Originally Posted by Willravel

The US has not been "at war" since the 1940s. We have an authorization to use military force, but nowhere does that allow the torture of detainees, who are (in theory) waiting to be tried. The detainees are the same as a suspect being held by the police in that they've been captured but not tried or convicted. Until the person has been found guilty, it is not in line with established American principles present in our laws to punish them in any way.

If you'd like to be waterboarded under controlled conditions, I've done it twice now and had it done to me once.

You suffered. Suffering is mental pain. Mental pain is covered under the legal definition of torture.

Still, looking back, while waterboarding is intended to simulate drowning, it's much, much more disorienting, closer to being forced to drown upside down. It's a fairly unique experience. I'm serious when I say you need to experience it to judge it.

In case you're wondering, you need to put a plank of some kind into a bathtub, with the plank laying flat at the nozzle end and elevated at the opposite end. Lay down with your head under the nozzle, and have your arms and legs securely bound. Have someone you trust cover your eyes with duct tape and, as quickly as he can, wrap your face with cellophane and then pour several gallons of water on your chin heading downwards toward the drain. This should last 15-30 seconds. Because of the danger in the situation, you need to work out a signal of some kind that tells them to stop, and someone needs to be able to release you very quickly. I'd also suggest having someone trained in CPR on site just in case.

---------- Post added at 10:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:14 PM ----------


The world doesn't require torture for any reason whatsoever. It serves no function other than to inflict extreme pain. It has nothing at all to do with your erroneous idea that because the world is unfixable we shouldn't bother. From a purely pragmatic viewpoint, torture should not exist.

You don't decry it. You passively support it in making statements like "I'm fine with torture". You're not fine with torture even by your own words. You don't like it. You're not happy that it happens. I'll understand if your position is "I can't do anything to stop it", but that's not the same thing as "I'm fine with torture". I'm unable to do anything about AIDS in Africa, but I'm not even close to being fine with it.