Quote:
Originally Posted by ratbastid
So... Stereotypical gay men, right? You're saying they're duped into feminization at the hands of a segregational "orientonormative" culture? That's really interesting.
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Did I say that? Not really.
However, your interpretation is also valid.
What I said though is this ... Male femininity is a reality. What the society does is to give the space to love men to the feminine gendered male, and so these things seem related to us. So much so that the feminine gendered space is relabelled 'homosexual' and the masculine males are asked to take up the feminine identity if they want to like men. The masculine males don't want that and so they rather fight with their sexuality for men, to avoid being forced with the feminine label or space.
And I'm not even talking about stereotypes here. The gay space is a feminine gendered space. It's always been so, since times immemorial. So, its not wrong to stereotype it as 'effeminate.' What is wrong is to say that 'gay' also includes masculine gendered male desire for men. It is not surprising that in the beginning of human civilization, the 'gay' feminine space was more of a 'heterosexual' space. And that is what heterosexuality is in nature, 'queer.'
However, what you're saying is also true. When the society, through social engineering, makes it seem that desiring men = femininity, then men are pscyhologically forced to believe so. And you're what you believe. Although, its ultimate result is that the masculine gendered male is scared off from desiring males.
There are other factors that feminizes males when they get in touch with their desire for men in the Western system. For one thing, when a vulnerable youth is isolated in the effeminate 'gay' category either psychologically or socially -- in fact, the moment his sexuality for men gets too developed, he would start isolating himself from the mainstream, masculine gendered male group because its artificially made extremely hostile to intimacy between males. This would deprive the youth of an opportunity to develop his nascent masculinity and even if he is not effeminate, he would appear less manly, less powerful and more vulnerable than the average 'straight' youth. Formally walking over to the gay category has an even more feminizing effect. But, the society wants it that way.