Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community - View Single Post - Pope: distributing condoms "increases the problem" of the AIDS epidemic.

Cynthetiq · 03-22-2009, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ring

I believe that is why I hear a desperate hollow tone in the pope's voice.
I cannot believe he believes in what he's preaching. For all his
super right wing stances, there is a sad undertone to it.

Noone likes to have their beliefs violently stripped away,
be it the flat earth believers...and so on.

Noone prospers under the hamfist of any doctrine.

If I came to you with food,
it would be because you are hungry.

No God strings attached.

Strings are tricky things, though, they grow,
and it gets complicated.

...I still love the idea and symbolism of breaking bread.
What it means to me is fellowship with all my humanoid brethren.

I'm hungry. We are all hungry.
Let's eat.

I believe you see what you want to see and hear what you want to hear, just like I do.

The hamfisted approach seems to work for Orthodox Catholics, Orthodox Jews, Fundamentalist Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists. A dogma is a dogma. You either accept it or you don't. The leaders make the decisions. This is why things like the Council of Nicea I & II, Vactican I & II came to being, to help create and guide the dogma.

It's not much different than Marin Luther and his doctrine changes and accessibility to theology. His split from the church is not much different than any of the other Christian sects that split off from the Roman Catholic church, notably the Lutherans, Methodists, Anglicans and Eastern Orthodox. This is why many groups have different spiritual leaders instead of a single figure head.

---------- Post added at 07:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:14 PM ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by spectre

You're right, abstinence only is 100% effective, when people actually bother to follow it, which is relatively few. What's the harm is giving the option of contraceptives? Why not, "abstinence is the best way, but if you're going to anyway, wear a condom"?

As we've seen repeatedly in the United States with abstinence only programs, they just don't work.

Can we not go down the drama road, please?

But how can you truly have free will if you're automatically condemned as a sinner if you don't rigidly stick to the dogma? One of the things that always got me, and one that the priests used to joke about quite a bit, was that it's damned near impossible to follow the rules rigidly, because some conflict with others, and some are downright horribly wrong (father's being allowed to sell their daughters into slavery, stubborn/rebellious children are to be put to death, if a woman grabs the genitals of a man attacking her husband, her hand should be cut off, etc).

They were all spiritual leaders, granted, they were all batshit insane, but they're ideals led to the deaths of far fewer than the number that will die because of the pope's decree, and that's the part that's really fucked up to me.

You're already condemned as a sinner before you are born via Original Sin, the one that cast Adam and Eve from the Garden of Eden. By the dogma, you're salvation is in the belief in Christ and living a Christian life as written by the RC Church. We aren't talking about the rest of the fanatics out there. The RC Church has it's fucked up history, I'm not doubting that nor challenging that.

Understand that the RC Church cannot make a proclamation that condoms should be used. Like you said, it goes counter something else. No one at this time is prohibiting them from getting and using condoms. There's no Holy Army that is confiscating and destroying condoms.

People have choices, the pope makes his decree, and people think that that's the only choice that seems to exist.

That's the only choice that seems to exist for those that wish to follow the Roman Catholic dogma 100%.