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Originally Posted by robot_parade
At least 1/3 of the people not covered (as estimated here) are not Americans - they're illegal (or 'undocumented') immigrants Can you even imagine the firestorm if the bill covered them??
Of the rest, they are people who aren't covered by the mandate because of a very low income - but these people are also the people who will get subsidies to buy private insurance. Even so, some people will not sign up - that's absolutely inevitable in any voluntary system, especially an 'opt-in' one - some people won't properly fill out the paperwork, some people won't just to be curmudgeonly, etc.
What we (evil commie socialist liberals) wanted was some sort of real government healthcare - essentially, in some form or another, everyone would have healthcare coverage.
Why don't we have that? Compromise! The conservative wing of the Democratic party (not to mention the entire Republican party) simply would not go along with government healthcare. So you get a compromise, that isn't government healthcare, and by definition will not cover all Americans, for the reasons I just stated.
If you don't like it, vote for the most liberal candidate for running for congress in your district in the next election.
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Of the many, many things I don't like about this bill. Few to none would be solved by the election of extremists on either side of the spectrum.
“H.R. 3962 provides that an individual (or a husband and wife in the case of a joint return) who does not, at any time during the taxable year, maintain acceptable health insurance coverage for himself or herself and each of his or her qualifying children is subject to an additional tax.” [page 1]
“If the government determines that the taxpayer’s unpaid tax liability results from willful behavior, the following penalties could apply…” [page 2]
“Criminal penalties
Prosecution is authorized under the Code for a variety of offenses. Depending on the level of the noncompliance, the following penalties could apply to an individual:
• Section 7203 – misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year.
• Section 7201 – felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.” [page 3]
Because the IRS has been deemed the collecting agency in this bill, if you do not have your MANDATORY insurance, you will be subject to tax evasion laws. Including, but not limited too; fines, jail time and seizure of personal property. How is that good for anybody.
You can argue that it's not mandatory, but you are required to have insurance or pay a 2.5% excise tax as a penalty. That sounds mandatory to me.
As for the illegals, there is very clear language saying they will not be covered. However, two things make that language useless. The first being proof of citizenship, not proof of identity being the determining factor for qualification. A huge number of illegals work under false identities. So all they have to do is show a fake drivers license and bingo, they have insurance. The second is the Amnesty law now in the works.
Why would you want government health care? I understand and agree with health care reform, it's needed. But what has the government ever done to make you think it can run anything efficiently? Or effectively for that matter? We are talking about a group of people who pay $1000 for a hammer. Who opted out of the very plan they require us to participate in. Who voted themselves lifetime retirement plans -both sides voted- equal to their current salaries with increases for inflation -Wouldn't you like to do that at you job? I sure would, but we can't because there's accountability in the private sector- and an insurance plan that we all should have, but apparently they are the only ones good enough to participate in, with our money. With this bill they created 111 new government offices and thousands of new government jobs -2000 in the IRS alone to collect for the new plan-, while simultaneously destroying 10's of thousands of private sector jobs -were we get our money-. Not forgetting, they are doing all of this with our money. They are not a business, they produce no tangible product, but they spend like drunken sailors, our money. And these are the people you want in charge of your health care? That's a joke right??
Say what you want about other models of Socialized medicine and government run programs. In countries where the government respects the people, they can work. Most are going bankrupt due to the inherent inefficiency of bureaucracy, some are not. But our government lost respect for us long, long ago and prove it openly on a continuing basis. They flat-out lie to us with smiles on their faces, when caught, they apologize and move on. Not fixing the problem, just move on. They vote themselves raises. They act as though they are above the law. They say anything they think we want to hear, to get what they want. Do you really think they have our best interests in mind? What have they done to suggest that?
If you want a good picture of how this is going to work go to any; DMV, welfare, unemployment, city, county, state or federal office. Take a number and imagine you have a serious medical problem while you're waiting. Good luck. Oh and by the way, after your visit, probably before you get out the door any and all fees will be electronically removed from your bank account.
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---------- Post added at 02:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:51 PM ----------
One day after the Senate’s mammoth, 2,700-page health bill became law, the Associated Press has discovered the legislation doesn’t deliver on a key promise.
Despite repeated assurances that the measure would provide immediate health coverage for children with pre-existing medical conditions, it doesn’t.
Just two days before the crucial House vote, at his nationally televised pep rally for the bill, President Obama promised: “Starting this year, insurance companies will be banned forever from denying coverage to children with pre-existing conditions.”
Meeting with House Democrats the next day, he forcefully reiterated the claim:
This year … parents who are worried about getting coverage for their children with pre-existing conditions now are assured that insurance companies have to give them coverage — this year.
You’ll recall that, on March 10, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi announced:
We have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it.
It seems even the president had to wait until after passage to find out what was really in the bill. Turns out, some kids with pre-existing conditions will have to wait, too. Another four years. The iron-clad guarantee of coverage won’t kick in until then.
Notes the Associated Press: “Full protection for children would not come until 2014, said Kate Cyrul, a spokeswoman for the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee…. That’s the same year when insurance companies could no longer deny coverage to any person on account of health problems.”
---------- Post added at 03:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:56 PM ----------
How is this bill going to drive prices down if it imposes a 2.5% tax on pharmaceutical companies, medical device manufactures and health insurance providers? Oh, and a 40% tax on 'Cadillac plans' -except of course for the government and union plans-.
So I guess if you do anything to support medicine outside of the government, you will be taxed -that will be passed on to the end users-. And if you can afford a better than the government plan, you too will be taxed -horrendously- for you ability. Yes you will be paying the tax as the end user passed on by the provider.
---------- Post added at 03:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:07 PM ----------
the CBO cost estimate looks at a 10-year window that includes 10 years of revenue collection but only six or seven years of outlays.