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Originally Posted by Strange Famous
MMA is a farce for a number of reasons I have laid out which have not been countered
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No it's just that you haven't been listening.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strange Famous
Lets summarise
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Yes lets.
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Originally Posted by Strange Famous
1 - It is cowardly to strike a man when he is down. No gentleman would do this in a sporting match
A - The MMA fans that some fighters find that lying flat on their back and being repeated struck is the best position to fight in and advantageous for them.
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Being repeatedly struck isn't advantages in any position, standing, or on the ground. However a BJJ artist has a large advantage on his back over someone who doesn't know BJJ.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strange Famous
2 - The fact that an actor is the MMA champion after a three fight and a two fight winning streak makes the sport look ridiculous
A - Lesner apparently was a good wrestler in college
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First off he has never been an "actor". Pro-wrestling, while fake, is still a very physically demanding job. Could most pro-wrestlers make the jump to MMA and be successful? No, only a very select few could. Kurt Angle (1996 Olympic Gold medalist) probably could have gone to MMA and done very well if it wasn't for the many injuries he has sustained in his prowrestling career. Lesnar is the EXCEPTION, not the rule.
As far as deserving a title shot, I actually don't think he earned one. But the champion at the time (Coutur) public stated that he wanted to fight Brock Lesnar because he thought that Brock was going to be the next big star of the sport.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strange Famous
3 - Even the best MMA fighters have many losses on their record, proving the random nature of a contest that is basically a scrambled brawl where the first person to get an arm lock on someone wins.
A - The MMA fans claim that it isnt the case that MMA is TO A DEGREE pot luck but claim it shows the strength of depth of the sport that even a highly ranked fighter like Kimbo Slice can be beaten by a man half his size who was visibly shaking with fear before the fight.
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I'm going to get back to this in a second via edit.
Okay first Kimbo Slice - not a highly ranked fighter. Kimbo Slice not even a ranked fighter.
Second okay lets look at some of the highly ranked fighters records and see how many of them contain these "many" loses you speak of. Then lets look at the actual loses and see how many came from a) matches against a current champion, b) matches against a future champion, or c) at the start of their career
Current Lightweight Champion - BJ Penn
Record 13-5
BJ likes to move up in weight classes which is his downfall. 2 of his losses have come against Georges St. Pierre (current Welterweight Champion). 1 of his losses came against Matt Hughes (then WW champion). 1 came against Jens Pulver for the Lightweight title. 1 came against future Lightheavyweight (yes BJ's a bit nuts sometimes and likes to jump around weightclasses) champion Lyoto Machida.
That were considered major upsets - Zero (possibly one when he was facing the much larger Machida).
Georges St Pierre
Record 19-2
Loss to Matt Hughes (then WW champion and considered one of the greatest WWs of all time). Loss to Matt Serra (considered one of the biggest upsets of all time)
Losses that were considered major upsets - One.
Anderson Silva
Record 24-4
All of his losses came early in his career. Since 2005 the only loss he has was by DQ when he gave Okami an illegal kick (Silva was winning the fight until this point). Since joining the UFC he has been unstoppable (btw he got a title fight in his second UFC fight because he was that dominant). If it's a crap shoot then why has he sucessfully defended five times (should have been 6 but Travis Lutter missed weight so it wasn't considered a title fight).
Lyoto Machida
Record 15-0
Undefeated
Fedor Emelianenko
Record 30-1 (1 No Contest)
One loss is a doctor's stoppage due to cut early in his career that was actually caused by an illegal strike and should have been a no-contest.
BTW the 1 No Contest was an accidental headbutt that knocked Nogueira silly. Fedor won the rematch.
There's the guys considered the top fighters in the world.
Combined record
101 - 12 -1 NC
With those 12
- 3 are early career loses
- 1 should have been ruled a no contest
- 1 was a disqualification due to an illegal strike
- 1 was BJ Penn (a lightweight) bulking up to fight a Lightheavyweight
- 5 were fights against champions/#1 contenders.
- 1 was an upset.
Clearly a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strange Famous
The fact is, I am not that strong or tough a guy, I havent trained a lot.
If I fought a UK level heavyweight boxer I would be beaten 100 times out of 100 - under the Queensbury Rules
If I fought a top 25 MMA heavyweight from UFC I reckon I would have at least a 1/20 chance of beating him. Without anymore than my natural strength (average for my size) and a basic instinctive ability to brawl to an average level, I'd win 5 out of 100 simply because I'd get in a clinch with the guy, and in the pot luck scramble I'd be th one to get the arm lock on (and the guys superior training in wrestling would give him a win 19 times out of 20, sure)
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Wrong. If you fought a top 25 heavyweight with no training other than your natural strength you would lose 100 times out of 100. The bottom rung HWs are either a) very effectient strikers with minimal ground game or b) very good ground game fighters with limited striking. The first group would KO you before you had the chance to even get close enough to take them down for an arm bar. The second group would gladly go to the ground with you when you, as an untrained amateur, would have a 100% chance of being submitted.