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miked10270 · 06-23-2003, 10:04 PM

Speaking as a father of 4 children I strongly disagree with Meridae'n's opinion.

It seems to be fashionable at the moment to insist that children are miniature adults. They are not. They simply do not understand the consequences of their actions or the effect that their actions may have on others. They have little sense of right and wrong and do not understand subtle punishments or attempts to reason with them.

As you may gather I have physically and verbally abused all of mychildren on occasion in the past. For example, one of my children, about 30 months old at the time would run out of the house, straight across the road to get to the playpark. Perhaps unsurprisinglyhe was a bit young for the whole Green-Cross-Code thing, and only leaving the house with his parents didn't interest him. All he would, could focus on was getting to the playpark.

Ultimately he did almost run out into the road in front of a car and I grabbed him, smacked him of his buttocks and screamed "DON'T" at him. I think that this was the point when he realised that Dad was serious about him not crossing roads alone.

ANother time, my 3 year old and my 4 year old were fighting over a toy (any parent will know how this works - the most desirable thing in the world to a child is the thing your sibling is playing with). I mean really fighting. I went through the telling them to stop fighting, shouting at them to STOP, and taking the toy away when telling them to stop had no effect. Of course, at that point both kids blamed the other for the loss of the toy and they started to exchange blows. I seperated them (physical abuse), smacked both of them (second count of physical abuse) dragged both of them to their rooms (third count) and "grounded" them in their bedrooms for an hour (add in a count of verbal abuse, imprisonment and mental torture).

Perhaps I should have just tried to reason with them while they were beating each other up?

ANother example was one of my daughters, then aged 6, in a VERY busy, crowded shopping mall who decided that she was going to run away from us. Again, this escalated from asking her to behave, to telling her to behave, to threatening her with the consequences of not behaving, to (on the fifth occasion she ran off and hid) to the preceding threat being carried out. I pulled her pants down in the mioddle of the mall, smacked her bare bottom twice, and pulled her pants up. I suppose that would be child assault, mental torture, verbal abuse and public humiliation.

My point is that there are times during a childhood that parents (or the adult with care) HAS TO GET PHYSICAL! There are times when it is in the larger interests of the child to link a transgression and the punishment directly in time and place. From a practical point of view the only effective punishment immediately to hand (no pun intended) is a smack.

I'm not proud of the times I have smacked my children, nor am I ashamed of doing it. I show them love and teach them social discipline. That's my job as a parent. To do that I must be consistent and never make empty threats or promises. Apart from the "road" incident, I had told my kids to "behave" or they'd be smacked. They didn't behave, and they were smacked. As a result of this, I'm proud to say that I'm frequently complimented on my kids' behaviour. I think that I'm doing it right, and i don't need the government or a bunch of bleeding-heart-liberals to tell me how to do my job.

My children are fully aware of the "Rights of the Child". I have explained to them that they "Have the absolute right to do as they are told"!

Mike.

06-23-2003, 10:04 PM	#2 (permalink)
miked10270 Banned Location: Scotland	Speaking as a father of 4 children I strongly disagree with Meridae'n's opinion. It seems to be fashionable at the moment to insist that children are miniature adults. They are not. They simply do not understand the consequences of their actions or the effect that their actions may have on others. They have little sense of right and wrong and do not understand subtle punishments or attempts to reason with them. As you may gather I have physically and verbally abused all of mychildren on occasion in the past. For example, one of my children, about 30 months old at the time would run out of the house, straight across the road to get to the playpark. Perhaps unsurprisinglyhe was a bit young for the whole Green-Cross-Code thing, and only leaving the house with his parents didn't interest him. All he would, could focus on was getting to the playpark. Ultimately he did almost run out into the road in front of a car and I grabbed him, smacked him of his buttocks and screamed "DON'T" at him. I think that this was the point when he realised that Dad was serious about him not crossing roads alone. ANother time, my 3 year old and my 4 year old were fighting over a toy (any parent will know how this works - the most desirable thing in the world to a child is the thing your sibling is playing with). I mean really fighting. I went through the telling them to stop fighting, shouting at them to STOP, and taking the toy away when telling them to stop had no effect. Of course, at that point both kids blamed the other for the loss of the toy and they started to exchange blows. I seperated them (physical abuse), smacked both of them (second count of physical abuse) dragged both of them to their rooms (third count) and "grounded" them in their bedrooms for an hour (add in a count of verbal abuse, imprisonment and mental torture). Perhaps I should have just tried to reason with them while they were beating each other up? ANother example was one of my daughters, then aged 6, in a VERY busy, crowded shopping mall who decided that she was going to run away from us. Again, this escalated from asking her to behave, to telling her to behave, to threatening her with the consequences of not behaving, to (on the fifth occasion she ran off and hid) to the preceding threat being carried out. I pulled her pants down in the mioddle of the mall, smacked her bare bottom twice, and pulled her pants up. I suppose that would be child assault, mental torture, verbal abuse and public humiliation. My point is that there are times during a childhood that parents (or the adult with care) HAS TO GET PHYSICAL! There are times when it is in the larger interests of the child to link a transgression and the punishment directly in time and place. From a practical point of view the only effective punishment immediately to hand (no pun intended) is a smack. I'm not proud of the times I have smacked my children, nor am I ashamed of doing it. I show them love and teach them social discipline. That's my job as a parent. To do that I must be consistent and never make empty threats or promises. Apart from the "road" incident, I had told my kids to "behave" or they'd be smacked. They didn't behave, and they were smacked. As a result of this, I'm proud to say that I'm frequently complimented on my kids' behaviour. I think that I'm doing it right, and i don't need the government or a bunch of bleeding-heart-liberals to tell me how to do my job. My children are fully aware of the "Rights of the Child". I have explained to them that they "Have the absolute right to do as they are told"! Mike.