Quote:
Originally Posted by Anonymous Member
I'm confused about the definition of Articulable Fact. On the one hand, you seem to say that articulable facts are sufficiently obvious for the average person to pick them out. Then later you say that the average person actually can't pick them out, that we need to rely on the expert opinion of the local police, who are certainly not immune to the failings of humanity, who are frequently considered credible by default by the legal system, who are certainly not immune to political and social pressures, and who are operating in a political environment which is overtly hostile to those suspected of being illegal.
|
It's not that the average person can't pick them out, it's that they simply aren't looking. It becomes pretty obvious once it's pointed out and is hard to refute.
For example, a cop notices a subtle bulge in the back of someone's shirt. It's not a predominant bulge, and the average person passes it over, usually because they aren't looking for it. But once pointed out, it's hard to say "there is no bulge." To a cop however, that could mean a weapon of some sort. Yes, it could mean a magazine as well, but that's why the cop would need other articulable facts to build up to reasonable suspicion.
Quote:
|
Please, again, "articulate" what exactly would make one suspicious of the legal status of someone in a way that doesn't unfairly single out Hispanics.
|
Quote:
In the case of immigration, you can have manner of dress (clothes not typical of area or dirty as if crawling through the desert), lack of english speaking skills (despite being in a predominantly english speaking location), location (eg, and area where illegal immigrants are known to be, travel through, or frequent), and attempting to avoid contact with law enforcement (many ways of doing that including in-your-face tactics).
Heck, even hygiene can play into it. But these are just examples, and there are a number of ways to build RS with articulable facts, as long as they are tangible.
|
Uh, wasn't that just done? Funny how you assumed hispanic based on these non-biased facts. (WAKE UP CALL, even CHINESE people can and do enter through Mexico, not to mention Iranian, Romanian, Saudi, and all others.) Not once was anything mentioned about race, color, or ethnicity. Keep in mind that these are just examples. Someone who does it for a living would probably be able to do a much more thorough list.
I don't understand how it could get any more 'fair' than that. Oh well, doesn't matter, because once someone is grabbed committing a crime, the law can and will then LEGALLY and CONSTITUTIONALLY determine whether or not other crimes, such as illegal immigration, are also applicable. But, you say, these people are "just coming here for a better life." Well, I guess they have nothing to worry about then. At least it will weed out the shitbags.