Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community - View Single Post - Obama expands hate crime law to include crimes against homosexuals

dippin · 10-28-2009, 11:35 PM

First of all, I am always amazed at how little people know about things that they like to speak so strongly about. Hate crime legislation is not based on race, sexual orientation, etc. of the victim, but on the intent of the attacker. So this BS about "a crime shouldnt be worse because of the victim's race, etc" is simply misinformation. Even in the strictest hate crimes legislations the determinant is not simply race, gender, etc. but the intent. That is, hate crime is not a white man killing a black man. It is a white man killing a black man because of his race. And penalty enhancements based on intent are already present throughout our legislation for other crimes.

And it is not only restricted to murder. And it is not only restricted to minorities. As long as one of the categories included there are considered to be the motivation for the crime, the person can be charged with a hate crime.

Hate crime legislation exists because an assault charge where one person beats up another because he cheated on poker is a qualitatively different crime than one where one person beats another solely because of the color of his skin, or his religion, or so on, and as such needs to be treated differently under the law.

Besides that, there are two additional important points:
- one, that has already been made, which is the recidivism rate. We've already have all sorts of stipulations for crimes where the offender has a high likelihood to re offend, hate crimes legislation recognizes that fact as it relates to race, gender, sexual orientation, etc.

- As much as people like to believe that we live in this abstract world where prejudice doesn't exist, the fact has been that our justice system is biased. In fact, prejudice has often been used as a defense, a mitigating factor in sentencing or in reducing the charge to a "heat of the moment" crime. The other day a man who killed a gay man was sentenced to 180 days in prison after using the "gay panic" defense.

So the whole point of the legislation is to address intent. We already do that when we discuss the different degrees of crime, the legislation merely adds something regarding prejudice.

10-28-2009, 11:35 PM	#21 (permalink)
dippin Crazy, indeed Location: the ether	First of all, I am always amazed at how little people know about things that they like to speak so strongly about. Hate crime legislation is not based on race, sexual orientation, etc. of the victim, but on the intent of the attacker. So this BS about "a crime shouldnt be worse because of the victim's race, etc" is simply misinformation. Even in the strictest hate crimes legislations the determinant is not simply race, gender, etc. but the intent. That is, hate crime is not a white man killing a black man. It is a white man killing a black man because of his race. And penalty enhancements based on intent are already present throughout our legislation for other crimes. And it is not only restricted to murder. And it is not only restricted to minorities. As long as one of the categories included there are considered to be the motivation for the crime, the person can be charged with a hate crime. Hate crime legislation exists because an assault charge where one person beats up another because he cheated on poker is a qualitatively different crime than one where one person beats another solely because of the color of his skin, or his religion, or so on, and as such needs to be treated differently under the law. Besides that, there are two additional important points: - one, that has already been made, which is the recidivism rate. We've already have all sorts of stipulations for crimes where the offender has a high likelihood to re offend, hate crimes legislation recognizes that fact as it relates to race, gender, sexual orientation, etc. - As much as people like to believe that we live in this abstract world where prejudice doesn't exist, the fact has been that our justice system is biased. In fact, prejudice has often been used as a defense, a mitigating factor in sentencing or in reducing the charge to a "heat of the moment" crime. The other day a man who killed a gay man was sentenced to 180 days in prison after using the "gay panic" defense. So the whole point of the legislation is to address intent. We already do that when we discuss the different degrees of crime, the legislation merely adds something regarding prejudice.