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Originally Posted by levite
The problem is that those who claim to have faith are far too cavalier about demanding it in those who do not, and those who do not have faith are far too cavalier in dismissing it in those who do. Frankly, I think it would be nice if everyone just decided that as long as everyone else acts like a mensch, what everyone else does or does not believe about a Supreme Being and the origin of the universe is of no concern to them....
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Well, as Rodney King said, "Why can't we just all get along?"
If we're not fighting over religion, we're fighting over race, or culture, or land, or money, or oil, or (soon to come) water.
So, don't just blame religion for mankind's inability to all get along. Even if we'd somehow totally eradicate religion from mankind (as militant atheists are want to do), we'd still be fighting and destroying ourselves over those other things.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantus
The biggest pitfall is that people tend to use words and concepts that are far beyond their realm of comprehension to illustrate concepts outside the realm of comprehension.
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Speak for yourself, and do not assume that all of us are unable to grasp concepts that are beyond the limitations of space and time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantus
Raise your hand if you just painted a mental picture of a bubble full of bright lights with a bearded guy floating beside it. That’s how I visualize Cyno's description of God.
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Yes, raise your hand and show everyone here that your imagination and your ability to think "big" is so limited, you cannot imagine God beyond an image of a bearded guy floating in the aether.
This is the main reason why God forbade the Hebrews to make graven images of Him, so that they would not limit themselves to carnal and temporal views of Him, and so that they could reach out past the earth-bound pictures and idols created by the polytheistic religions to represent their gods.
Furthermore, as wikipedia explains it...
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In a number of places the Hebrew Bible makes clear that God has no shape or form, and is utterly incomparable; thus no idol, image, idea, or anything comparable to creation could ever capture God's essence. For example, when the Israelites are visited by God in Deut. 4:15, they see no shape or form. Many verses in the Bible use anthropomorphisms to describe God, (e.g. God's mighty hand, God's finger, etc.) but these verses have always been understood as poetic images rather than literal descriptions. This is reflected in Hosea 12:10 which says, “And I have spoken unto the prophets, and I have multiplied visions, and by the hand of the prophets I use similes.”
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantus
But I can draw parallels with similar experiences. I know what it’s like to be outside of my house. Maybe finding God is like visiting your neighbor. Find a door at the edge of the universe. Walk though it. Stroll along the streets of limbo until you get to God’s crib. There you’ll see God watching the game and he’ll invite you in for a cold one.
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Whatever, dude.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantus
You may think I’m being an ass but it’s through these metaphors that most faith based systems are maintained within people’s heads. Using big words doesn’t make us understand the concepts behind them.
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I think you are smarter, and your imagination and your ability to think "big" is greater, than you're letting on, here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by biznatch
What I don't get is how believers of supernatural beings argue that they know something, for example, Cynosure's belief that god exists outside the Universe.
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Well, just for starters, God literally interacted with mankind through the Hebrews and conveyed this concept about Himself to them, which they passed on to us.