View Single Post
Old 07-05-2008, 05:44 PM   #4 (permalink)
The_Dunedan
Junkie
 
Quote:
I'm a big fan of the M1 Carbines, SKS and Dragunovs
Good picks all. The ammo situation might influence you towards the Drags or SKS, since it's still somewhat easier to secure 7.62x39 and 7.62x54R in quantity, although the 7.62x39 is drying up fast.

Quote:
I think I would actually prefer a Dragunov, but I find those extremely difficult to find - especially Soviet made ones.
Soviet SVDs are a collector's item, as import was stopped in 1989. They're worth about 3k, with the NDM-86 (Chinese Dragunov) being in about the same ballpark. Great guns and very accurate with the proper .311 ammo, but hard to find.

Quote:
Does any one have experiences with Romanian or Chinese made ones vs Soviet ones?
The Chinese NDM-86 is a direct SVD copy. The Romanian "Dragunov," known variously as the PSL and SSG-97, uses a long-stroke operating system and is essentially an oversized AK action, while the SVD uses a short-stroke system. The PSL/SSG is still quite a capable weapon, but is much easier and cheaper to find than the SVD, since they're still being imported. $800-1,000 should set you up with a gun, some mags, scope, and the usual accessories. Headshots to 600-800 meters are doable with the right ammo; my stepdad's likes the 200-grain Czech silvertip.

A word on SVDs and ammo: if you decide to invest in an SVD, expect ammo trouble. The SVD will not shoot accurately with regular 7.62x54R ammunition, which has a nominal bullet diameter of .308. The SVD was designed to use special-purpose ammunition with a nominal diameter of .311. Proper Russian sniper ammo is rare and expensive, especially the 7N1 (enhanced lethality) and 14N1 (Match-grade) loadings. For this reason, finding accurate chow for the PSL/SSG will be a much easier proposition.

Quote:
Likewise the same goes with the SKS, only shot soviet ones, so I'm wondering if other makes of them are worthwhile.
An SKS is an SKS is an SKS. Hardy, reliable, utterly soldier-proof, easy to maintain, and capable to 400 meters in the right hands. Russian SKSs are collectors items, likewise pre-ban Chinese units. But pretty much any SKS will do the trick just fine. My Yugoslav chugs right along and gets my hits at 300 yards, so I'm happy. For longer-range work I'd be going for my FAL in any case, and the SKS makes a great brush gun. Loads of folks around here use 'em for deer hunting, and it's turning into the 21st-Century's .30-30.


Now, for your requirements.

Value: By far the highest value will be a Russian SVD, followed by the Chinese NDM-86, the PSL/SSG, certain models of the M1 Carbine (Rock-Ola most especially) with the SKS at the bottom of the pile. The M1 Carbine is likely to hold its' collector value best, especially if you splurge on a WWII veteran.

Price: The SKS is the cheapest of the bunch, and ammo is still relatively easy to buy in bulk. An M1 Carbine can be had for $500.00 if you're lucky and aren't after collector value, but bulk ammo can be dicey to find. The PSL/SSG is easy to find ammo for, but getting more expensive. The SVD will be -very- hard to find -any- appropriate ammo for, let alone in stashable quantities, and will be -VERY- expensive in the unlikely event that you find someone willing to part with theirs.

Stopping Power: Any of the above will stop a gunfight. The 7.62x54R is nearly identical to the .30-06 ballistically, with the .30 Carbine being somewhat more powerful than a .357 Magnum fired from the same length barrel. 7.62x39 falls in between. 7.62x54R will be more useful in a hunting scenario, since it gives the greatest accurate/effective ranges and impact energy, while the M1 Carbine is the best-suited of the three for home defense, especially in an urban area or building with unhardened or unreinforced walls. The 7.62x39 falls roughly between the two extremes; useful for hunting (though I wouldn't try for an Elk with one) while being -less- likely to kill a friendly or bystander in a defensive scenario. Bear in mind, we're still talking a centrefire rifle here, so overpenetration IS GOING to happen. Unless you live in the country, of the three weapons you mention, the M1 Carbine is by far the best suited to home-defense.


Other Suggestions: Try out a bunch of different rifles. I love my FAL and hate the G3/HK-91/CETME platform, which several good friends adore. My Mom loves her bullpups which most folks hate. Find a budget, try lots of different rifles priced within that budget, and get the one you resonate with best. Shoot before buying, if possible.

In the home-defense realm, seriously consider a shotgun or handgun. Rifles are great, but that old myth about sheetrock breaking up .223 bullets is just that, a myth. Even frangible varmint loads will still blow through several sheetrock walls with little difficulty unless they hit a stud. If you live in an urban area, or just in a building with thin walls and close neighbors, a weapon which offers -less- overpenetration is something to seriously consider.

Finally, get a .22. Get four or five. You can never have too many .22's, especially with the cost of ammo being what it is.
The_Dunedan is offline  
 

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360