Quote:
Originally Posted by Willravel
Bud: I do live in a high crime area.
Mac: The highest crime rate in the US belongs to Detroit. Violent crime was at 2,289 out of a population of about 860,000 in 2007. That means that you have about a 1 in 375 chance of being victimized. Of course the murder rate was only 46. So you have about a 1 in 18,700 chance of being in a situation where it's kill or be killed. Or are you going to shoot someone that tries to take $60 from your wallet?
Bud: Well they're putting my life at risk.
Mac: Not if they're just robbing you. The burglary rate in Detriot is 2,064 and the murder rate is only 46, so obviously even if you are robbed, you're probably not going to be murdered. Are you really going to kill someone for trying to take your wallet or trying to make off with your 24" tv?
Bud: What if they're not trying to rob me?
Mac: You mean someone just walks up to you and starts to attack you for no reason? How likely do you suppose that is?
Bud: I don't know. Are you saying I don't have a right to defend myself?
Mac: Not at all. I just want to know why you have a gun.
Bud: How else can I protect myself?
Mac: For the same cost as a handgun and a few rounds, which are built specifically to kill someone, you can get a better front door with better locks. Passive defense is still defense.
Bud: What if I'm walking down the street?
Mac: Have you ever had someone fill your eyes with mace? Have you ever had someone tase you?
Bud: Those aren't going to stop someone.
Mac: So you're saying that if you are the one out of 18,700, you're not at home or at work (where most people spend most of your time), you're in a place without a lot of people, and you're being attacked by someone who can't be slowed down by mace or a taser, then you want to use your gun?
Bud: Yeah.
Mac: Do you realize how unlikely that situation is?
Bud: Statistics don't matter. Crime can happen, therfore it will happen.
Mac: You said that before, it still doesn't make any sense.
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Ok Willravel...these hypothetical conversations are absolutely of no value to debate.
The responses from Bud are a little skewed, dontcha think? There are a couple of other so called facts in there that are debatable too. Looked up the violent crime rates, from the FBI/DOJ Uniform Crime Reports from 2004 (I don't know where you're getting your numbers from). I want citations if you want to talk about statistics (and to be honest, I think the #'s from your hypothetical conversation are somewhat suspect).
Detroit has 914,353 residents, and in 2004 had 15,913 violent crimes.
Baltimore has 634,279 residents and in 2004 had 11,667 violent crimes.
Detroit had a 1/57 chance of victimization to a violent crime. Baltimore had a 1/54 chance. So, if a person walks alone at 10pm on a empty street, 54 times a year, would that mean they would be subject to a violent crime? I don't know, but I don't like the odds.
(Statistics found at
http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_04/documents/CIUS2004.pdf).
In addition, sure pepper spray is great, but it only incapacitates if it hits mucous membranes, and would become less effective when faced with multiple attackers/robbers.
And yes, people have gone up to others and committed violent crimes for no reason. I think you remember the youtube video with the crackhead using a baseball bat on a car.
There's an old adage from gun owners--"better to have and not need, than to need and not have."
Just my .02 cents.