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Borla · 07-22-2011, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plan9

Borla,

I used to think the 12g pump was the be-all-end-all of home defense. Hell, I own several “combat shotguns” from many of the major brands, including the Remington 870, the Mossberg 590, a Winchester 1300 clone, etc. Turns out I ended up sticking my foot in my mouth in front of people that actually know what they're doing because they shoot people for a living. After asking me where I got all my first hand knowledge (The Internets!), they explained the whole home defense weapon debacle.

Turns out a "quick Google search" of the Internet reveals that the "overwhelming opinion of serious gun owners" is based on bullshit... urban legends and the death ray mythology of the 12g pump shotgun. Simply put: these know-it-all, heard-it-from-muh-cuzzin motherfuckers have never shot any of these weapons inside a building (let alone their own house in the dark) and definitely haven't considered the weapon handling (movement with the gun such as pieing a room, opening doors) and manipulation (working the gun such as loading, fixing malfunctions) factors involved.

To avoid the overpenetration “...but I’m going to kill my neighbors!” issue, let’s start with the premise that ALL of the following rounds (shotgun, pistol, carbine) are capable of the FBI stopping power standard of 12” ballistic gelatin penetration. Now, you’re not going to find a round will reliably stop a bad guy that won’t penetrate, let’s say, four interior walls (8 sheets of drywall). The reason why this preface is important is because it is something many people don't understand. The simple fact is that ANY good home defense weapon can shoot through enough walls to be dangerous to friendlies.

12g Slide Shotgun:

* longer, heavier (harder to maneuver, hold single-handed)
* low capacity, awkward manual reload
* harsh recoil, slower follow-up shots
* easy to jam by short stroking under stress
* lacks precision accuracy for one-in-a-million shots

9mm / .40 / .45 Pistol:

* shortest and lightest option (easiest to maneuver, can be kept close)
* 7-33 round mag, easy instant reload
* quick follow-up shots
* semi-auto, simply pull the trigger
* precision accuracy for one-in-a-million shots
* not as steady as a long gun for follow-up shots

5.56mm / .223 Carbine:

* shorter, lighter than shotgun (easier to maneuver, hold single-handed)
* 20-30 round mag, easy instant reload
* minimal recoil, fast follow-up shots
* semi-auto, simply pull the trigger
* precision accuracy for one-in-a-million shots
* loud and may have a severe muzzle flash

...

Google "Box of Truth" and hit up M4Carbine.net for more evidence as related to the shotgun vs. pistol vs. carbine debate. The old 12 gauge pump gun may be the pop culture answer to home defense, but it's hardly the best choice. If you've never run a shoot house with a pump shotgun, you're not allowed to use urban legends and action movies as your reasoning. Shotguns are perfectly fine for home defense but if you can save for one, a service-caliber pistol or 5.56mm carbine may serve you that much better. A handgun is better than a shotgun for many of the reasons listed above.

IMO, nobody is so broke that they can't save for a used pistol or AR. They sure can make a lot of bullshit excuses, though. "Hey, not all of us have a thousand dollars to spend, smart guy!" Absolutely correct. I'm not attempting to suggest that everybody needs an AR at home to defend themselves properly. The 12g pump shotgun is great tool, especially if you're really familiar with it (and have had professional stress-monkey training). A SxS cowboy shotgun will work. A used police turn-in Glock 22 .40 is great. A S&W 10 .38 Spec will do fine if that's all you have. Claw hammer. Bear spear. Whatever works. The idea is that you want something with the least amount of limitations (see above comparison). You use what you've got, though.

One of the big things that really gets me, and I'm not referring to anyone in particular with this, is how people talk about their blue collar woes with their limited budget and yet have the newest gaming PC / console system, some ridiculous sportscar / sportbike, etc. They've made toys the priority in their life and then act totally shocked when someone tells them that they can't get a respectable self defense firearm for $150. I don't see a firearm as just a hobby, I see as just as vital as a first aid kit and flashlight (other things Civvie Joe Rambo forgets). What are your priorities? Budget accordingly.

In the end, the handgun is the most popular option because it works inside and outside the home. You can't open carry a shotgun or AR.

/rant from a guy that doesn't know jack shit

I always like when people argue over the internet, and one of their defenses is "you can't believe what you read on the internet".

In reality, few home invasion responses require things that are covered in your main points. Having 20 rounds is great. Having a gun that is accurate enough for a one in a million shot is great. But the reality is that whatever you are most comfortable with, can be accessible, and is reliable enough to go boom when you pull the trigger the first time or two is the best thing for you. Most random burglars cut and run at the sight or sound of a gun. They are there for a few bucks, some drug money, or easy profit, they aren't there to get their head blown off.

By a huge ratio, most folks (especially those not living in bad areas) will never have their homes broken into when they are there. By an even huger ratio, most invaders won't stick around to be in a fire fight. If you want to war game your house and be tacticool, fine, but the chances are massively in the favor of that just being grown up make believe and/or a hobby to have fun with.