toys, you have to pay for them. Running deficits is just short term thinking since the average joe is not even quite sure what it means, let alone feels the impact. All he knows is that with his tax cut, he could go out and buy a new colour TV. I will bet you that a national sales tax will be coming to America soon. (That's what they did here.) They basically said, "we have a crushing debt load and this tax will be used to pay it off." (Well, that one is yes and no.) The one thing about consumption taxes is is that they are hard to avoid. Sure, you can pay the guy who does your roof cash, but for the most part, you pay the national sales tax. As i said, there is no such thing as a free lunch. You have to pay for it sooner or later. Last edited by james t kirk; 11-26-2003 at 05:55 AM..