Thread: Ask an Atheist
View Single Post
Old 08-30-2009, 03:57 PM   #35 (permalink)
pig
pigglet pigglet
 
pig's Avatar
 
Location: Locash
I also don't want to jack will's thread, but I will interject to say that I've always had a slightly different set of definitions, after reading a bunch of theistic/atheistic agnostic/gnostic information a while back. To be clear, I agree that atheist/theist and gnostic/agnostic are two separate questions. In my understanding, the question of atheism/theism comes down to whether or not you can positively state that you believe in the existence of a deity/deities. If the answer is yes, then you are a theist. If not, then by default you are an atheist. It's really that simple. My difference with the above is on the definition of agnostic/gnostic. I've always read that agnosticism was more than saying that you don't know if god/gods exist, but saying that such knowledge is impossible to have. Gnosticism, would then be the opposite of this - saying that such knowledge is possible. In that sense, I consider myself to be a weak gnostic atheist. Which seems to coincide with the basic philosophy posted above as agnostic atheism. My stand is that I see no real reason to believe that a god or gods exist, but I think that such evidence is possible. If god or gods came down every so often and did some godlike acts, and imbued humanity with their presence, took a few people to heaven and back, and injected people with the direct knowledge that they / it were, in fact, God/Gods...you'd have more ground to stand on. Yes, you could think they were aliens, but I assume that something with the power to create the world, cause miracles, etc could get over this little logical hump. No bars would be barred for God/Gods, thus I think by definition proof could be provided. The fact that such proof is not provided, or does not measure up to questioning and checks of consistency, is the main reason that I am an atheist.

In response to the question about preferring to cower to a God's pleasure, if in fact I die and go to meet God/Gods...then I would say that one should develop their moral code outside of any perception of religion. Is it ok to kill people or not? Ok to lie to people or not? Should absolute power come with requirements of absolute mercy and responsibility to love unconditionally, despite the fact that humanity is not perfect, lacks full comprehension, and may have reasonable cause to doubt the existence of God or not? After making these decisions, I think one can determine whether they would support a given hypothetical God, and from that point of departure can determine how they might face God/Gods. I might be afraid if I were to meet God(s) after my death, but I don't think that would make my basic position any less valid.

Then there's always Pascal's Wager, which in a nutshell points out that you're better off stating your fundamental position regardless, because he's like Santa Claus. He sees you when you're sleeping, and he knows if you've been bad or good so be good for goodness' sake. You can't fake out an omniscient being.
__________________
You don't love me, you just love my piggy style
pig is offline  
 

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360